One paranormal/psychic experience I know of

I can assure you that my comments were sincere and thought-out, even if I fall short of Rodney's standards.

I guess I'll take as a compliment your comment about my standards ;) The thing here is though, that, if we take Neponset's two posts at face value, Alice F. was THE logical choice to send a message to his mother. Specifically, Neponset stated: "Of my mother's closest friends that I knew during the last 40 years of her life, Alice F was perhaps the closest. Two other close friends from childhood were still alive at the time."

Now, I will grant you that an anecdote is no substitute for a scientific study of the paranormal. However, if you accept Neponset's account as factual and complete, I don't think it will do to calculate the odds as if Alice were just another garden variety friend. And, I would again note that, if the psychic were just pulling a name out of the air, she would have been much better off selecting Mary, which was six times as common as Alice in 1919 and which also has the ultimate tie-in with the Catholic Church.
 
If she could give a first name and relation than no judging would be required.
With naming 'friends' it might be dificult, because who is a friend and who's not is a subjective call.

I don't see how a foolproof protocol could be designed for this type of test because there would always be the possibility that the psychic had obtained the name surreptitiously.
 
I don't see how a foolproof protocol could be designed for this type of test because there would always be the possibility that the psychic had obtained the name surreptitiously.

take 10 randomly selected people of which the claimant would have no knowledge. The first time she would meet them/ learn their names would be during the test.
Ask her to name a dead relative and the relation for each of the 10 people (separately for each of them).
If she can get 5 out of 10, it should be significant enough.
If physical contact with those people is not required, as was portrayed here, we can draw the names from an address book of some sorts, or even yellow pages.
 
take 10 randomly selected people of which the claimant would have no knowledge. The first time she would meet them/ learn their names would be during the test.
Ask her to name a dead relative and the relation for each of the 10 people (separately for each of them).
If she can get 5 out of 10, it should be significant enough.
If physical contact with those people is not required, as was portrayed here, we can draw the names from an address book of some sorts, or even yellow pages.

You're assuming that the psychic was claiming she could obtain messages for randomly selected people. However, Neponset stated that the psychic in his mother's case was the mother of his brother's girlfriend. In other words, it's not clear that the psychic was claiming she could obtain a message for just anyone. Rather, she may have claimed that she could do this only where there was some sort of family connection or where she had met a relative of the person for whom the message was sought.
 
My comment was in reply to the following sentence by the OP:

Most of what you hear about are obvious demonstrable scams or frauds of some kind, so it pays to be skeptical.
To which I replied:
So maybe you can get the lady to apply for the challenge?
She can demonstrate once and for all that there's afterlife, God, Christian religion is correct and if she doesn't want the money, she can donate it to a charity of her choice.
Since that moment in our discussion I assumed she can apply for a challenge, so there would have to be a claim she would make, and I simply gave an example of a claim that I think could potentially be accepted for the challenge (since you asked me how she could possibly apply - i gave you a possible claim and a possible protocol which i think could be accepted, if the claim was made).
No one made any claims of paranormal powers at this stage, but from the original post a possibility of a specific person having these powers is being discussed, and this is the scenario I'm refering to.

You're assuming that the psychic was claiming she could obtain messages for randomly selected people. .
I gave an example of a claim and a protocol which I think would be acceptable. The psychic has not made any claims so far, and the discussion is based on one possibly biased non-first hand relation.
I'd like to point out that I think the OP is genuine in his description of the situation.
In other words, it's not clear that the psychic was claiming she could obtain a message for just anyone
At this point the psychic isn't claiming anything.
Rather, she may have claimed that she could do this only where there was some sort of family connection
I thought there was no family connection in the case being discussed, just a mother of a boyfriend of her daughter relation. Boyfriend of a daughter doesn't really qualify as a family, does it?
or where she had met a relative of the person for whom the message was sought
That's not a problem. she can meet the people for whom the message is sought directly. They would be the 10 randomly selected people.

If you're suggesting that she would need to know the people for some time (i.e. be friends with them), then in my opinion we can't reject a possibility of the psychic learning the revealed detail using non-paranormal methods.
 
This is a modest but true story. Make of it what you wish.

My mother was terminally ill from heart disease and was very near death. She was quite afraid of dying. The mother of my brother's girlfriend at the time (now his wife) allegedly had some psychic ability and was asked by my brother if she could offer our mother any consolation. She told him to tell her Alice would be there waiting for her.

This Alice had died so many years before that I had completely forgotten about her, but they had been very close.

This sort of story is very common and, given that they were very close, I think it's fairly likely that Alice will indeed be waiting for her.
 
I doubt if this women is a conscious fraud, and I doubt that she did any sort of statistical analysis on "Alice" vs. "Mary." It's more likely she just got a "feeling" for Alice, and it happened that there was a dramatic and meaningful Alice in this lady's life. Roughly a 50/50 chance, so no magic there.

However, as we have no actual record of what was said to this woman by the dying mother, or even what was said to her by the various other parties, there is a very high likelyhood that someone mentioned Alice to her and she was just parroting. The original post is a bit ambiguous, but if we assume it was truly an off the cuff guess, it's still easily attributable to plain luck.

Why not just accept it for what it seems to be?
 
Ian, "what it seems to be" is a very subjective concept, and one that is wrong an awful lot of the time.

For instance- when I was little, I was certain that the sun revolved around the earth. Of course it did- it moved across the sky over the course of the day. That's "what it seems to be."

