Questions for 9/11 Truthers

[volatile]

*double take*

Did someone just try to support their 911 conspiracy by invoking LEE HARVEY OSWALD?!

Did they? Really? Lee Harvey Oswald? Or have I drunk more than I thought?

 

[Kiwiwriter]

No, you're not drunk yet...

*double take*

Did someone just try to support their 911 conspiracy by invoking LEE HARVEY OSWALD?!

Did they? Really? Lee Harvey Oswald? Or have I drunk more than I thought?

But our resident Twoofer is.

Yup, he linked Lee Harvey Oswald to 9/11.

So now we know why JFK and JFK Jr. were whacked.

They knew too much about 9/11.

Must have something to do with "North Woods," I guess. Or maybe Anna Nicole Smith and her two talents.

 

[twinstead]

Did they? Really? Lee Harvey Oswald? Or have I drunk more than I thought?

You may be right, but for me at this time of night on a Friday, the "have I drunk more than I thought" theory is usually the correct one.

 

[AZCat]

I guess someone's working on the meta-conspiracy theory. Next we'll hear that the purpose behind the REAL Pearl Harbor was to enable PNAC to reference it in the document they wrote fifty years later.

 

[Parsman]

The Plan!

I guess someone's working on the meta-conspiracy theory. Next we'll hear that the purpose behind the REAL Pearl Harbor was to enable PNAC to reference it in the document they wrote fifty years later.

Well duh! Of course the time travelling aliens from Roswell that have their HQ in Area 51 would be able to let their mind controlled reptiloid agents travel in time to stage the Boston Tea Party so we could have Pearl Harbour and let the NWO take charge after 9/11 by sacrificing owls in Bohemian Groves. People, you know it makes sense....

 

[beachnut]

Why do truthers fail to see Loose Change as a red flag proving it fiction?

Why do truthers trust Dylan who tells you his LC video was fiction? Why are people fooled?

Dylan tells us about his video, this should be a red flag, -

It was that month that I began writing "Loose Change," a fictional story about my friends and I discovering that September 11th was not a terrorist attack, but rather, an attack by their own government.

The real question, is Dylan really dumb enough to believe his own fiction, or is Dylan happy his fiction is making him money? $$$

Why do truther not see, as in this video where the key to all LC is at 6:13, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFNVHiipStQ, the LC video are fiction/fraud. Do not go to 6:13 if you believe in LC.

Why would Dylan say-

... "Loose Change," a fictional story ...

Anyone who can research 9/11 will clearly see Loose Change is a fictional story. Even Dylan told you in the beginning

... "Loose Change," a fictional story ...

When will Dylan stop telling lies?

... "Loose Change," a fictional story ...

See, he use to tell the truth! What has changed?

 

[A-Train]

NO, NO, no, the planes were 757/767 no exit in the bottom back. Did someone hit you with a dumb stick?

The passengers would have told us on the seat phones.

The hijackers did not have parachutes.

It is hard to impossible to exit at 300 to 500 mph from the doors; have you ever tried.

Did I say no parachutes.

NO parachutes. Should I say again no one had parachutes on the plane.

You have actually come up with the most ridiculous idea I have see yet, or at least as good as a beam weapons.

The best dumb original idea today. Good Job.

Actually, it appears skyjumping out of an airliners is something that is done all the time.

Here is an interesting quote from Warrior Soul: Memoir of a Navy Seal by Chuck Pfarrer page 5. (Random House 2004):

"Jumping out of commercial airliners is an operation, or op, we call a "D. B. Cooper." Using scheduled air traffic to insert into a hostile country, or a denied area, is a SEAL specialty.

Most people do not parachute on purpose from jet aircraft. The planes are too fast, and the turbulent air dragging in their wake can snap your spine and pop your hips from your pelvis. We were trained to jump from commercial airliners because they are ubiquitous and nonattributable. It is one thing to prohibit American military aircraft from flying over your country. It is quite another to close down your airspace to all commercial traffic. Libya, Syria, Cuba, and a host of other thug nations allow commercial flights to fly through their airspace. This is all the opening a SEAL Team needs. Unknown and unseen, a SEAL element can parachute into any place on earth. One might insert: that is, provided one survives the jump. The trick is to exit in correct body position and deploy your parachute after the appropriate delay. There are two principal types of SEAL parachute operations: HALO, or high altitude, low opening; and HAHO, high altitude, high opening.

