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public want sCAM

To be fair, it mostly seems to say that they want information.
Dr Terry John, spokesman for the charity, said: "Patients and health professionals are crying out for more information on complementary medicine.

"It is crucial that health professionals have information to hand when necessary, and likewise patients need the necessary information to make informed choices about their treatment."
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I would have thought you might have been able to give them that quite effectively, actually!

Rolfe.
 
True - information: yes.....
sCAM recommendation: no

I did slightly misread the article - its late in the day.

But a separate poll of 100 GPs found only just over half (52%) of family doctors routinely asked patients about their use of complementary medicine, with 47% saying they believed they should not be the ones providing information and advice on the subject.
Some 85% said they did not have enough information about the safety and efficacy of complementary medicines.

I think GPs should be more proactive and ask patients about the issue. If they don't feel up to the job that is another matter - they should inform themselves better as to what consequences there may be. I think they all know about the main issues such as interactions with St Johns wort, but there is a lot of other stuff they need to know.

Presumably they have enogh time trying to keep up with orthodox developments in drug therapy, never mind learning about all possible alt meds.

I suspect most GPs are happy not to raise the issue, because there is only 7-8 minutes during the consultation to address the main complaints, never mind waffling about woo stuff.
 
I'm all for more information ... a lot of the woo stuff only survives because of the widespread misconceptions of the public (and even some GPs as to what it is really about.
 
My anti-sCAM GP friend says she quite often has patients come in and start to tell her about the alternative remedies they're taking, because the press and the sCAM-artists keep saying, tell your doctor to make sure there are no cross-reactions or anything.

She says, how the hell should I know, there's no documented evidence about any of that stuff, no information or studies about contraindications or interactions for me to look at. So why bother telling me?

Personally, I think it's all a ploy to get some sort of official recognition - I mean, if you're told you need to tell your doctor about it, it must be heap powerful medicine, right? And if the doctor is too polite or too diffident to say, it's all a scam, then the doctor has approved it, OK? So it must work then! (And if the doctor does say, stop taking that filthy snake-oil, you've no idea where it's been, then there's another closed-minded allopath to bash. You can't lose.)

If only GPs did have the real dope on all that dope! Most of them aren't daft.

Rolfe.
 
I honestly wonder how many GPs keep their mouths shut just to avoid having to spend time debating their patients.

I also wonder how many GPs assume that "alternative" medicine is harmless, therefore why argue?
 
I think you're onto something there. I've a few woo-ish friends, and my own tendency towards chiropractic.

I've noticed all the alt-med treatments end with a little speech on "drink plenty of water, avoid alcohol and strenuous activity this evening". Maybe I'm being excessively sceptical, but I've thought for a long time that was all about sounding medical.
 
Not only that, but eat healthy and exercise. Woos quite often claim a doc will push meds instead of giving this advice. That has to be one of the biggest lies I've ever seen. Any doctor I know will tell everybody to stop eating excessively and to exercise more. Do people listen? No. Then they get diabetes etc. and will die without "allopathy".

I don't see why there isn't more information about how the sCAM is unregulated, based on impossible claims, etc. and why.

Somebody write a series of books, and make some money at the same time. Woos do it all the time. Heck, half the information on these forums would make a great read for the masses. Actually seeing some useful prose out there would be heartening. Controversay sells. Use a title like "What your homeopath doesn't tell you".

A lot of bright folks with the background have the time to write here, put some down on paper too.
 
A bit the like the sCAM claims of 'Holistic' treatment and 'treating the cause not the symptom'.

I am really not prepared to accept the good GP or consultant is failing to do either of those things. Most sCAM practitioners, on the other hand, do not even understand what the two phrases really mean and trot them out to sound nice.

Setting up a false dichotemy, methinks.
 
"What your homoeopath doesn't tell you"

Fantastic idea Eos. I am sure the main players here could compile a well referenced, easily-digestible handbook, and I am sure it could find a publisher.
 
Originally posted by Deetee
"What your homoeopath doesn't tell you"

Fantastic idea Eos. I am sure the main players here could compile a well referenced, easily-digestible handbook, and I am sure it could find a publisher.
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Not just that you know, LEAFLETS: an official looking brochure (just like the sCAMmers do themselves). Then just leave them any place remotely related to health care (most notably, doctor's waiting rooms, hospitals, Pharmacies, ...).
Watch as people get educated and realize what a load of bollocks it really is.
 
