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Merged nuclear power safe?

How big is the area? Where is it located? What is deemed "too high" a level?

Thing is, they could talk about a small strip very close to the plant, with a level that would be OK for a radiation worker but, due to regulations, is assumed to be too high for the general population.

But of course, things like "Fukushima a no-go zone forever due to insanely high radiation" makes a far better headline these days....

Greetings,

Chris
 
From the Guardian, citing Japanese news reports.

Link

Another report on this from the New York Times:

Large Zone Near Japanese Reactors to Be Off Limits

TOKYO — Broad areas around the stricken Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant could soon be declared uninhabitable, perhaps for decades, after a government survey found radioactive contamination that far exceeded safe levels, several major media outlets said Monday.

The formal announcement, expected from the government in coming days, would be the first official recognition that the March accident could force the long-term depopulation of communities near the plant, an eventuality that scientists and some officials have been warning about for months. Lawmakers said over the weekend — and major newspapers reported Monday — that Prime Minister Naoto Kan was planning to visit Fukushima Prefecture, where the plant is, as early as Saturday to break the news directly to residents. The affected communities are all within 12 miles of the plant, an area that was evacuated immediately after the accident.

The government is expected to tell many of these residents that they will not be permitted to return to their homes for an indefinite period. It will also begin drawing up plans for compensating them by, among other things, renting their now uninhabitable land. While it is unclear if the government would specify how long these living restrictions would remain in place, news reports indicated it could be decades. That has been the case for areas around the Chernobyl plant in Ukraine after its 1986 accident.
 
So, we have "could soon", "perhaps for", "media outlets", "expected from", "would be", "could force", "expected to", "indefinite period", "is unclear", "would specify", "would remain", "news reports indicated it could".

And of course the all-time favorite, Chernobyl!

All i can see is lots of speculation and nothing definitive. It could be going that way, or this way, or some other way, ....

Greetings,

Chris
 
My suspicion is that they want to have the area declared a "no go" zone for political reasons. Probably to get a nice rebuild somewhere else. Those homes may be contaminated with nothing beyond not having as nice a view as the new location.
 
At least I'm not sitting around hoping for a nuclear disaster.
 
So, we have "could soon", "perhaps for", "media outlets", "expected from", "would be", "could force", "expected to", "indefinite period", "is unclear", "would specify", "would remain", "news reports indicated it could".

And of course the all-time favorite, Chernobyl!

All i can see is lots of speculation and nothing definitive. It could be going that way, or this way, or some other way, ....

Greetings,

Chris

Did you read the whole article or just the excerpts I copied into my post.

There is more there, but it's against forum rules to post the whole thing.

There are specific measurements. A person living there would be exposed to as much as 500 millisieverts of radiation per year, whereas the government's upper limit for safe exposure is 20 millisieverts.
 
Deniers have already started spreading the "news" that some places in the world have naturally high background radiation, and that 20 mSv/yr isn't actually that bad.

I want anyone dumb enough to say that to be forced to move to the highly contaminated areas of Japan.
 
Deniers have already started spreading the "news" that some places in the world have naturally high background radiation, and that 20 mSv/yr isn't actually that bad.

I note that you didn't actually say that those claims are wrong. One wonders why.
 
Did you read the whole article or just the excerpts I copied into my post.

There is more there, but it's against forum rules to post the whole thing.

There are specific measurements. A person living there would be exposed to as much as 500 millisieverts of radiation per year, whereas the government's upper limit for safe exposure is 20 millisieverts.

Those same number were reported as being from an "inside" uncited source on the previous article too. No primary source again. Sorry, but seeing that many journal simply copy over and over the same press release or snippet, I want a primary source.

I am not saying this is not happenning, I am saying I trust no "uncited" source.
 
Deniers People knowledgeable in the fields of radiation, nuclear technology and biology have already started spreading the "news" that some places in the world have naturally high background radiation,

Corrected free of charge, and it's not "news".

and that 20 mSv/yr isn't actually that bad.

It isn't. As figure three of this paper shows, tens of millions of people around the world live with nearly as much or significantly higher levels of naturally occurring radiation with little to no harmful effects.

I want anyone dumb enough to say that to be forced to move to the highly contaminated areas of Japan.

A.) I lived in Denver Colorado for two years. I have also been advocating for years that the proposed nuclear reactors for my area should go ahead as soon as possible, along with the more unconventional proposals for nuclear energy for oil sands extraction.

