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Poll: Republicans reject evolution...

headscratcher4

Philosopher
headscratcher4
Joined
Apr 14, 2002
Messages
7,776
http://www.galluppoll.com/content/?ci=27847


Some blog: analysis:

http://voxday.blogspot.com/2007/06/rejecting-evolution.html

“No doubt evolutionists will argue that this is significant proof that Independents and Democrats are smarter than Republicans. Of course, it's interesting to note that those presumably less intelligent Republicans are also wealthier, happier, are more likely to possess a college degree and live longer than their more evolutionarily-correct Democratic counterparts.”


So, apparently, facts are irrelevent so long as you are happy and economically out-perform those who accept the facts....
 
I'm not anti-evolution per se, I'm probably best described as an evolutionary skeptic. And while I've read far more evolutionary literature than anti-evolutionary literature - I've never even cracked open an ID book - I find the most convincing argument against evolution is the psychological one based on the behavior of its adherents. These people simply don't behave like economists who know precisely how and why the Law of Supply and Demand exists and works like it does, they behave more like religious individuals full of self-doubt and terrified that their faith will be shattered at any moment.
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Translation: I'm not anti-evolution specifically. I'm anti-reason and anti-logic. I embrace logical fallacies and have made them my trademark.
 
headscratcher4 said:
Of course, it's interesting to note that those presumably less intelligent Republicans are also wealthier, happier, are more likely to possess a college degree and live longer than their more evolutionarily-correct Democratic counterparts.”


So, apparently, facts are irrelevent so long as you are happy and economically out-perform those who accept the facts....
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Well, as the old saying goes, "If you're so smart, why ain't you rich?"

Let's stipulate that Repubs are more likely not to believe in evolution. All other things being equal, Dems, as a group, should therefore be more successful in life than Repubs, as a group - happier, wealthier, more successful, better health, all those things.

Now, if that's not the case, then it stands to reason that the Repubs do better in other areas tied to success than Dems do. Perhaps Repubs understand basic economics better than Dems? Perhaps they understand the value of education better than Dems? Perhaps they understand better than Dems that your personal self-esteem is of no particular interest to your employer? Perhaps they understand better than Dems that having two parents raise a kid is generally better than one?

I don't pretend to know the answer to those questions. But saying, "Oh, look, Repubs don't believe in evolution, ergo they're stupider than Dems" is logically fallacious. If the Dems are so much smarter, how come they aren't better off?
 
BPSCG said:
Well, as the old saying goes, "If you're so smart, why ain't you rich?"

Let's stipulate that Repubs are more likely not to believe in evolution. All other things being equal, Dems, as a group, should therefore be more successful in life than Repubs, as a group - happier, wealthier, more successful, better health, all those things.

Now, if that's not the case, then it stands to reason that the Repubs do better in other areas tied to success than Dems do. Perhaps Repubs understand basic economics better than Dems? Perhaps they understand the value of education better than Dems? Perhaps they understand better than Dems that your personal self-esteem is of no particular interest to your employer? Perhaps they understand better than Dems that having two parents raise a kid is generally better than one?

I don't pretend to know the answer to those questions. But saying, "Oh, look, Repubs don't believe in evolution, ergo they're stupider than Dems" is logically fallacious. If the Dems are so much smarter, how come they aren't better off?
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Well you are showing faulty reasoning here, as you seem to think that bank account is the perfect indicator of inteligence. I don't buy that, as you could just as much argue that it is a showing of how selfcentered someone is or any other trait one wants.
 
I'm about 3/4's the way through Shermer's book "Why Darwin Matters" (a short read at about 190 pages). It still amazes me how intellectually bankrupt creationists and ID'ers are.

It seems more of a cultural fight than common sense. "If we can get the unwashed masses to believe in creationism, we're well on our way to a good old Christian theocracy"

Charlie (who needs science?) Monoxide
 
BPSCG said:
Well, as the old saying goes, "If you're so smart, why ain't you rich?"

Let's stipulate that Repubs are more likely not to believe in evolution. All other things being equal, Dems, as a group, should therefore be more successful in life than Repubs, as a group - happier, wealthier, more successful, better health, all those things.
Click to expand...
... Although perhaps you have the causation and correlation the wrong way 'round. Perhaps having money makes a person more likely to become a republican.

An amusing and related anecdote:

I'm a flaming ACLU liberal who graduated from college a couple of years ago. For the first time in my life I'm making good money, and I just recently had occasion to invest (for the first time) in a mutual fund that contains stocks. Though I have always been a supporter of a higher federal minimum wage, when Congress voted last week to increase the minimum wage, my first, unbidden thought - before I could stop myself - was: "Hmmmm. I wonder if this'll bring my stocks down?" Immediatelly, my core liberal brain recoiled in horror: "OH NOES!!! TEH PEPUBLICAN!!!111! SWEET JESUS, THIS IS HOW IT STARTS!!!!!!!" ;)
 
ponderingturtle said:
Well you are showing faulty reasoning here, as you seem to think that bank account is the perfect indicator of inteligence.
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Please indicate where I said I thought that. Paris Hilton's bank account dwarfs mine, but I'd be willing to bet my IQ is at least a little higher than hers (hey, she's claiming she's had a come to Jesus experience in prison, so I think we'd probably agree on that).

