My new Question

[flume]

I did some searching on silicon in the body. I found a book published in '85, "Silicon Biochemistry". (The chemistry in this book is mostly beyond me.) I also found some information in a National Academies Press online book .
And I did a search on pubmed and found some papers.

Apparently it is now thought that silicon might play a role in optimal cartilage and bone development and some other areas. The mechanisms for this have not been worked out. No dietary requirement has been set. The role of silicon at this time is unclear. There is silicon in many foods and beverages. The normal daily intake from diet is 20-40 mg Si. Raisins have 8 mg Si/100g. Bananas have about 5 mg silicon/100g. Cooked green beans and whole wheat bread have 2 mg Si/100g.
A common vitamin/mineral supplement contains 2 mg of silicon dioxide per daily dose - this is a form of silicon with a low solubility at body pH.
There's an abstract on pubmed about the absorption and excretion of silicon in beer. Beer has about 18 mg/liter, in the apparently more bioavailable silicic acid form. In the interests of science, the researchers tested *76* different kinds of beer on healthy volunteers.

The tissue salt version of silicon, Silicea, has about .5 mg Si per gram of tissue salt in the 3x version, and .5 micrograms Si per gram in the 6X version. It is in the silicon dioxide form. A 100 mg tablet of 6X Silicea would contain .05 micrograms Si. So while there may be some undefined value for silicon in the diet, the amount of silicon in the tissue salts is small compared to the amount in diet or in conventional supplements.

 

[Kumar]

Trying to understand what Kumar was saying in his last post made my head hurt

Sorry DaveW. Actually I felt bit heart by skin pulling. Goshawk mentioning was like: suppose one said to someone that I walked two Kms. straight but being science known person other person raised objection by saying that you can't walk straight because earth is round not flat. We have to understand the practical language on the basis of what we are discussing.

The following posting wrongly appeared in first para of my reply. So pls ignore>

""Far from quartz stopping cosmic rays, cosmic rays actually go into quartz and change it, so much so that you can use it for a dating process. ""

 

[Kumar]

Flume,

Thanks for doing the search & presenting the facts. Silicea attracts me the most because it is indicated against more than 60% problems in TRS. Other problems may also be related due to its contamination in all remedies. Frankly, reasonings of many diseases & other conditions which are unknown to CMS, may find its logic by relating those with the indicated TRs.

Just for referance,

Biological Actions: Silica occurs in living organisms. It is possible that silicon may have played an important, perhaps even necessary role, in the origin of life on the earth. The pattern of deposition of silica in plants is biologically specific and it is possible to identify plants by microscopic examination of silica particles. In some cases, silica appears to be a factor in the resistance that plants offer to diseases and insects.

Human tissues often contain from 6 to 90 mg of silica per 100 grams of dry tissues. Lung tissue may vary from 10 mg in infancy to as much as 2000 mg per 100 grams in old age.

Silicon is a trace mineral that is believed to be needed in the making and maintaining of connective tissue. It is also found in bone areas that are undergoing mineralization.

Silicon may be helpful in the treatment of osteoporosis. The herb Horsetail is rich in silicon. Horsetail absorbs calcium which can then be used in the growth of bones, hair, and nails. Beer, Root Vegetables, and Whole Grains are some of its natural resources.

Reg; other biological roles of silicon it should be structural & we lose it via skin,hair, nails regularily. It is part of connective tissues & bone. Consider its special properties & about 30% exposure to us via earth crust(may be other sources also). I ,sometimes, feel it is just a differance of "heart" in plants & animals which makes its low presence in humans. pls try to relate as per my indications at: http://www.otherhealth.com/showthread.php?t=252&highlight=silicea+biological

 

[Correa Neto]

...snip...Preconcieved-- it is ok that I am preconcieved about homeopathic effects but you are opposite. ...snip...

Sorry, but you got it wrong. I, and most of the other people around here have very little preconceived ideas. We only take for granted things that can be based upon a minumum ammount of evidence, and evidence that can be tested. So, IMHO, belivers of paranormal phenomena are the ones with preconceived ideas and prejudices.

"Sensing" these rocks without using sight and touch may require a training provided these are differant in effects. Local people somewhat do have this sense. Furthur, zonal effects are their on health & vitality but to sense & get the effects-- it should be a instant/temporary exposure for a vibration or shocking type effect. Permanent residants near to any rock become resistant to that environment.

