NHS funding of homeopathy

[Blue Wode]

Meanwhile, a Glasgow NHS Homeopathic Hospital doctor writes…
http://heroesnotzombies.wordpress.com/homeopathy/

For those who may have missed it, there’s an interesting debate in the comments section that accompanies the above article - and a new article has just been posted today, but so far no comments…
http://heroesnotzombies.wordpress.com/2008/01/30/response-to-another-attack-on-homeopathy/

Also, great to see a blog post from Gimpy on this morning’s news:
http://gimpyblog.wordpress.com/2008/01/30/nhs-support-for-homeopathy-evaporates/

 

[Deetee]

From the BBC site:

A spokesperson from the Faculty of Homoeopathy, which represents doctors, said the centres in the UK offering such treatment provided good value for money.

And there was little old me thinking that the BMA represented us.


ETA - Perhaps the demise of Peter Hain might help (he who supported CAM/homeopathy in Wales as the Welsh Sectretary of State, because he had been personally helped by it)

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

From the BBC site:


And there was little old me thinking that the BMA represented us.

Yeah, the SOH whines, while the BMA is surly. I don't know how they could have got the two mixed up.

 

[Rolfe]

Well, be fair, sloppy journalism. The FoH represents homoeopathic medics, as opposed to the SoH representing the amateurs.

Rolfe.

 

[Deetee]

I do know they meant homeopathic doctors, and not doctors in general. Just attempting to be a bit facetious.

(one of the few english language words to contain all the vowels in alphabetical order, btw).

 

[Rolfe]

I know you did, but I wondered if Ivor might be mixing up FoH and SoH.

Rolfe.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

I know you did, but I wondered if Ivor might be mixing up FoH and SoH.

Rolfe.

Yeah, I did! Easily done.

ETA: The BMA is still surly, though.

 

[Deetee]

Why homoeopathy on the NHS is in sharp decline - article in the Times UK.

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

I do know they meant homeopathic doctors, and not doctors in general. Just attempting to be a bit facetious.

(one of the few english language words to contain all the vowels in alphabetical order, btw).

I tend to be rather abstemious in my use of that word.

 

[Asolepius]

Why homoeopathy on the NHS is in sharp decline - article in the Times UK.

It's in decline because it fails the test of cost-effectiveness. All we (ie the 13 allegedly elderly scientists and doctors) asked NHS trusts to do was to look at the evidence. They seem to be doing that. The comment from Dr MacEoin is totally stereotypical. The usual load of anecdote, which is inseparable from homeopaths.

 

[Deetee]

It's in decline because it fails the test of cost-effectiveness. All we (ie the 13 allegedly elderly scientists and doctors) asked NHS trusts to do was to look at the evidence. They seem to be doing that. The comment from Dr MacEoin is totally stereotypical. The usual load of anecdote, which is inseparable from homeopaths.

Indeed. It is gratifying to see how the ripple effect from your article/letter in 2006 is still going. It was far more effective than I thought it would be, over and above any placebo component.

PS: I have a few zimmer frames handy if you need one anytime....

 

[Mojo]

The comment from Dr MacEoin is totally stereotypical.

Ah yes, Denis MacEoin.

Do you think the Guardian's choice of homoeopathy proponents (MacEoin, Winterson, Roy) could be considered evidence of an anti-homoeopathy bias?

 

[Asolepius]

Ah yes, Denis MacEoin.

Do you think the Guardian's choice of homoeopathy proponents (MacEoin, Winterson, Roy) could be considered evidence of an anti-homoeopathy bias?

I wish I had seen that piece at the time. It is outrageous. MacEoin is saying that the controlled experiment, the very basis of science as a whole, is unsuitable for testing homeopathy. Which puts it outside science - where it belongs.

 

[Dragon]

Ah yes, Denis MacEoin.

Do you think the Guardian's choice of homoeopathy proponents (MacEoin, Winterson, Roy) could be considered evidence of an anti-homoeopathy bias?

Your Grauniad link is an absolute treasure trove of homoeopath roasting - I see our friend Dana Ullman pops up at the end.

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

Your Grauniad link is an absolute treasure trove of homoeopath roasting - I see our friend Dana Ullman pops up at the end.

He pops up at the end?

That's a bizarre and slightly disturbing image.

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

Why homoeopathy on the NHS is in sharp decline - article in the Times UK.

"My wife's homeopathic practice has huge numbers of long-standing patients who use her much like their GP..."

Here's your foot Denis, aim carefully again and you can blow off some more toes.

I think the fact that she has "huge numbers" of "long-standing" patients is exactly my problem with the economic side of sugar peddling in the NHS.

Also, for a supposedly complete system of medicine having amazing curative powers it has clearly done damn all for those patients if they are still "long-standing".

QED

 

[Asolepius]

Ah yes, Denis MacEoin.

Do you think the Guardian's choice of homoeopathy proponents (MacEoin, Winterson, Roy) could be considered evidence of an anti-homoeopathy bias?

I've now done my homework on MacEoin. It really is a bit rich for someone with no scientific or medical education to lecture us on what a clinical trial is. His description of it exposes how little he knows about it. Frankly his woo-woo credentials are impeccable, and the demolition of his argument in the ensuing comments is a joy to read.

 

[Dragon]

He pops up at the end?

That's a bizarre and slightly disturbing image.

I think you need help - if only to get that image out of your head - you naughty little monkey.

btw, Les - what is MacEoin's doctorate in?

eta

Just looked it up myself - he's an author, linguist and Islamic expert and his PhD is in Persian/Islamic Studies - link.

 

[Mojo]

MacEoin is saying that the controlled experiment, the very basis of science as a whole, is unsuitable for testing homeopathy.

He's not the only one: Rustum Roy seems to think that RCTs aren't proper science; see the launch announcement for his new journal.

It will present articles relying on current scientific criteria as in all classical engineering and science (not the statistical legerdemain of RCT)

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

It will present articles relying on current scientific criteria as in all classical engineering and science (not the statistical legerdemain of RCT)

i.e Can't do statistics. Won't do statistics. Join me in my ignorance.