B.) False dichotomy fallacy. Create an absurd extreme as far away from your position as imaginably possible, then declare that anyone who does not endorse or accept you false extreme, you assume or declare them to be supporters of your own position by default, ignoring all possible positions in between.

This is because, as has been pointed out before, you are incapable of honestly and accurately portraying the true positions of your critics.
 
Did you read the whole article or just the excerpts I copied into my post.

There is more there, but it's against forum rules to post the whole thing.

There are specific measurements. A person living there would be exposed to as much as 500 millisieverts of radiation per year, whereas the government's upper limit for safe exposure is 20 millisieverts.

Yes, i did. And reading it simply confirmed what i suspected about the style of the article. It's mainly fear-mongering crap.

See, first they set the "fear the atom" stage by all the vague statements that you cited here. Then the usual reference to Chernobyl comes along, what else.

Then some side-notes about how bad the government was/is working. And then the beef starts. They talk about 508.1 mS/yr and how that is way above the limit of 20 mS/yr. However, they packed it such that most people will likely overlook the fact that this refers to _one_ particular spot, _2_ miles from the plant. Then they go on how three dozen spots up to 12 miles around the plant are above the safe levels.

They never tell you what the levels are in these other spots, only that they are above that 20mS/yr limit. They never tell how big these spots actually are, for all we know it could have been one spot the size of a park bench. They never tell that radioactive material decays, which means that the dose/year will become lower and lower as time passes by.

Instead they build up a fear-scenario at the start, mention Chernobyl, how stupid the government in Japan is/was, that there is a spot with 508 mS/yr and that there are three dozen more spots. The casual/usual reader will very likely get this wrong and thinks that all those spots are that high in contamination, and is lead to think that it will probably stay that way forever, thanks to the first parts of the article.

Oh, and i don't see a link to any sources for the claims made in that article.

Sorry, but no. That's the type of fear-inducing reporting that we have seen far too often by now.

Here you can see some actual data about radiation levels around that plant..

Greetings,

Chris

ETA: And of course they never tell you if the 508 mS/yr would be just the current level extrapolated to one year. And they also never tell you what would happen to these levels if decontamination is done. See, it could be collections of dust and other material at the very top of the soil layer. Once removed it could drop to "safe" levels there. Not saying that it will, but just that it could. That's the problem with such half-baked fear-mongering articles. Way too much information is missing to make any sense at all from them.
 
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Deniers have already started spreading the "news" that some places in the world have naturally high background radiation, and that 20 mSv/yr isn't actually that bad.

I want anyone dumb enough to say that to be forced to move to the highly contaminated areas of Japan.

Yea, 20 mS/yr is so bad that in the US they decided that radiation workers can get a dose of 50 mS/yr. But for some strange reason all these workers refuse to drop dead. Ever thought about why that is?

Oh wait, you never did. And very likely never will.
 
Deniers are funny. Not good funny, the creepy kind. A fetus, or babies, or young kids, they are most at risk from not only air radiation, but from ingesting cesium, especially concentrated in food, as well as in soil and water, and the denier wants everyone to think that is OK, because people who actually work in reactor sites are limited to a maximum dose each year of 20 mSv, or now 50 or 100mSv, it doesn't matter, they just raise it when they have to.

So the denier thinks a fetus should also be exposed to cesium radiation, because workers are allowed that much, right? It's not really bad for you, all the experts and doctors and scientists who came up with the limits for nuclear workers, well they don't know as much as you do. The denier knows better than anyone, and poo poos all ideas of any real harm.

Fukushima is no big deal to them, because they know everything.
 
When faced with real facts, real experts, real scientific information, the denier simply turns away, and tries to make it personal. Being insulting and stupid.

It is like some sort of cult.
 
When faced with real facts, real experts, real scientific information

Real facts, Real Experts:


Based on the radiation levels around Fukushima, it is wrong to speak
about a health risk from the radiation. There is, however, a very
real health risk is from the fear that the media and many others have
been whipping up. This is post-traumatic stress syndrome. It
happened at Chernobyl and it is happening again, now, to the many tens
of thousands of evacuated people around Fukushima. We ought to do
something to stop this suffering.


- Dr. Jerry Cutler, lead designer of the the reactor control, safety system and radiation monitoring instrumentation for the CANDU 6 series reactors​

You have neither.
 
Oh yeah. The real danger at Chernobyl was the fear. That's why everybody ran, and didn't return. That fear is deadly.
 

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