Patriotic Millionaires say "raise our taxes"

[Puppycow]

'Patriotic Millionaires' Describe What They've Done With Their Bush Tax Cuts: 'I Built A Dance Floor In My House'

WASHINGTON -- Paul Egerman isn't certain how many millions he's saved from the tax cuts enacted during the George W. Bush administration in the early 2000s and extended by President Barack Obama in December of last year.

"I do not know how much I've saved over 10 years but I'm sure it is several million dollars -- probably in excess of $10 million," said Egerman, founder of a medical transcription company called eScription.

And what, HuffPost asked, have you done with all that cash?

"I've kept it," he said. "I have not done anything with that money."

Egerman is part of a gang of self-described Patriotic Millionaires who wish the federal government would help itself to more of their money to address its big budget deficits. Nearly 200 millionaires have signed a letter asking congressional Republicans to consider healing budget gaps with increased revenue -- in particular, higher taxes on millionaires -- instead of just reduced spending.

I already know what the first objection is going to be: "If they want to pay more taxes, who's stopping them?" Let me give you an analogy: a truck is stuck in the mud, and a guy says "let's tie a rope to it and then let's all pull together so we can get it out of the mud." The point is that just a handful of people pulling on that rope isn't going to make a difference. And a handful of rich people voluntarily paying a few percent more in taxes isn't going to make a significant difference either.

Why Millionaires Who Want Higher Taxes Don't Just Donate Money To The Government

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Why don't you pay more taxes?

 

[theprestige]

And a handful of rich people voluntarily paying a few percent more in taxes isn't going to make a significant difference either.

Of course not. In order to get what they want, they want you to spend your money.

It's not like they got to be millionaires by spending their own money.

Why Millionaires Who Want Higher Taxes Don't Just Donate Money To The Government

Because Millionaires Want Things Even Millionaires Can't Afford.

At least these millionaires are prepared to discuss the fact that raising taxes on the rich isn't nearly enough to solve government's fiscal problems. And they're honest enough to admit that raising taxes on everybody else isn't just obvious, but desirable. I expect the Obama administration to release its 2012 "tax the middle class" campaign strategy any day now.

It's easy enough for the super-rich to say taxes should be raised on everybody. After all, they're still rich, and they can still afford to buy politicians.

 

[BobTheCoward]

I don't see how one can decide a certain fiscal policy is more patriotic than the other.

 

[KingMerv00]

I don't see how one can decide a certain fiscal policy is more patriotic than the other.

Look for the side that wears the biggest flag pin.

 

[WildCat]

So the guy in Japan thinks American workers should pay more taxes?

What's wrong with the dance floor? That means he hired people to install it, yes? Jobs were created, just as advertised. The construction workers, floor manufacturer, probably light and sound systems - all which wouldn't have happened if that money were taxed.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Of course not. In order to get what they want, they want you to spend your money.

Correction. They don't want you to spend your money. They want you to have more of your money taken away from you and spent on the things on which they want it spent rather than on the things on which you would choose to spend your own money.

There is no virtue whatsoever in being “generous” with other people's money. Let these “patriots” be generous with their own money.

 

[uk_dave]

Correction. They don't want you to spend your money. They want you to have more of your money taken away from you and spent on the things on which they want it spent rather than on the things on which you would choose to spend your own money.

There is no virtue whatsoever in being “generous” with other people's money. Let these “patriots” be generous with their own money.

Yeah, that's how the roads got built.

 

[3point14]

Yeah, that's how the roads got built.

Dave shoots.

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Dave scores!!!!

 

[The Don]

Dave shoots.

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Dave scores!!!!

Yeah but the roads are built now, so lets pull the metaphorical ladder up after ourselves.

 

[3point14]

Yeah but the roads are built now, so lets pull the metaphorical ladder up after ourselves.

Well exactly. I have roads, built off the taxes of those gone before me, but those that come after me can chuff right off, Jack. I have roads, why should I pay for other people's?





Isn't it co-operation with a little altruism that's got us this far? Why is it suddenly an 'every man for himself' mantra now?

