Mueller Investigation pt5

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acbytesla said:
Force him to live the rest of his life in a cardboard box in an alley in Chicago. That'll work.
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I'll settle for life in the skeeviest Motel 6 in the country, sans housekeeping services. After he's released from the NY state prison system that is.
 
Fast Eddie B said:
That doesn't count the sentence he's going to get from the new state charges.
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If convicted, of course.
In our desire for retribution, we should not abandon core principles.
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True, innocent until proven guilty and all that.

I guess its easy when you're dealing with someone who's already been found guilty to assume the worst of them.

By the way, is anyone familiar enough with the new charges to know if they are impacted by New York's double jeopardy laws? There does seem to be some overlap between the charges from his first trial and the new state charges? There does seem to be some overlap between them.
 
Fast Eddie B said:
From the “It couldn’t happen to a nicer guy” files:

CNN - Prosecutors with the Manhattan district attorney's office announced state fraud charges Wednesday against Paul Manafort.

The announcement adds to the legal trouble for Donald Trump's former campaign chairman, who is already facing years in prison on federal charges.
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And if found guilty, those convictions are pardon-proof! Trump will have nothing to dangle in front of him for his keeping his mouth shut.

Also, in all probability, if found guilty, he would be transferred directly from federal prison to New York state penitentiary to serve whatever time he gets there after he finishes serving his federal time

Manafort really could end up dying in prison, made all the more likely if he is as sick as he claims to be. If so, then good job - I have no sympathy for him. He is a lying, cheating piece of filth whose greed has almost certainly led to the deaths of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of people.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/03/paul-manafort-beneficiary-of-americas-sentencing-gap.html
 
varwoche said:
I'll settle for life in the skeeviest Motel 6 in the country, sans housekeeping services. After he's released from the NY state prison system that is.
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There are millions of Americans who live on the streets. Manafort lived the high life for 68 years. Give him a taste of of how many people who aren't criminals are forced to live. He can get SNAP to feed himself.
 
Segnosaur said:
True, innocent until proven guilty and all that.

I guess its easy when you're dealing with someone who's already been found guilty to assume the worst of them.
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Of course, the NY State prosecutors will be able to use all the sworn statements that he has made under oath, and all the admissions of guilt he has made in both the Virginia and Washington DC federal trials, as evidence in their action against him. I think the chances of a not guilty verdict rest somehwere between ZERO and ZIPPO.

Segnosaur said:
By the way, is anyone familiar enough with the new charges to know if they are impacted by New York's double jeopardy laws? There does seem to be some overlap between the charges from his first trial and the new state charges? There does seem to be some overlap between them.
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Residential mortgage fraud - 3 counts
Attempting to commit residential mortgage fraud - 1 count
Conspiracy - 3 counts
Falsifying business records - 8 counts
Running a scheme to defraud - 1 count

Total 16 indictments.
 
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smartcooky said:
Manafort really could end up dying in prison, made all the more likely if he is as sick as he claims to be. If so, then good job - I have no sympathy for him. He is a lying, cheating piece of filth whose greed has almost certainly led to the deaths of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of people.
http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/03/paul-manafort-beneficiary-of-americas-sentencing-gap.html
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Am I the only one who doesn't buy this wheelchair act? Only a year ago, I watched him almost run up the courthouse steps in a five thousand dollar suit.
 
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smartcooky said:
By the way, is anyone familiar enough with the new charges to know if they are impacted by New York's double jeopardy laws? There does seem to be some overlap between the charges from his first trial and the new state charges? There does seem to be some overlap between them.
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Residential mortgage fraud - 3 counts
Attempting to commit residential mortgage fraud - 1 count
Conspiracy - 3 counts
Falsifying business records - 8 counts
Running a scheme to defraud - 1 count

Total 16 indictments.
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Yes, but at least some of the charges Manafort faced in the first trial involved bank fraud related to real estate. I'm just concerned that some of these new charges might get thrown out because they are related to incidents and charges he's been on trial for federally.
 
acbytesla said:
Am I the only one who buys this wheelchair act? Only a year ago, I watched him almost run up the courthouse steps in a five thousand dollar suit.
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Don't you mean "only one who doesn't buy his wheelchair act"?

It certainly does look like he's trying to evoke some false sympathy.
 
Segnosaur said:
Don't you mean "only one who doesn't buy his wheelchair act"?

It certainly does look like he's trying to evoke some false sympathy.
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Yes...I mean no, I don't buy it. Damn, that's a double negative. :o :confused:

Thanks, I'll change it.
 
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theprestige said:
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the mechanics of this.
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Pretty much any business/organization with a decent security group will have twitter completely blocked off. Thus, even if their employer is fine with them coming here on lunch/breaks they can't get to the feed or view tweets embedded in peoples posts.
 
Segnosaur said:
Yes, but at least some of the charges Manafort faced in the first trial involved bank fraud related to real estate. I'm just concerned that some of these new charges might get thrown out because they are related to incidents and charges he's been on trial for federally.
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Well here is my understanding of why these might not be "double jeopardy".

The defendant Commits three Crimes - crime "A", crime "B" and crime "C"

The defendant is charged with two of those crimes "A" and "B"

The evidence used to convict the defendant includes admissions that he committed crime "C"

Since he has not been charged with crime "C" he can still be charged with it. The only occasions on which he might not be able to be charged with crime "C" are are if his admission to crime "C" came after invoking his 5A rights, and a subsequent a non-prosecution agreement where he has been granted immunity from prosecution for that crime..... by the Feds.

However, even if the defendant and Federal prosecutors came to a non-prosecution agreement or an immunity deal, the State prosecutors would not be bound by it.


Apply this template to Paul Manafort....

Crime A = Tax evasion
Crime B = Bank fraud
Crime C = Mortgage fraud
 
theprestige said:
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the mechanics of this. CS reposts Trump's twitter feed so that people will see it. He has to repost, because people aren't looking at the twitter feed itself. People aren't looking at the feed because they find it unpleasant to look at. People are grateful to CS for showing it to them anyway.
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I don't have twitter at work. I've had my IT people block twitter and reddit.

I rely on Capt Swoop's postings to keep me up with the latest in Dolt 45's stupdity
 
smartcooky said:
Yes, but at least some of the charges Manafort faced in the first trial involved bank fraud related to real estate. I'm just concerned that some of these new charges might get thrown out because they are related to incidents and charges he's been on trial for federally.
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Well here is my understanding of why these might not be "double jeopardy".

The defendant Commits three Crimes - crime "A", crime "B" and crime "C"

The defendant is charged with two of those crimes "A" and "B"

The evidence used to convict the defendant includes admissions that he committed crime "C"

Since he has not been charged with crime "C" he can still be charged with it. The only occasions on which he might not be able to be charged with crime "C" are are if his admission to crime "C" came after invoking his 5A rights, and a subsequent a non-prosecution agreement where he has been granted immunity from prosecution for that crime..... by the Feds.
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Yes, I get all that.

My concern (in this context) is that the Feds have charged someone with crimes A and B, and now the state is coming in to likewise charge someone with the same crimes.

Apply this template to Paul Manafort....

Crime A = Tax evasion
Crime B = Bank fraud
Crime C = Mortgage fraud
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In Manafort's case, one of the crimes he's already been convicted of federally involve taking out a loan on a property that already had mortgage debt, so the list of federal crimes may already include a 'C'.

(In some cases, I'm not sure what the difference between bank fraud and mortgage fraud is, since there does seem to be some overlap.)
 
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