In a HALO drop, you exit the aircraft at 35,000 feet on oxygen and open your parachute low, at 2,000 feet, to avoid detection. A jumper falling at terminal velocity, roughly 120 miles an hour, would scream in for a full three minutes before opening his parachute.

In a HAHO drop, jumpers exit the aircraft above 35,000 feet, but their parachutes are deployed after a brief delay, maybe three seconds, opening high instead of low-sometimes literally in the jet stream. The team floats under canopy at 33,000 feet, then groups together and glides in formation toward the target.

At six and a half miles up, the MT-1-X parachute has a thirty-knot forward airspeed, and you can cover a lot of miles before you ever see any dirt. Depending on the winds aloft, a jumper can touch down twenty or thirty miles from where he exited the aircraft. It's a good way to drop into a place where you are neither expected nor welcome."

Pfarrer also tells an anecdote about his last jump, including this:

"As the flight attendants closed the doors and made ready for departure, I found my seat and managed to push my duffel into the overhead rack. I had definitely exceeded the recommended dimensions for carry-on luggage. Concealed in my bag was an MT-1-X military parachute."

Interesting, eh?

 

[Kiwiwriter]

Hmph, he's back...

And still hasn't answered my questions about his views on Jews.

 

[Firestone]

And still hasn't answered my questions about his views on Jews.

No, he hasn't, and probably never will.

But he has bolstered my Jewish self-esteem to unknown heights!

Just imagine how clever we Jews are.

10 Jews parachuted on 9/11 somewhere near New York City, five others near Washington DC, AND NO ONE SAW ANYTHING!!! Aren't we clever, Kiwiwriter?

(It begs the question: is there no limit to how stupid these theories can be??? )

 

[JimBenArm]

No, he hasn't, and probably never will.

But he has bolstered my Jewish self-esteem to unknown heights!

Just imagine how clever we Jews are.

10 Jews parachuted on 9/11 somewhere near New York City, five others near Washington DC, AND NO ONE SAW ANYTHING!!! Aren't we clever, Kiwiwriter?

(It begs the question: is there no limit to how stupid these theories can be??? )

Man, sometimes I wish I was Jewish, so I could be cool, too!
You guys get all the best nutjobs!

 

[A-Train]

And still hasn't answered my questions about his views on Jews.

I've never met a Jew I didn't like.

 

[beachnut]

Actually, it appears skyjumping out of an airliners is something that is done all the time.

No there is no exit for that on 757/767. You must be challenged to research this. No exit on a standard passenger 757/767 that would not injure a jumper at cruise speed on 757/767.

You must not be using you head; you must present facts; not stuff you make up in you mind. Try again.

 

[beachnut]

It is not my obligation to prove that they are alive. You are contending they were on the plane. You must prove that. You have never done so and never will. You will never be able to prove these alleged al-Qaeda men were actually on the plane. All you have is circumstantial junk like taped "confessions" on al-Jazeera and the word of the 9/11 Commission. The boarding gate video footage that would show us all who the hijackers are has mysteriously disappeared into thin air-- if indeed it was ever made.

I am working on the best information I have, which shows that several of they alleged hijackers are still alive in the Middle East and have stories of visiting the US and having their pockets picked there. Then you say these men are dead and I am supposed to fly to Saudi Arabia to prove to you they are still alive! That's like being accused of a crime and going to the Judge and saying, "You can't prove I'm guilty." To which the Judge replies, "Can you prove you're not?"

Whether they are alive or not in the Middle East is not crucial to my argument. You have failed to prove that the hijackers are who you say they are. I contend they were not the Arabs whose name was printed on their tickets. I have just as much proof they are who I say they are as you have proof they are who you say they are.

