National Emergency

@Meadmaker

Oh...my....God.


So, the President says he's going to do an end run around Congress in order to keep out illegal aliens...…...and Nancy Pelosi responded by saying, "Oh, yeah. Well if we get into office, we're going to do an end run around Congress so we can take away your guns."

Thanks, Nancy. That really helps.
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Pelosi didn't say "we're going to do an end-run ...", she said that, with this precedent, a Democratic President could do that - on guns, or climate change, or health-care or whatever. A perfectly good point to make. It's not as if she's saying "We will allow Trump to establish this precedent so we can take advantage of it", is it? If it is allowed, it'll be Republicans who allow it, and they can hardly now claim ignorance of the potential consequences.
 
Meadmaker said:
Oh...my....God.


So, the President says he's going to do an end run around Congress in order to keep out illegal aliens...…...and Nancy Pelosi responded by saying, "Oh, yeah. Well if we get into office, we're going to do an end run around Congress so we can take away your guns."

Thanks, Nancy. That really helps.
Click to expand...

That's not what Pelosi said. She didn't say the Dems would do that. She's pointing out that he's setting a very bad precedent because that's what could happen when a president declares national emergencies for their own political agenda.

ETA: ninja'd by CapelDodger
 
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Meadmaker said:
Oh...my....God.


So, the President says he's going to do an end run around Congress in order to keep out illegal aliens...…...and Nancy Pelosi responded by saying, "Oh, yeah. Well if we get into office, we're going to do an end run around Congress so we can take away your guns."

Thanks, Nancy. That really helps.
Click to expand...
Actually it does as long as it stops Dictator Trump from ignoring democracy.
 
Foolmewunz said:
I agree. Trump has the same opinion of his base as Lonesome Rhodes did. He wants to go back to his original plan in December.... Give up, go to Mar A Lago, claim victory. But the alt-right kaboshed that so he had to "Go To Shutdown Tough Guy" mode and got his butt whipped then, too. Now he's going to revert to Give Up Go to Mar A Lago Claim Victory. He will declare an emergency and then count on it getting blocked. He can then get back to his first love, campaigning, and claim that he tried but was blocked by evil Democrats. He's got the sound bytes ready. "Finish That Wall".... we already did most of it according to Trump math. Dems want to let murdering terrorist rapists into your Sunday School picnics!
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"Finish the Wall!" doesn't, I think, quite hit the beat. "Finish It!" would be better, and has the advantage of being open-ended.
 
acbytesla said:
I'm telling you all again, this is theater. Trump understands the law, but doesn't want to look bad. He CANNOT shut the government down again. That was a disaster.

He also KNOWS the courts will say no. But it's the optics he cares about. This way he can declare victory and keep blaming everyone else. He can get the crazies off his back and can even use this to rally them.
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It's theatre for sure. If you think Trump understands the all nuances of what he is doing you are wrong. His thinking goes no further than his gut feelings
 
a_unique_person said:
It's theatre for sure. If you think Trump understands the all nuances of what he is doing you are wrong. His thinking goes no further than his gut feelings
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No, I don't think he does at all. This is entirely about him saving face. This is about him not wanting to appear that he "lost" or that he was "weak". Trumps entire career is based on his ability to bully others. He doesn't want to read headlines that he caved or Nancy Pelosi put a whuppin on him.
 
acbytesla said:
No, I don't think he does at all. This is entirely about him saving face. This is about him not wanting to appear that he "lost" or that he was "weak". Trumps entire career is based on his ability to bully others. He doesn't want to read headlines that he caved or Nancy Pelosi put a whuppin on him.
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But she will. That hand-grenade WILL get tossed.

An alternative is that Trump is just bluffing about calling a National Emergency. But he will still tell his base something like, "I could have done it if I wanted! But I'm a great guy so I went easy on them."
 
dudalb said:
IMHO, this is a defining moment for a lot of Republicans. What Trump is doing goes against standard Conservative doctrine:That for a long time the Presidency has gathered simply too much power for itself, well beyond what the Writers of the Consituion intended.(A statement I agree with). Now they are faced with the choice of sticking to principal or throwing principle out the window for temporary political gain. McConnell has made his choice:The hell with the Constituion. Now it is up for the other Republcians to make their choice. I am not very optimistic. The lust for power has totally corrupted the GOP.
That great line from "A Man For All Seasons" comes to mind:
"To gain the world and lose your soul is bad enough..but to sell your soul for Wales?".
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Aahh, it's only bad when a black Democrat does it.

Belz... said:
No, I mean he literally can't pass laws.
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I'm pretty sure that came as a major surprise to him back in 2017. He's had decades of fiat rule of his business empire. Why would he think the presidency would be any different?
 
