Most Important Technology for Allies in WW2

[Jack by the hedge]

I wonder, does anybody know the maximum range of the various German planes and what was the Northernmost raid they attempted?

The mainstay was probably the Heinkel 111, Junkers 88 and Dornier 17. Wiki says the first two had a range of around 1,500 miles (don't know about fully laden, though) but the dornier considerablty less. They certainly reached Aberdeen and Belfast from Northern France or the low countries.

 

[Simon39759]

It's seem that the distance is about 788 miles.
So, for a round trip, the Germans were probably cutting it pretty close...

Now, I am wondering if running out of fuel on the trip back was a common occurrence...


(I think the first website my not have taken the French coast, still, a cursory glance here seems to suggest that the actual distance must have been in the 600 miles or so...)

 

[Laton]

The US also had excellent windtunnel technology Page on NACA contributions to aviation tech during the war.

What follows is a description of a few of the major research projects including drag cleanup, deicing, engine development, low-drag wing, stability and control, compressibility, ditching and seaplane studies.

 

[Ove]

This is from the mid 30's Italian Navy. Pretty standard stuff for most of the time. In WW2 a spitfire variant used to rocket assisted of the bow of merchant ships in convoys

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHUo2czKork

Those were Hurricanes (the Spit was 1. too valueable and 2. not as robust), the CAM project where Merchantmen was fitted with a catapult and two Hurricanes. It was a "stopgap" and their main task was shooting down the FW200 "Spyplanes" that was tailing the conwoys and directing u boats. They were somewhat sucessfull but was rendered obsolete with the introduction og the "Jeep Carriers".

The Brits actually worked out the perfect system with Tank Killers where their tank squadrons was formed in groups, some Shermans and one Sherman Firefly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherman_Firefly which probably was the best tank killer in ww2.

The single thing that "won the war" was primarily production capacity, -jus' like that..

The stupitidy of Hitler and the religious fanaticism of the Jap leaders helped a lot because it prevented good planning on a lot of occations. That Hitler tolerated Goerings massive blunders again and again f.inst. Goering and his henchmen totally misjuged the way RAF was organized and completely failed to identify the proper targets. The Battle of Britain is riddled with attacs on non important airfields and other stupid things and they completely misunderstood how the British control system functioned which helped Dowding a lot.

Single things that won the war: PENICILLIN - The DC3 - The Liberty Ship - The 5ton Truck - The Higgins Boat - The Merlin Engine - The .50 cal maching Gun and the Nuclear bomb in the end.

 

[Tolls]

The mainstay was probably the Heinkel 111, Junkers 88 and Dornier 17. Wiki says the first two had a range of around 1,500 miles (don't know about fully laden, though) but the dornier considerablty less. They certainly reached Aberdeen and Belfast from Northern France or the low countries.

It's seem that the distance is about 788 miles.
So, for a round trip, the Germans were probably cutting it pretty close...

Now, I am wondering if running out of fuel on the trip back was a common occurrence...


(I think the first website my not have taken the French coast, still, a cursory glance here seems to suggest that the actual distance must have been in the 600 miles or so...)

The northern raids were flown from Norway generally.
That's where the Aberdeen ones came from.
For example Stavanger (which was one of the airfields) is about 425 miles away from Glasgow, and 300+ from Aberdeen.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

The northern raids were flown from Norway generally.
That's where the Aberdeen ones came from.
For example Stavanger (which was one of the airfields) is about 425 miles away from Glasgow, and 300+ from Aberdeen.

That was my initial assumption, but I was swayed by wiki saying the Belfast raiders returned to their airfields in France.

I was aware the Germans also flew from Norway and Denmark as my daughter's project also led me to research a relative who is resting somewhere at the bottom of the Skagerrak after his Halifax encountered a group of Ju88s flying out of Grove in Denmark.

 

[Tolls]

That was my initial assumption, but I was swayed by wiki saying the Belfast raiders returned to their airfields in France.

I was aware the Germans also flew from Norway and Denmark as my daughter's project also led me to research a relative who is resting somewhere at the bottom of the Skagerrak after his Halifax encountered a group of Ju88s flying out of Grove in Denmark.

Don't know about Belfast.
Stavanger to Belfast is over 500 miles, so northern France may be nearer (Brest is about the same distance to Belfast as Stavanger is to Glasgow).

 

[catsmate]

Again I will recommend The Great Tank Scandal: Part 1: British Armour in the Second World War by David Fletcher (Curator of the Bovington Tank Museum)
It tells the sotry of British Armour from immediately pre war up to the Dieppe Raid. A sorry story it is as well.

This is getting very much off the subject of the OP though.

Yep we are a bit.
Fletcher's book is excellent, I met him a couple of times and have his podcasts. I particularly like how the Germans developed a solution for the problems with the Churchill's tracks in a few days while Britain never managed it....


Tank design is a tradeoff: for example more armour means lower speed and range or a larger engine and more fuel, which means a larger hull necessitating more armour and so on.

 

[catsmate]

Then about how fast did a WWII fighter need to be going in order to be airborne? (And what were their top speeds like?)

And how long were these aircraft-launching strips on battleships & cruisers with the catapults in them, and where were they located? I don't think I've ever seen them and can't picture where they'd fit in.