However, there is some correlation between education/intelligence and earning power. You aren't going to deny that, are you?
 
Vorticity said:
... Although perhaps you have the causation and correlation the wrong way 'round. Perhaps having money makes a person more likely to become a republican.
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Could be. Does believing in evolution make one more likely to become a Republican? Or is it the other way around?
An amusing and related anecdote:

I'm a flaming ACLU liberal who graduated from college a couple of years ago. For the first time in my life I'm making good money, and I just recently had occasion to invest (for the first time) in a mutual fund that contains stocks. Though I have always been a supporter of a higher federal minimum wage, when Congress voted last week to increase the minimum wage, my first, unbidden thought - before I could stop myself - was: "Hmmmm. I wonder if this'll bring my stocks down?" Immediatelly, my core liberal brain recoiled in horror: "OH NOES!!! TEH PEPUBLICAN!!!111! SWEET JESUS, THIS IS HOW IT STARTS!!!!!!!" ;)
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Welcome to the dark side. :)
 
Didn't we have a poll that showed that Democrats believed 911 woo a week or two ago?

The big question here is, is anyone surprised by these poll results?

The GOP is the party of the neo-puritans. The Dems are the party of the neo-socialists. Nothing to see here.
 
Democrats have, for some years now, been the party of preference for the majority of the lower income levels. Lower income levels tend not to have as much education and are, (duh) less successful by most economic standards. Oddly, colleges tend to be hotbeds of Democrats too, but there just aren't enough pointy-headed intellectual Democrats to counterbalance the poor and working-class Democrats.

As has been pointed out, each of the major parties has made its own particular "deal with the Devil", the Democrats in catering to new-age woo, the Republicans in catering to fundies. The ends are fixed. The middle is in constant flux.
 
Tony said:
This confirms it, republicans are stupid.
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You got that right. These are the same mental giants who voted for Lush - I mean Bush. Twice.

A bit ago I posted a video of man-on-the-street interviews here in the USA, where people could not think of a country beginning with "U", where they thought some joker in a suit who walks up to them claiming to be Aussie PM John Howard really was, and all sorts of stuff like that thar.

The right-wingers (Republicans) immediately got defensive about it, with me.

Well - we really ARE that stupid here in the United States of America. Not all of us - but an embarrassingly huge group of us.

You know where the numbers should be on believing in creationism, here now in the 21st century? Especially in the country with the best method of communications? Right exactly where the Flat Earthers are.

Yeah. We're gonna solve global warming. Sure. As long as God takes care of everything, we will.
 
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BPSCG said:
Let's stipulate that Repubs are more likely not to believe in evolution. All other things being equal, Dems, as a group, should therefore be more successful in life than Repubs, as a group - happier, wealthier, more successful, better health, all those things.
Click to expand...

Why "therefore?" Is there an established correlation between knowledge of the basic facts of biology and happiness, wealth, success, health, and "all those things?"
 
BPSCG said:
Let's stipulate that Repubs are more likely not to believe in evolution. All other things being equal, Dems, as a group, should therefore be more successful in life than Repubs, as a group - happier, wealthier, more successful, better health, all those things.
Click to expand...

Steven Howard said:
Why "therefore?"
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Because of that phrase, "all other things being equal." Standard scientific method when running an experiment:
  • Get two groups to study;
  • Make sure that they are identical in every significant respect except one;
  • Run your study/experiment and examine your results. The differences are due to the one trait in which the two groups differed. That's called a control.
If two groups of people are identical in every significant respect but one, that one significant respect accounts for their differences.

If a group of Dems and a group of Repubs are identical except in that the Repubs don't believe in evolution and the Dems do, and the Repubs are as a group wealthier, then it follows that there is a correlation between belief in evolution and wealth (without getting into which is the cause and which the effect).

Since belief in creationism is a sign of ignorance and/or stupidity, it doesn't make sense that of two otherwise identical groups, the stupider one should be the wealthier one.

So my conclusion is that Dems must be stupid in other ways, a conclusion apparently shared here.

Of course, this being social science and not physical science, there's a much greater element of uncertainty to these conclusions than in, say, biology or physics or chemistry.
 
headscratcher4 said:
http://www.galluppoll.com/content/?ci=27847


Some blog: analysis:

http://voxday.blogspot.com/2007/06/rejecting-evolution.html

“No doubt evolutionists will argue that this is significant proof that Independents and Democrats are smarter than Republicans. Of course, it's interesting to note that those presumably less intelligent Republicans are also wealthier, happier, are more likely to possess a college degree and live longer than their more evolutionarily-correct Democratic counterparts.”


So, apparently, facts are irrelevent so long as you are happy and economically out-perform those who accept the facts....
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Wow I'm glad there's no mindless stereotyping going on here. :boggled:

Can someone tell me if the links have anything more than similarly silly gibberish as quoted above? I'd like to think I can get at least a LITTLE something out of clicking on this thread.
 
shemp said:
I'm willing to believe the first part, but regarding the second part, please provide some evidence.
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"I have become much more spiritual. God has given me this new chance."

(...snip...)

She has had a person whom she described as a spiritual adviser who said, "My spirit or soul did not like the way I was being seen and that is why I was sent to jail."

"God," she said, "has released me."
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QED

No word on who this spiritual adviser is. I'm guessing it's not $ylvia Browne, since she only talks with dead spirits.
 
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