NT: Forgiveness is cherrypicking?

Yes, love thy neighbor. But who is your neighbor? Is everyone your neighbor?

Not according to the parable of the good Samaritan. Only those who are good to you is your neighbor.
 
c4ts said:
You mean the cranky Red Leader? I hear he blew up 42 children because they called him "baldhead."
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No, that's Wedge Antilles.

Captain Antilles is the captain of Leia's ship at the beginning of the first movie.
 
Hyparxis said:
Of course what gets missed in the reading, especially by Fundamentalist Christians, is that there is nothing you can do to earn Grace. You only need accept it and place yourself under it.
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No intention to argue the validity of your statement. Doesn't this statement illustrate the unfortunate cherrypickability that is the nature of biblical interpretation?

I recall having seen Christians argue both sides of this statement.

I'll also admit that my knowledge of the NT is currently limited to the gospels.
 
Ryokan said:
Yes, love thy neighbor. But who is your neighbor? Is everyone your neighbor?

Not according to the parable of the good Samaritan. Only those who are good to you is your neighbor.
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Well I think you could make a good argument from context that the use of "neighbour" by Jesus refers to other Jews.
 
FreakBoy said:
No intention to argue the validity of your statement. Doesn't this statement illustrate the unfortunate cherrypickability that is the nature of biblical interpretation?

I recall having seen Christians argue both sides of this statement.

I'll also admit that my knowledge of the NT is currently limited to the gospels.
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Actually this is one of the few things the NT says with any clarity (thanks to Paul) But then, of course even if the NT were written out in clear doctrinal propositions, believers would still generate a plethora of other views and cherrypick to support them.

Thomas Jefferson took sissiors and glue and made his own personal Bible.
Most of us here would probably approve of most of the cherries in his basket.

Is far as I'm cocerned cherrypicking in the Bible is preferable to swallowing the whole whale, or on the otherhand burning the Book.
 
Darat said:
Well I think you could make a good argument from context that the use of "neighbour" by Jesus refers to other Jews.
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The Samaritan was considered detestable by the average jew. The point of the story was in helping even someone whom you consider an enemy or below you.
 
Blutarsky said:
The Samaritan was considered detestable by the average jew. The point of the story was in helping even someone whom you consider an enemy or below you.
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I agree that this does seem to be the most reasonable and persuasive interpretation.
 
Blutarsky said:
The Samaritan was considered detestable by the average jew. The point of the story was in helping even someone whom you consider an enemy or below you.
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But Jesus says in that parabla that the Samaritan was the neighbour, not those that came before him and wouldn't help.

I believe the story is clear. Not everyone is your neighbour, only those that are good to you.
 
This has to be the WORST interpretation of this scripture I have ever seen. It makes me wonder if this being done in jest...

Where in the bible does it equate neighbor with someone who is "good to you?" in fact, when Jesus used the term "neighbor" it was usually in reference to humanity in general. It was a term that everyone could relate to. I have often had "neighbors" who drove me insane and whom I would never consider as "good to me."

Jews notoriously hated Samaritans, that was why a Samaritan was used as an example...I believe he was making the statement that "all men" are now considered your neighbor; even the ones you have traditionally hated.
 
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Blutarsky said:
This has to be the WORST interpretation of this scripture I have ever seen. It makes me wonder if this in being done in jest...

Where in the bible does it equate neighbor with someone who is "good to you?" Jews notoriously hated Samaritans, that was why a Samaritan was used as an example...I believe he was making the statement that "all men" are now considered your neighbor; even the ones you have traditionally hated.
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Or that even in the bad there can be good, or.... what a pity he didn't just come and say exactly what he meant! Pah mystics...
 
Ryokan said:
But Jesus says in that parabla that the Samaritan was the neighbour, not those that came before him and wouldn't help.

I believe the story is clear. Not everyone is your neighbour, only those that are good to you.
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That's a rather bizzare interpritation in my oppinion. I see how it could be interprited that way. The man asks "who is my neighbor", Jesus tells the story and then asks who was a neighbor. The person answered "The one who had mercy on him" meaning the Samaritan.

And just with that much I can see where you'd get your interpritation. But the very next part Jusus says, "Go and do likewise." I'd be hard pressed to consider the likewise anything but "have mercy on others" as the Samaritan did as it follows the statement, "The one who had mercy on him."