 

[The Don]

[roleplay] yes, but if the roads (or whatever) are built by public subscription then you'd end up with exactly the road system you need (as opposed to all those wasteful county roads that hardly get any traffic) built at a fraction of the cost by private industry (who hardly wast money at all) [/roleplay]

Why is it suddenly an 'every man for himself' mantra now?

I think that voice has always been there to some extent, after all isn't that how the US got started in the first place ? A reluctance to pay taxes for something they couldn't see the direct benefit for.

 

[eeyore1954]

"I do not know how much I've saved over 10 years but I'm sure it is several million dollars -- probably in excess of $10 million," said Egerman, founder of a medical transcription company called eScription.

And what, HuffPost asked, have you done with all that cash?

"I've kept it," he said. "I have not done anything with that money."

Why didn't he find a deserving charity instead of doing nothing if he is interested in helping. Or will he only help when he is forced to by taxes. Although I suspect he has but that statement was carefully crafted to further the cause of raising taxes.

 

[WildCat]

Why didn't he find a deserving charity instead of doing nothing if he is interested in helping. Or will he only help when he is forced to by taxes. Although I suspect he has but that statement was carefully crafted to further the cause of raising taxes.

These same people would likely find some tax shelter if their rates were raised, then repeat their attention whoring about that. "Why do I have accesss to this tax shelter, I really really want the government top have it because I'm a great patriot. Really!"

Kind of like Bill Gates and Warren Buffet leaving their estates to charitablle foundations (which I wouldn't be surprised if relatives make hefty salaries managing) rather than letting the government have it.

 

[Ziggurat]

I already know what the first objection is going to be: "If they want to pay more taxes, who's stopping them?" Let me give you an analogy

In other words, let me make an argument about something else because I can't make an argument about the actual thing.

You see, unlike your analogy, the federal budget (in particular, the federal deficit) is not, in fact, a binary state. It's not even binary-ish. It's a continuum. So every little bit does, in fact, help.

If someone isn't donating money to the treasury, that means that they think they can put that money to use in a better way than the government can. It's really that simple. These folks aren't doing that. Therefore, we CAN logically conclude that they don't want to pay more, that they think their taxes are high enough.

The truth is that they think that other millionaires won't spend all their money as well as the government. They want to raise taxes on other millionaires. They are willing to have their own taxes increased in order to raise the taxes on other millionaires. That's not necessarily a bad position to take, but let's be honest: that is in fact what they believe. Because not a single one of them thinks that they, individually, have too low a tax rate. Nobody who doesn't give more money to the feds than they are required to actually believes their taxes are too low.

 

[WildCat]

The truth is that they think that other millionaires won't spend all their money as well as the government. They want to raise taxes on other millionaires. They are willing to have their own taxes increased in order to raise the taxes on other millionaires. That's not necessarily a bad position to take, but let's be honest: that is in fact what they believe. Because not a single one of them thinks that they, individually, have too low a tax rate. Nobody who doesn't give more money to the feds than they are required to actually believes their taxes are too low.

Exactly. These very same people hire accountants to protect as much of their money as possible. The reality is they don't have to declare a single deduction or exemption or depreciation schedule if they don't want to, which would greatly increase their rate without any government action at all.

 

[3point14]

Wow.

Mindreaders.

 

[WildCat]

Wow.

Mindreaders.

Not reading anyone's minds, we know they didn't write a check to the government for one penny more than they had to, it's right there in the story.

True fact: there is no penalty for overpaying the IRS. And you can even write a check directly to the government if you wish! And unlike charitable contributions, the check you write to the government isn't tax-deductible, so you win again!

 

[Puppycow]

So the guy in Japan thinks American workers should pay more taxes?

FWIW, I think it's time for Japan to raise its taxes too.

 

[3point14]

Not reading anyone's minds, we know they didn't write a check to the government for one penny more than they had to, it's right there in the story.

True fact: there is no penalty for overpaying the IRS. And you can even write a check directly to the government if you wish! And unlike charitable contributions, the check you write to the government isn't tax-deductible, so you win again!

Well, you seem to be ascribing motivation to these people that they themselves haven't disclosed. In fact, the motivation they describe is not at all the same as the motivation you attribute to them. I figured it was mindreading.