I don't oppose the idea so much. The quacks would have to pay to post their nonsense (in response to the articles). So what? It wouldn't change much, would it?

More quack nonsense arguments:

Western medicine is becoming a global business
in which billions of dollars are invested, so it may seem unlikely that corporate interests will support any alternative medicines, especially if they are cheap and easy. Corporate interests will support whatever makes them money, and there is a global tourist industry today for rich people to get heart-bypass operations and other surgical procedures from Europe to the Persian Gulf.
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http://www.ssr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?1:mss:92380:200411:mhpcicjhfmemgmlflepk
 
Originally posted by Eos of the Eons
I don't oppose the idea so much. The quacks would have to pay to post their nonsense (in response to the articles). So what? It wouldn't change much, would it?
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That's assuming they'd only charge if you wanted to WRITE something.
When they mention charging for access, my first thought would be charging for ACCESS, which includes reading. And that would definitely be a bad thing ...
 
I don't think that's a bad thing. What I meant was that not only would the woos also have to pay to read, they would have to pay to post their idiotic responses after reading.

If they can't read it they can't misquote the articles and post their responses as "published".

Thing is, most are so obsessed that they will pay. Then BMJ benefits. Nothing wrong with that. BMJ should be paid to put up with the nonsense.

I won't pay, but I rarely go there anyway. Other serious folk will pay though, I'm sure.
 
Originally posted by Eos of the Eons
I don't think that's a bad thing. What I meant was that not only would the woos also have to pay to read, they would have to pay to post their idiotic responses after reading.

If they can't read it they can't misquote the articles and post their responses as "published".

Thing is, most are so obsessed that they will pay. Then BMJ benefits. Nothing wrong with that. BMJ should be paid to put up with the nonsense.

I won't pay, but I rarely go there anyway. Other serious folk will pay though, I'm sure.
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Well, my opinion is that if there's good information out there, you shouldn't have to pay for it, since reliable informatin is a tool for fighting woo-cr*p ...
 
I'm hoping there are enough free sources out there still. Or that more information debunking woo crap becomces available via other sources like the media.

The media seems more than willing to allow woo crap and pseudoscience steal the headlines, but I'm hoping that changes as we see the consequences of that. I've seen more people getting their words printed about why the anti-vaccine nonsense is not true, and that the diseases are still a problem in other parts of the world, etc.

If controversay does sell, then I don't see why people aren't doing as I suggested and start putting out information in magazines and books that refute woo nonsense. Use their own tactics against them, but without lying.

I think more people are willing to hear the truth now. Especially if a positive note ends whatever media to show how not having woo nonsense will benefit everybody. Show how medical advances are getting more and more sophisticated. Show that we do know how are bodies work and that woo claims are untrue.

Show how you save money by not falling for woo lies. Show how much healthier people are when they get real help when it is available, because that is what happens the majority of the time. The woos make it sound like EVERYBODY is left with the bad news that nothing can be done for them. Really drive home that something can be done for anybody if it is caught early enough to be treated.

People ought to be outraged that liars make them hesitate to get real help until it is too late.

Any ideas on how to do this and show the promise of good health care versus woo care? Stats on how long you wait for certain conditions to be treated that show the longer you wait the more deadly the condition gets? Yet also show that prevention is a right in getting screenings like paps and breast exams, etc.

How to show that denial is the result of woo nonsense "prevention" measures (eat their woo crap instead of getting screenings). That waiting is what kills peoople. The denial that they are not sick because they think the woo crap is helping when it is not.

The woos have figured out how to seduce people. People need reassurances now from non-woos. That their health is in everybody's best interest and not the woo claims of profit. Show woo profit margins compared to actual medical profit margins. Show people where they can get this information themselves from legit sources so they don't have to think they are being lied to (cause the woos will claim they are lies).

Time to fight fire with truth. I don't know how to get most of the information needed, and most certainly do not have the credentials. It's frustrating, wanting to do something but not being able to.
 
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