Only the application of science demonstrated that our intuitive perceptions were a bad indication of what's really happening. Or do you still believe the sun revolves around the earth?
 
I'm guessing Glite hit it on the head. I imagine the conversation between psychic and brother went something like:

psychic: Hmmm. I'm seeing an A name....Ann...Arabelle...Alice...did you mother have anyone close to her like that?

brother: Why yes! My mother's best friend was named Alice! Wow!

psychic: ah yes...I could tell they were very close. Well, tell her that Alice is waiting for her.

brother: Gosh, that is simply amazing.


Brother goes and tells everyone that the psychic specifically named Alice. What are the odds of that?


Meg

LMAO! Nah I rather doubt it :)
 
Ian, "what it seems to be" is a very subjective concept, and one that is wrong an awful lot of the time.

For instance- when I was little, I was certain that the sun revolved around the earth. Of course it did- it moved across the sky over the course of the day. That's "what it seems to be."

Only the application of science demonstrated that our intuitive perceptions were a bad indication of what's really happening. Or do you still believe the sun revolves around the earth?

In and of itself it certainly is very weak evidence. Yet it is similar to so many other stories and fits in with meeting loved ones during NDEs and deathbed visions.

But yeah I wouldn't be surprised at all if the story has a perfectly normal explanation. If I had to guess though I would say it simply is what it appears to be. Not that Alice necessarily communicated with the psychic. Maybe she did, maybe she didn't. But I guess that some anomalous information acquisition was involved.
 
This sort of story is very common

I'm not sure who you are to ascertain how common the story is - if you mean you've heard a similar one a number of times before, well, that's how urban legends spread. Doesn't make them true.
and, given that they were very close, I think it's fairly likely that Alice will indeed be waiting for her.
OK... so you believe in afterlife, I don't - so I don't think anyone will be waiting for her.
Why not just accept it for what it seems to be?
because most of us went to schools and got some education.
if we followed your advice, we would still be in dark ages, and the world would be ruled by trickery.
Yet it is similar to so many other stories and fits in with meeting loved ones during NDEs and deathbed visions.
NDEs and deathbed visions.. right. At what time do the fairies come for lunch?
 
Let me attempt to respond to the latest posts.

To Meg, I noted in my second post that my brother did not meet directly with the alleged psychic, his girlfriend's mother, so the mother could not have abstracted any information from him. This fact I did not make clear in the original post. My apologies.

Since joller asked about my religious beliefs, let me elaborate on them. I am in a very nominal sense Christian, as follows. My parents went to a Unitarian church when I was growing up, but stopped going when I was in my very young teens. I don't know the extent of their beliefs. Unitarians are sometimes lampooned on 'The Simpsons' as something like Christian lite, and certainly their devotion to the Christian orthodoxy seems less strong than for other Christian sects like Roman Catholicism or some of the more fervent Portestant sects.

I have never been a churchgoer, but I do have some understanding of the Christian beliefs and enjoy the Christian holidays. Certainly I am not Jewish, or Islamic, or Hindu, or any of the other religions. I cannot say I believe in the essence of Christianity, namely the Holy Trinity and the divinity of Jesus Christ. (Odd time to be mentioning it, during Lent right now.) But I am in no position to deny it either - how could I do so definitively? As Martin Luther once said about faith, 'that whore, reason'.

My own belief tends to be atheistic. I cannot disprove the existence of (a) God any more than I can prove it. So I fall back to the position of agnostic, meaning I don't know. If my response seems ambiguous to readers here, it is because my own feelings are ambiguous. This information I have provided as context, given that the psychic claimed to be in communication with a Catholic saint, and one could argue that that fact influenced my recollection or recounting in some way.

About Occam's razor, the Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary (said to be the best-selling dictionary in America) 11th ed. defines it as follows: "a scientific and philosophic rule that entities should not be multiplied unnecessarily which is interpreted as requiring that the simplest of competing theories be preferred to the more complex or that explanations of unknown phenomena be sought first in terms of known quantities".

Given this definition I think it should be obvious why I mentioned it. If we are trying to explain an unknown phenomenon, namely psychic ability, the preferred explanation should be the simpler one, one that requires only this world, not the existence of another world beyond. This is in fact what the skeptics are doing. Furthermore, I do not have a problem with it. I thought I had made it clear that I am not wedded to the notion that the story I told was conclusive proof of any psychic ability, only that it was an intriguing, unusual story, one that could, could, be an instance of it, especially given the context of her prior history as it was informally related to me.

I don't write anyone off as an idiot. I am inclined to think, however, that some people are too eager to dismiss it with just a little bit too much short-tempered self-righteousness for my taste. But that's their right, and they are free to do so.

I do accept the possibility that psychic ability does not exist. I am also willing to accept the possibility that it may. I prefer to remain open minded on the subject.

About the possibility that I may be a liar, Glite suggested it.

The point of my mentioning Alice's personal data, which I would have thought would be obvious enough, is for the benefit of those posters here who have been trying to obtain a reasonable statistical estimate of the probability that the name was a lucky hit based on demographic data, such as the distribution of the name Alice at different points in time and in different social groups.

Unfortunately, I am fairly certain the woman died a number of years ago, as she was herself not in very good health at the time my mother died. As such, she could not participate in any challenge. How fortunate, the skeptics say.

Well, when I die, we'll see what happens. If I survive in some fashion, this one will be on my list of question to be answered, including who shot JFK, and where is Jimmy Hoffa?
 
Thanks for the update and for providing more information and context for your story.
 

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