NOVA program: Judgement Day, Intelligent Design on Trial

Pretty good. Could have used more evo evidence but I understand that they were trying to cover the law as well as the science.
 
I thought it was pretty good. I taped if for my Mom who doesn't believe me when I tell her what craziness some fundamentalist Christians proclaim to be the truth. I want to have Judge Jones love child! :D That a Republican appointed judge could render a such sane verdict really impresses me.
 
My grandmother actually watched most of this with me (only missing the last half hour as she got up early this morning and started falling asleep in her chair by nine fifteen). If it repeats she said she wants to see it. Now that's saying something!
 
Wow, I just finished watching this episode of NOVA and I have to say I'm pretty impressed with this 2hr show. I remember following the court case as it was occurring but this episode did a wonderful job telling the whole story. Now I want to go back and read the whole judge's opinion on his case.


Ooo ooo, and I LOVED the "missing link" reference:

cdesign proponentsists

:D
 
Oh... I'm jealous... it will be on here in 15 minutes... but I want to show it to my students... I know it will be available soon-- but if anyone has a link that would be great. I don't think I can get it to stream until after the 16th. And I don't have a means of recording it.
 
I thought it was awesome. Just the right mix of backstory, evidence for evolution (the Tiktaalik discovery was almost providential, even though it wasn't used in the case), flaws in ID claims and the legal basis for the case (which unfortunately had to be the establishement clause, not the science).

As someone who has been arguing this issue for a decade, I think Nova did laymen who support evolution a service by crafting this episode.

And I heart Eugenie Scott.
 
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juryjone said:
If you really want to get fired up, the website has some readings to get you in the mood. Phillip Johnson shows what an IDiot he is and how proud he is for creating the wedge strategy here.
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One of the best segments for me was a clearly exhasperated Phillip Johnson telling the interviewer how he "just know" Darwinism would be dead before he was, but, and it was clearly befuddling to him it wasn't, and he admitted it wasn't going away any time soon.
 
We have a class that covers ID here at the University of Texas at Austin, seriously. Its Physics 341 - pseudoscience and the paranormal :D
 
supercorgi said:
I thought it was pretty good. I taped if for my Mom who doesn't believe me when I tell her what craziness some fundamentalist Christians proclaim to be the truth. I want to have Judge Jones love child! :D That a Republican appointed judge could render a such sane verdict really impresses me.
Click to expand...

Just goes to show that not all Republicans have gone over to the dark side of IPGB - Incompetent Power-Grubbing Bushism.
 
I thoroughly enjoyed the show. It was done in a similar manner to one I saw on a libel case about holocaust denial some years ago. I thought the part where Behe actually states that under his "definition" of science Astrology would be considered science was the best.
 
Excellent show! A few observations:
  • While there wasn't a whole lot about how evolution works (that wasn't what the show was about) there was enough to show how well accepted it is. The bit about how modern genetics fit like a glove into the already-existing theory of evolution was particularly great.
  • Behe and quite a few other of the witnesses for the defense refused to be on the show. I suppose I can't blame them for not wanting to relive one of the worst embarrassments of their lives.
  • I loved the scene where they stacked the books up in front of Behe to refute his "no studies of the evolution of the immune system" claim. The defense lawyer called it "cheap theatrics". I notice he didn't try to claim that Behe was right.
  • One of the things I didn't know was how the author and editors of "Of Pandas and People" did a very poor "search and replace" on an earlier copy of the text to change "creationism" to "intelligent design". That was the nail-in-the-coffin as far as to whether or not they were trying to teach creationism.
  • The people who DID go on the show supporting ID looked like idiots. Evil idiots. One of them out-and-out espoused ignorance, saying of the Bible, "that's all I need to know".
  • "Irreducible complexity" was reduced to rubble. The "mousetrap to tie-clip" analogy was amusing and understandable to everyone.
  • I hope all the people who say, "Evolution is just a theory" were watching when they explained the scientific meaning of "theory".
 
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seismic_cowgirl said:
Wow, I just finished watching this episode of NOVA and I have to say I'm pretty impressed with this 2hr show. I remember following the court case as it was occurring but this episode did a wonderful job telling the whole story. Now I want to go back and read the whole judge's opinion on his case.


Ooo ooo, and I LOVED the "missing link" reference:

cdesign proponentsists

:D
Click to expand...

me too! me too!

I love smart funny honest scientific people too. Hope for our future!
 
UnrepentantSinner said:
One of the best segments for me was a clearly exhasperated Phillip Johnson telling the interviewer how he "just know" Darwinism would be dead before he was, but, and it was clearly befuddling to him it wasn't, and he admitted it wasn't going away any time soon.
Click to expand...

I agree. It's really amazing that he thought he was going to be able to turn back the clock by getting ID widely accepted. Of course he doesn't see his fundamental (no pun intended) flaw. Science is objective. One theory will not unseat another theory by force of will. One theory has to be provable superior, scientifically. And you can't change the rules in your attempt to win.
 
Tricky said:
Excellent show! A few observations:
  • While there wasn't a whole lot about how evolution works (that wasn't what the show was about) there was enough to show how well accepted it is. The bit about how modern genetics fit like a glove into the already-existing theory of evolution was particularly great.
  • Behe and quite a few other of the witnesses for the defense refused to be on the show. I suppose I can't blame them for not wanting to relive one of the worst embarrassments of their lives.
  • I loved the scene where they stacked the books up in front of Behe to refute his "no studies of the evolution of the immune system" claim. The defense lawyer called it "cheap theatrics". I notice he didn't try to claim that Behe was right.
  • One of the things I didn't know was how the author and editors of "Of Pandas and People" did a very poor "search and replace" on an earlier copy of the text to change "creationism" to "intelligent design". That was the nail-in-the-coffin as far as to whether or not they were trying to teach creationism.
  • The people who DID go on the show supporting ID looked like idiots. Evil idiots. One of them out-and-out espoused ignorance, saying of the Bible, "that's all I need to know".
  • "Irreducible complexity" was reduced to rubble. The "mousetrap to tie-clip" analogy was amusing and understandable to everyone.
  • I hope all the people who say, "Evolution is just a theory" were watching when they explained the scientific meaning of "theory".
Click to expand...
Yes, I'll just whip out my bible and tune-up the car today.

Paul

:) :) :)

In the back of the bible there is a great section on setting up your VCR.
 
I think it was the board president who, in the end, called a respected judge -- and I use his term exactly -- a "jackass."

That, in a word, shows the caliber of Christian they were dealing with down there.


Great, great show.
 
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