No actuall you have to prove it; There is DNA proof; video proof, passenger manifest proof, witness proof. You have to prove all of this is wrong to prove your point. You have wasted 5 years and you have zero proof. You have failed to prove anything in 5 years. 5 years of failure.

5 years and you will never disprove the evidence. Sad for you. Too bad for you.

Why? The proof they did it is old now. You missed the train.

 

[A-Train]

.10 Jews parachuted on 9/11 somewhere near New York City, five others near Washington DC, AND NO ONE SAW ANYTHING!!! Aren't we clever, Kiwiwriter?

Who says it had to be near the cities? If the hijackers bailed out of the planes with parachutes-- and that's a big if-- they could have done it:

-in the Hudson River valley, somewhere South of Albany (AAL11)

-along the Pennsylvania/New Jersey border (UAL175)

-West Virginia/Virginia (AAL77)

-West of Pittsburgh, eastern Ohio

All rural areas, perhaps near an area where recreational skyjumpers are a common sight. Who was looking up at the skies for hijackers at 8-9 in the morning on 9/11? Were you?

We have nothing putting the hijackers still on the flights in the last 10-15 minutes of each. Except for the CVR from FL93, that of "Allah o Akbar" fame, which I consider suspect.

How many bodies were recovered at Shanksville? Only forty? What happened to the other four?

 

[beachnut]

Who says it had to be near the cities? If the hijackers bailed out of the planes with parachutes-- and that's a big if-- they could have done it:

-in the Hudson River valley, somewhere South of Albany (AAL11)

-along the Pennsylvania/New Jersey border (UAL175)

-West Virginia/Virginia (AAL77)

-West of Pittsburgh, eastern Ohio

All rural areas, perhaps near an area where recreational skyjumpers are a common sight. Who was looking up at the skies for hijackers at 8-9 in the morning on 9/11? Were you?

We have nothing putting the hijackers still on the flights in the last 10-15 minutes of each. Except for the CVR from FL93, that of "Allah o Akbar" fame, which I consider suspect.

How many bodies were recovered at Shanksville? Only forty? What happened to the other four?

Not even possible on 9/11. Sorry your bailout did not happen there is proof you have ignored; try again. Do over. (BTW you debunked yourself; you are funny)

The list of proof is too long to go over. Buy the book.

One entry will be the FDR data shows flight 77 was hand flown into the Pentagon. Sorry but there is so much proof against your ideas it is a waste of time to answer your posts. But I was just pointing out one of countless bits of data to prove your ideas wrong. If you apply the same level of research to your life you must be disappointed a lot.

 

[gumboot]

Long history of Arab terrorists hijacking planes? Is it possible some of them were false-flags as well?

Yes, the US/Israeli government hijacked all of the aircraft ever, and made you think it was Arabs, so on 9/11 you would accept it was Arabs. Makes perfect sense...

Anyway, 9/11 wasn't just some hijackings. They successfully entered the US and penetrated airport and airline security.

In 1998, in an effort to assess airport security, the FAA assembled groups it called "Red Teams". These Red Teams went to various airports around the US and tested airport security by trying to smuggle banned objects onto flights. Their success rate was shockingly high. They managed to smuggle on anything you can imagine, including hazardous materials, bombs, firearms, and rocket launchers.

After these alarming discoveries the FAA issued guidelines to airports, but nothing was made mandatory. There is no evidence that airports followed the FAA suggestions.

Yes... that's right. Three years before 9/11 FAA personnel succeeded in smuggling ROCKET LAUNCHERS onto US flights from US airports.

I'm sure the 9/11 hijackers had no problems with some knives and fake bombs.

They then simultaneously hijacked four airplanes

They didn't, of course. There were different hijackers on each plane, and they were hijacked at different times. Not that synchronising attacks is that difficult a thing to do - indeed it's an Al Qaeda trademark. See, there's this neat little invention called a WRIST WATCH...

overcoming the crews of each so efficiently that not one of the eight pilots was able to broadcast a distress signal of any kind

You've obviously never been into the cockpit of a 757 or 767, and you've obviously never read the ATC transcripts that include the transmissions from the cockpits that let ATC Controllers know something had happened.