So, based on what do you claim that "Permanent residants near to any rock become resistant to that environment"? And please note that if this is true, then there are no benefitial effects at all.

Also, by personal experience, and this can be tested among a lot of other people with similar professional lives, there is no effect of the dominant rock type of a region over the people that live there or work inside it. I never felt better or worse living or working in basaltic or granitic or quartzitic areas.

And you have not answered my questions (among others)-
(1) If granite attracts you because it has quartz, then quartzites should attract even more. Is this true? If not, then the whole point you are making is not valid.

(2) Can people sense different rock types? If the anwer is yes, then prove it. And remember that JREF has some mone awaiting for these people, as well as a lot of mining companies.

Now finally, we can conclude in consideration of above discussions that there can not be any measurable cosmic effect of cosmic rays(other than sunlight) on human bodies. Acoordingly, all the mentionings in any spritual or alternatve system suggesting the cosmic effects, are false without any science in them. However to assume, any effect is there of any spritual or alternative's cosmic mentioning-- that would be by, within the body (endogenous) changes but not from any outside cosmic source(except sunlight). Is it clear now?

Other people have already pointed the problems with the way you formulated your questions. I will just add that there is not a single evidence for the existence of a spirit or something similar. Threfore the question is pointless.

So, what about trying to use an alternate approach? To you it would be alternate- test your claims, do not start from the principle that there is an effect, that homeopathy works or that there are paranormal phenomena. Think like this- if this is true, what else would happen ? You will see that paranormal phenomena, homeopathy etc. fail these tests.

 

[Kumar]

Correa Neto,

Thanks for the discussions. In view of these discussions, we can now finally conclude that on earth we don't have any measurable biological effects on humans of cosmic rays(other than sunlight) AND of granite & other rocks. Is it ok now??

 

[Correa Neto]

Correa Neto,

Thanks for the discussions. In view of these discussions, we can now finally conclude that on earth we don't have any measurable biological effects on humans of cosmic rays(other than sunlight) AND of granite & other rocks. Is it ok now??

I would add `at present levels of radiation`to the `cosmis rays` item. If a nearby massive star goes supernova, this may change.

 

[Kumar]

OK it will be finaly that : we don't have any measurable biological effects on humans of cosmic rays at present levels of radiation on earth (other than sunlight) AND of granite & other rocks.

Now what about sunlight? What can be possible effects( directly or indirectly) of sunlight on humans? Can change in body's biochemistry OR changed biochemistry create differant effects in differant individuals of sunlight?

 

[Rolfe]

Kumar, for the hundredth time.

Most people here (and all of the scientists) do not believe that your tissue salt remedies have any effect at all. This is partly because they know, just as you do, that there's nothing in them that isn't present in much greater quantities in our food and everyday life. They also know that shaking and grinding and pulverising make no difference to the properties of the stuff. They also know that there are no particles of silica in or around mammalian cells, healthy or diseased, and that consuming a tiny amount of ground glass or however the remedy is presented will have no effect on the body.

But mostly they believe there is no effect because there is no evidence for any effect. Not one single credible, reproducible study.

You can speak of your own personal beliefs all you like, and do a Xanta on us by telling us how many other people share these beliefs, but bear in mind that we know of people who believe many, many impossible and contradictory things just as fervently, and we know very well how these beliefs come about (the article on "Why Bogus Therapies Seem to Work"). We have no reason at all to believe that you are in a different category.

Until you come up with some actual independent and verifiable evidence, we will remain sceptical, indeed outright incredulous. Asking us to assume that there is such an effect, and then critique a series of bizarre and ill-conceived theories you've dreamed up, and even to dream up theories of our own, isn't going to work.

Show us the evidence that there is an effect before you ask us to find a mechanism of action. And although I know you won't listen, I'll say once again that the best intellectual treat you could give yourself is to consider, seriously, the possibility that you might be mistaken.

Rolfe.

 

[Correa Neto]

Now what about sunlight? What can be possible effects( directly or indirectly) of sunlight on humans? Can change in body's biochemistry OR changed biochemistry create differant effects in differant individuals of sunlight?