Wouldn't it also be an odd story to choose to tell if the moral was "do good to those that do good to you?" The greater context would include other things that Jesus said, such as the Golden Rule or "If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same" from the Beatitudes.

Aaron
 
Blutarsky said:
This has to be the WORST interpretation of this scripture I have ever seen. It makes me wonder if this being done in jest...

Where in the bible does it equate neighbor with someone who is "good to you?" in fact, when Jesus used the term "neighbor" it was usually in reference to humanity in general. It was a term that everyone could relate to. I have often had "neighbors" who drove me insane and whom I would never consider as "good to me."

Jews notoriously hated Samaritans, that was why a Samaritan was used as an example...I believe he was making the statement that "all men" are now considered your neighbor; even the ones you have traditionally hated.
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Just to get back to the wider use of the term "neighbour" - given the Gospels I still maintain the best interpretation for "neighbour" is a fellow Jew.

For instance Matthew 10 (New International Version)

5These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: "Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. 6Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel. 7As you go, preach this message: 'The kingdom of heaven is near.' 8Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give. 9Do not take along any gold or silver or copper in your belts; 10take no bag for the journey, or extra tunic, or sandals or a staff; for the worker is worth his keep.
 
Here are my two cents:


25 And behold, a certain lawyer stood up and made trial of him, saying, Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? 26 And he said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? 27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself. 28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. 29 But he, desiring to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbor? 30 Jesus made answer and said, A certain man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho; and he fell among robbers, who both stripped him and beat him, and departed, leaving him half dead. 31 And by chance a certain priest was going down that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side. 32 And in like manner a Levite also, when he came to the place, and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he was moved with compassion, 34 and came to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring on [them] oil and wine; and he set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him. 35 And on the morrow he took out two shillings, and gave them to the host, and said, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, I, when I come back again, will repay thee. 36 Which of these three, thinkest thou, proved neighbor unto him that fell among the robbers? 37 And he said, He that showed mercy on him. And Jesus said unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.

Above is the direct text from Luke. The story of the Samaritan was in DIRECT response to the question, "And who is my neighbor?" Samaritans WERE NOT Jews; so the idea that Jesus told them to help on their neighbors seems not to fit.

Jesus takes the opportunity to incorporate the most vile person a Jew could associate with and equates him to your neighbor. He didn't illustrate with a Samaritan for giggles, it was to make a sharp point to the reader.

What was Jesus' response when he was asked "Who is my neighbor?" He tells them to find the most repulsive person on earth and show them kindness...

Neighbour - plhsivon
  1. a friend
  2. any other person, and where two are concerned, the other (thy fellow man, thy neighbour), according to the Jews, any member of the Hebrew nation and commonwealth
  3. according to Christ, any other man irrespective of nation or religion with whom we live or whom we chance to meet
 
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Ryokan said:
But Jesus says in that parabla that the Samaritan was the neighbour, not those that came before him and wouldn't help.
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No, Jesus did not say that. Jesus asks which of the men acted as a neighbor should (neighborly behavior, it is suggested, consisting in doing good and manifesting compassion). What he then says is "Go, and do thou likewise."


Ryokan said:
I believe the story is clear. Not everyone is your neighbour, only those that are good to you.
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Rather, only those who do good to you are acting as neighbors ought to act.

If this really how you've always understood the parable, you might want to consider suspending all of your current opinions regarding the Bible pending a serious re-evaluation. Just as a precaution, you understand.
 
I second that. This is a clear example of "cherrypicking," but not as the OP intended.
 
ceo_esq said:
If this really how you've always understood the parable, you might want to consider suspending all of your current opinions regarding the Bible pending a serious re-evaluation. Just as a precaution, you understand.
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Which of these three, thinkest thou, proved neighbor unto him that fell among the robbers? And he said, He that showed mercy on him. And Jesus said unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.
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I still say that it's obvious to me that Jesus is saying that in this particular story, the priest and the Levite is not being a neighbor. Hence, not all humans are neighbors.
 
No. Not all humans treat all other humans like they are their neighbor (someone you would presumably care for). The word is used as an adjective in the sentence, not a noun, maybe that's your error.

To act neighborly and to be a neighbor are two different things. The scripture clearly is asking which is "acting neighborly."
 
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