-- and they did this supposedly with only knives, which they somehow smuggled on board.

Knives, fake bombs, and mace or pepper spray.

Then they piloted the three of the planes with pinpoint accuracy to their targets

CTers have a very funny notions of "pin point accuracy". Frankly I thought there flying was fairly sloppy.

, evading American air defense in the process...

Well, we've already addressed this in another thread. Suffice to say, there was no air defense for an attack originating inside the USA.

-Gumboot

 

[A-Train]

No actuall you have to prove it; There is DNA proof; video proof, passenger manifest proof, witness proof.

DNA proof? Even if there is DNA proof someone was on the plane, it can't prove he was a hijacker.

video proof? There is none. You've been fooled.

passenger manifest proof? Which manifest? There are dozens.

witness proof? You mean the passenger phone calls? This proves the hijackers were "Middle Eastern," but from which country?

Now who is making stuff up out of his mind. At least I know when I am dealing with fact and when I am speculating.

 

[Sultanist]

Oh my. Someone please shed some light on this one for me.

I happened across this post over in the tinfoiler forum...
http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=78

As you see, it's a diatribe about the Pentagon light poles.
But as you keep reading, you get to this part which is about the cab driver which had one of the light poles land on his cab. And this photo is being provided of the passenger seat of his cab which is showing David Icke's book about reptilians shape shifters lying on the seat...
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a327/lytetrip/pentagon trip/Picture033resized.jpg

And yes, that is indeed David Icke's book...
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a327/lytetrip/pentagon trip/icke.jpg

Now here's the fun part. In this same post, the poster is saying that he and Dylan Avery himself were working together when they discovered this.

So the question becomes, is Dylan Avery actually endorsing this? That the photo showing Icke's book on the seat of that cab is legitimate?

 

[gumboot]

"Everything else" the same as before? I don't recall there ever being an Arab double hijacking, much less a quadruple one.

These Arabs certainly felt they were capable of hijacking multiple flights.

Oplan Bojinka was a planned large-scale attack on airliners in 1995.

The term can refer to the "airline bombing plot" alone, or that combined with the "Pope assassination plot" and the "CIA plane crash plot". The first refers to a plot to destroy 11 airliners on January 21 and 22, 1995, the second refers to a plan to kill Pope John Paul II on January 15, 1995, and the third refers a plan to crash a plane into the CIA headquarters in Fairfax County, Virginia and other buildings. Oplan Bojinka was prevented on January 6 and January 7, 1995, but some lessons learned were apparently used by the planners of the September 11 attacks.

The money handed down to the plotters originated from Al-Qaeda, an international Islamic militant organization which was then based in Sudan. Philippine authorities say that Operation Bojinka was developed by Ramzi Yousef and Khalid Shaikh Mohammed while they were in Manila, Philippines in 1994 and early 1995.

Source

My original point on this thread was that neither al-Qaeda nor any other Arab group had the means to pull of 9/11. I maintain that the 9/11 hijackings were far more complex to be compared to any Arab hijacking in the past.

All 9/11 required was 19 hijackers, a handful of knives, some fake bombs, an airline timetable, a bit of a play on Microsoft Flight Simulater, some rudimentary flight training skills, and a bit of luck.

Heck, I myself have had ALL of the above factors, and I'm not even trying to hijack an aircraft!

You're talking about a bunch of people who drove the SOVIET ARMY out of Afghanistan.

Getting knives on board is no easy feat. And they were not legal-- nor were boxcutters-- despite what you may have heard. Getting guns on a plane is obviously a hundred times more difficult than that, and is probably impossible without inside connections in the airport security apparatus.

Remember those FAA rocket launchers?

-Gumboot

 

[gumboot]

Actually, it appears skyjumping out of an airliners is something that is done all the time.

I like how you state that this happens all the time, and then as evidence show that highly trained specialist special forces soldiers sometimes use this highly risky and dangerous tactic for some missions.

-Gumboot