Of course, but not the one you are looking for.

You´ll get a suntan, a sunburn or, in the worst-case scenario, a skin cancer. All of these will change your skin´s biochemistry. And different individuals will react on different ways, depending on their skin color and how used they are to exposure to sunlight. Sunlight intensity will also have a great influence.

And note that similar effects can be obtained exposing the subjects to UV or IR lights. The "Sun rays" we are bathed in are composed by EM waves in the visible, IR and UV.

 

[Kumar]

Thanks. Don't we get anything from sunlight as a source of energy to our body (directly or indirectly)? Pls tell both beneficial & harmful effects.

 

[Rolfe]

Thanks. Don't we get anything from sunlight as a source of energy to our body (directly or indirectly)? Pls tell both beneficial & harmful effects.

Harmful effects (sunburn, skin cancer etc.) have already been discussed. Beneficial effects (vitamin D synthesis) also.

Source of energy? Kumar, you're not green, are you? (I mean this literally, any methaphorical significance is entirely at the reader's discretion.) Plants can use sunlight as a source of energy, because they have the right metabolism. Chlorophyll and so on. Animal's can't. That's one of the main differences between plants and animals. Plants harness the energy, animals benefit by eating the plants.

Basic school-level biology, Kumar.

Rolfe.

 

[Kumar]

Hello Rolfe,

Where were you I missed you.

I ask here again just to refresh. As you are in touch with this field regularily, no one knows if there is any addition or deduction to any theory.

Are these the only effects of sunlight. Can direct or diluted/indirect/reflected sunlight also be beneficial in some sense other than vitamin D synthesis?

 

[Badly Shaved Monkey]

Hello Rolfe,

Where were you I missed you.

I ask here again just to refresh. As you are in touch with this field regularily, no one knows if there is any addition or deduction to any theory.

Are these the only effects of sunlight. Can direct or diluted/indirect/reflected sunlight also be beneficial in some sense other than vitamin D synthesis?

Sunlight makes me feel happy. This is of course via effects on on my pineal gland (reptilian 3rd eye) mediated via melatonin.

Whoooshhhhhh.....another hare is set running. Off you go and do the research then come back with the hypotheses that these references must generate. We'll be waiting when you get back.

 

[The Don]

Sunlight has (alleged ?) affects on the level of seratonin in the brain and is (indicated to be ?) effective in treating Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD).

http://wtcareer.wtamu.edu/cou/depress.htm

I suppose it makes sense in the far North after all the Finnish are seasonally bipolar as a nation. Nothing magic though, I expect that it's just that all that cold and darkness makes us feel sleepy.

 

[Rolfe]

Hello Rolfe,

Where were you I missed you.

Working. Specifically, moving a pretty big diagnostic laboratory testing business into brand spanking new premises. Cost us a fortune, but very nice indeed, thank you very much.

BSM, I imagine you will be a recipient of the ensuing marketing bonanza some time next week!

And I've still got far too much to do, but then I'm a congenital procrastinator and it's a lovely afternoon.... Like they said, sunlight makes us feel happy, and that's even if we're only looking at it out of a window. (The trees and the grass and the blue sky don't hurt either.)

Kumar, we really do have a problem. Can I refer you to my slightly earlier post above, which I think you may not have read.

Kumar, for the hundredth time.

Most people here (and all of the scientists) do not believe that your tissue salt remedies have any effect at all....

Please concentrate on the fact that you have to convince us that there is a real therapeutic effect of your tissue salt remedies. Your own personal beliefs, even the personal beliefs of many people, don't count. We know of too many utterly bogus treatments espoused just as fervently by others, and we know why they believe these things (coincidental recovery, and imagining an improvement even where none has really happened are the top ones, for the rest see Why Bogus Therapies Seem to Work). We see no reason to assume that there is anything different about your belief.

So, saying to us, trust me, there is an effect there, now we have to find the mechanism of action, won't work. Everything you suggest is far-fetched and frankly preposterous. For us, seeing how unlikely it is that there is any effect there at all (after all, there's nothing in the remedies but trace amounts of things we ingest in far greater quantities every day in food, and we know that shaking, grinding, pulverising and diluting makes no difference at all to these substances), we will never get away from the overwhelmingly obvious retort that your hypotheses are fanciful, and the far more likely explanation is that there is nothing of the sort going on.