Typical catapults could accelerate aircraft up to 20 tonnes or so to about 12m/s and were 30m or so long, powered by steam, compressed air or explosive. Location depended on the vessel, on top of the uppermost gun turret(s) was popular.
This shows a floatplane on the USS Indianapolis's starboard waist catapult while this is from the USS California with the catapult mounted over the #3 gun turret; this picture from the USS Tennessee gives a good view of the floatplane on the aft catapult, mounted on the #3 (rear superfiring) turret and similarly for the USS California. Note how short the launch rails are, most of the take off acceleration is from the catapult.

 

[Simon39759]

The northern raids were flown from Norway generally.
That's where the Aberdeen ones came from.
For example Stavanger (which was one of the airfields) is about 425 miles away from Glasgow, and 300+ from Aberdeen.

Duh! I should have thought about that option... I dunno why I was fixated on France as a spot of provenance...

 

[Ove]

Duh! I should have thought about that option... I dunno why I was fixated on France as a spot of provenance...

The Germans flew raids for Denmark and Norway also during the Battle of Britain and was mislead into believing that all fighters would be busy in the South. The scene in the movie "The Battle of Britain" where Christofer Plummers squadron encounters a group of Bombers coming from Denmark is based on a real event. The bombers were shot up so badly that the Germans halted all such attacs for a long period.
The Radar girls actually didn't believe their plot at first because it was so clear.

 

[Andy_Ross]

The Brits actually worked out the perfect system with Tank Killers where their tank squadrons was formed in groups, some Shermans and one Sherman Firefly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherman_Firefly which probably was the best tank killer in ww2.

Ratio was 1 to 4. This was entirely due to the numbers of 17pdr guns available. It was also used as a towed weapon and mounted in the style of a german Self PRopellin AT gun in the Archer based on the Valentine and issued to artillery Anti Tank regiments. It was also used in the Challenger (Cruiser Mk 8) although faster than the Firefly it was more complex to produce and prodution stopped after 200. Towards the end of the war the Comet and the Centurion also mounted the 17pdr. Comet is the tank the Cromwell should have been and was used up unti 1958 in British service and alsewhere into the 70s. Centurion of course is a classicand was in use until recently with the 105mm gun.

 

[catsmate]

Ratio was 1 to 4. This was entirely due to the numbers of 17pdr guns available. It was also used as a towed weapon and mounted in the style of a german Self PRopellin AT gun in the Archer based on the Valentine and issued to artillery Anti Tank regiments. It was also used in the Challenger (Cruiser Mk 8) although faster than the Firefly it was more complex to produce and prodution stopped after 200. Towards the end of the war the Comet and the Centurion also mounted the 17pdr. Comet is the tank the Cromwell should have been and was used up unti 1958 in British service and alsewhere into the 70s. Centurion of course is a classicand was in use until recently with the 105mm gun.

There was also the issue that many Shermans's weren't suitable for conversion to Firefly configuration. Of all the Shermans available only the Sherman I and V (M4, M4A4) were suitable and only those with Oilgear traversing gear.


There were a number of problems with British tank armament early in WW2. The Crusader/Covenanter cruiser tanks were designed around the 40mm/2pdr gun and there had been no consideration given to upgunning them.
It wasn't until the Cromwell generation that a larger gun (the 57mm/6pdr) was standardised; however the length development process for the Cromwell meant it was obsolescent before entering service. This wasn't helped by shortages of the 6pdr gun as it wasn't initially designed for turret use but as a towed AT gun.
The development of the 3in/17pdr was carried out by the Royal Artillery, rather than the Royal Tank Regiment, as AT guns (towed and SP) fell under their jurisdiction; this process started in late 1940. However it wasn't until 1942 that a tank to mount the 17pdr (the A30 Challenger, a less armoured Cromwell derivative).
The two tanks Captain_Swoop mentions, A34 Comet and A40 Centurion, were both proposed in mid 1943 after the A30 concept was dropped; both were designed from scratch to carry the 17pdr.
The Firefly was the (unofficial) brainchild of Brighty and Witheridge, both majors in the RTR, and both concerned about tank firepower¹. After much experimentation they developed a rigid mount for the 17pdr in a Sherman turret, using the tank hull mass to absorb the recoil. They were of course ordered to end the experiments² . Luckily for British tank crews Witheridge had some senior friends and the project was put on an official basis.
Technically speaking the Firefly conversion is clunky; a hole was cut in the rear turret armour and a box welded on externally to hold the radio sets, a modified 17pdr was fitted on its side into the turret. Ammunition stowage and handling was awkward due to the size of the 17pdr rounds. However it did work.



¹ Witheridge especially, he'd been involved in hard fighting in the western desert including having a Grant blown out from under him and was a proponent of a tank gun with good AP and HE capability.
² They were also asked to account for the Sherman used in their experiments which was not obtained officially.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Comet didn't actualy have the 17pdr. It was a 'hybrid, it had the same calibre as the 17 but had a shorter barrel and was chambered for ammunition using the 17lber shell but a cartridge from the 3inch AA gun. This was shorter and easier to stow and handle in the turret.

 

[catsmate]

Comet didn't actualy have the 17pdr. It was a 'hybrid, it had the same calibre as the 17 but had a shorter barrel and was chambered for ammunition using the 17lber shell but a cartridge from the 3inch AA gun. This was shorter and easier to stow and handle in the turret.

Woops, I'd forgotten about the 77mm hybrid gun. Wasn't that used in a British tank destroyer design also? I don't have my references to hand.
I wonder if there were any experiments with mating the 77mm gun to a Sherman.

 

[Andy_Ross]

By the time Comet was being designed Centurion was also under development, I don't think tghey would have wanted to risk disrupting production of the Firefly, they couldn't turn them out fast enough as it was.