Norman Alexander said:
An alternative is that Trump is just bluffing about calling a National Emergency. But he will still tell his base something like, "I could have done it if I wanted! But I'm a great guy so I went easy on them."
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It defines the unpredictability of this Presidency in that it is equally possible that he could do a NO SIGN of the bill, as he originally threatened, or sign it and then NOT declare a National Emergency, just because he likes to feel the power he has messing with people's heads.

Or he could declare the emergency and really be as stupid as we thought.
 
Meadmaker said:
Oh...my....God.


So, the President says he's going to do an end run around Congress in order to keep out illegal aliens...…...and Nancy Pelosi responded by saying, "Oh, yeah. Well if we get into office, we're going to do an end run around Congress so we can take away your guns."

Thanks, Nancy. That really helps.
Click to expand...

As others have pointed out, that's not what she said. But thanks for proving that old adage about a lie circling the globe before the truth can even get it's pants on.

The Trumpys have their lie, and they're going to run with it.
 
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Norman Alexander said:
But she will. That hand-grenade WILL get tossed.

An alternative is that Trump is just bluffing about calling a National Emergency. But he will still tell his base something like, "I could have done it if I wanted! But I'm a great guy so I went easy on them."
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Of course Pelosi use it to rally the democrats and break the GOP's spine in congress. That's what she's best at, and that statement about what a dem president could declare a national emergency is her twisting them into a very painful position.

But, as I keep reminding y'all, one of Dolt 45's defining attributes is that he's stupid. He could easily just tell his base that he's building the wall right now, and truth is that they'd go along with it, no matter what Coulter, Limbaugh, and the like scream about. Instead, he's just handing the dems another lovely gift.
 
CapelDodger said:
The operative word being "rally", because it's that campaign rally buzz Trump really craves. This is his easy escape from politics, which confuses and bores him, and gets him back to simplistic sloganising before an adoring audience.
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Which would point out that he would be bored out of his skull in a second term. Just live at Mar-a-Lago, sign all the papers there. He might easily croak in 2021.
 
Tero said:
Which would point out that he would be bored out of his skull in a second term. Just live at Mar-a-Lago, sign all the papers there. He might easily croak in 2021.
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Donny could do everyone a favour and speed that up. In fact, make it a challenge: Obama isn't dead yet, so Donny can be FIRST!
 
If he does, and if the case ends up in court, there is a real chance that the current Supreme Court will allow the appropriation of funds from other sources to be used by a Republican president, but will deny it to a Democrat.
The current SCOTUS is happy to ignore precedent if it suits its ideology.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
If he does, and if the case ends up in court, there is a real chance that the current Supreme Court will allow the appropriation of funds from other sources to be used by a Republican president, but will deny it to a Democrat.
The current SCOTUS is happy to ignore precedent if it suits its ideology.
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I would imagine the Dems are well aware of that. So it will get tied up in red tape in Congress and perhaps lower courts for a LONG time first. There are a number of entities who are prepared to launch suits. So even more time wasted...perhaps more than two years! ��
 
Norman Alexander said:
I would imagine the Dems are well aware of that. So it will get tied up in red tape in Congress and perhaps lower courts for a LONG time first. There are a number of entities who are prepared to launch suits. So even more time wasted...perhaps more than two years! ��
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This.

It is important for all the actors who want to stop Der Trumpenführer from taking this unconstitutional step, to take their turns, stagger their lawsuits and stretch it out as long as possible. Even if they manage to stall into halfway through 2020, and Trump does win, if he gets thrown out in November, then in Jan2021, the new Democrat congress and stop any wall construction dead in its tracks.
 
smartcooky said:
This.

It is important for all the actors who want to stop Der Trumpenführer from taking this unconstitutional step, to take their turns, stagger their lawsuits and stretch it out as long as possible. Even if they manage to stall into halfway through 2020, and Trump does win, if he gets thrown out in November, then in Jan2021, the new Democrat congress and stop any wall construction dead in its tracks.
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I would imagine the suits will come from various angles. First, though, he has to attempt to do something. Right now, it's all speculation as to where he'll try to find the change behind the sofa cushions. The States effected can file via one venue. Injured individuals can file via another. And the Republicans have put forth that Congress (either house) can file suit against the administration if they can prove damages.

And we all know how long it took the Red States V. Obamacare to get to just the Appellate Court levels. How long would it take one such as a suit by Congress against the Right Dishonorable Donald J. Trump?
 
Tero said:
Which would point out that he would be bored out of his skull in a second term. Just live at Mar-a-Lago, sign all the papers there. He might easily croak in 2021.
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So you're calling for Trump's assassination if he wins re-election. (Pre-emptive Rule of So, before the Poopy Dog gets to it. :cool:)
 
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