Tell us what we are trying to explain, before we can even think about explaining it. Give us a measurable, reproducible, concrete effect to explain and we'll have a go. But just "I took this stuff and then I got better" is most economically explained by coincidence.

Rolfe.

 

[Kumar]

Hello BSM,Don,BSM....,

Cosmic effect plays a big role in all or most spritual systems. It takes time & energy to deny those completely. Ours is just a minimal trial. I am bit convinced about non sunlight cosmic effect & now trying sunlight's possibilities. However, I feel slightly that whatever of this type happening if there, that can only be by 'within the body's changes or at the most by 'near the body's effects' & it may be misinterpreted but possible aspect if we see it correctly. All other unsolved aspects may be of similar logic.

You will not accept TRS till you are convinced about their working logic. Since, it may be the only "Supreme's spritual medication system" I don't want your much involvements for insulting or contradicting it(you may therefore find least contradictions about it). You have not replied my one question of "effect of taste or sensation on our physiology" which was related to its working logic trial.

Best wishes.

 

[Correa Neto]

Kumar,

I am glad that you are thinking about what is being posted here in this thread. You seem to have been convinced regarding the "cosmic rays" and rocks issues. Please note that the basis of science is questioning. And, in many cases (many? better say most), people who belive in pararnormal phenomena just can´t accept that. Questioning is OK for them, but only when used against anyone else´s claims. Theirs are above all critics...

I would also like to point the following-

Sure, "Cosmic effect plays a big role in all or most spiritual systems." But note that when these belief systems, disciplines or religions were created (at least their basis), mankind´s current knoweledge of the universe was primitive at best. So, they will not withstand when faced with our current knoweledge.
Remember that when some of these systems were created, it was "known" that:

- The Earth was flat (and supported by a number of things that could be turtles, trees, etc.);
- The Sun spinned around the Earth, that was the center of the universe;
- The planets and the sun moved inside crystal spheres
And the list could go on.

So, does the very word "cosmic" had by then the same meaning it has now? No. The concept of cosmos changed from culture to culture and from time to time. So, in your sentence "Cosmic effect plays a big role in all or most spiritual systems", the word "cosmic" can not be used with its current meaning. The sentence can only have meanings inside the context of the cultural backgrounds of these religious systems. Try to find a sense for this sentence within current scientific knoweledge is illogicall.

And please note that the same reasoning can be used for the word "spiritual".

 

[Kumar]

Sorry, it was Hello BSM,Don, Rolfe...., instead of Hello BSM,Don,BSM...., in my previous posting.

Rolfe, best wishes for your new set up.

Correa Neto, It is okay to understand anything updated with latest research. But few things can be wrong with the current research also. I think there can be some "name changes & language differances" in ancient/spritual's mentionings & Modren knowledge. It may be possible that highly talented saints of older times might be knowing that " Earth is round " but for practical purposes they/others had used to call it as flat. I think ancient/older/classical astrological calculations are based on "Earth is round".

I am not sure but it looks that all or most " spritual effects" or also said as "cosmic effects" can just be as "Sunlight effects+ Changes within the body's effects- due to any sensation or stimulation, but can be just similar effects as indicated . Eg., we keep fasts as per religious advices & is said to remove sins. If we as a scientist look it in this language we may say there is no sin, religion's effect but if we look in other way, we can find its benefits as said indirectly. Probably, we can define 'sin' as our inherited & aquired manifestation of imbalances & accumulations.

 

[Rolfe]

Probably, we can define 'sin' as our inherited & aquired manifestation of imbalances & accumulations.

Personally, I define "sin" as doing or something immoral or unethical, in a pretty wide sense. There is nobody to blame but myself.

Your mileage may vary.

If you want to look on your Tissue Remedies as faith healing, fine. Just don't expect to find any physical, biochemical or physiological explanation for the effects you think you're seeing.

Rolfe.

 

[Kumar]

Rolfe,

Does the taste or sensation of any food or other substance to any sensory part of our body creates some physiological changes in our bodies to handle that food or substance accordingly, or not? If yes, then What will happen to body if we taste or sense but do not take that food or substance physically?

Just to pursue our understanding on TRS awnser to this Q is important.