Momentum Transfer in WTC

[Lisa Simpson]

Maybe the same little sparklies, as the building collapses?

ETA: I saw a sparkly, about a quarter of the way up the building, just before it falls.

 

[Kent1]

Whats odd about this video? I didnt see anything other than a slow whitish jet of smoke/debris coming out of an area a few floors below where the collapse started. Is there something else I was supposed to see?

I tried to explain that. No your supposed to see bombs.
I also tried to explain that photos also show much more detail. I also suggested he should get a photo or better video.

Look at all of the white dots here
http://www.oilempire.us/graphics/wtc-southtower.jpg

I'll come back later.

 

[apathoid]

I tried to explain that. No your supposed to see bombs.
I also tried to explain that photos also show much more detail. I also suggested he should get a photo or better video.

Look at all of the white dots here
http://www.oilempire.us/graphics/wtc-southtower.jpg

Gosh, thats some picture. How did that photographer avoid getting killed by falling debris? I'm sure "truth"seeker will claim the photo is evidence of Thermite, however.

 

[Loss Leader]

Look at all of the white dots here
http://www.oilempire.us/graphics/wtc-southtower.jpg

Great picture. Are you aware that the site hosting the picture is home to a grade A certified nutball?

 

[WildCat]

Gosh, thats some picture. How did that photographer avoid getting killed by falling debris? I'm sure "truth"seeker will claim the photo is evidence of Thermite, however.

And it also has not been pulverized into powder before falling...

 

[WildCat]

Gumboot - On cheaper tapes, the first few inches of the tape sometimes didn't have any magnetic coating at all. Anything that you tried to record on that first part was lost. What was that first part of the tape called?

I believe that would be the leader.

 

[Loss Leader]

I believe that would be the leader.

The loss leader to be exact.

I am such a dork.

 

[Gravy]

PLease watch this video, it is the one that Ross talks about and analyzes.

http://italy.indymedia.org/uploads/2005/03/wtc2-demolition-2.avi

Video is helpful here as opposed to photos, because the duration of flash is important. The above link is a nice quality. There is absolutely no falling debris of any kind where the flash on the corner occurs. I am very curious to see to what length you guys will go to deny was is seen in this video. There are several other explosions evident, but let's comment on the one that occurs about halfway up the near corner.

Ah, you're on the south tower "flashes." My very first debunking. It sure takes me back. So, Truthseeker, what do those bright spots tell you?

 

[gumboot]

Gumboot - On cheaper tapes, the first few inches of the tape sometimes didn't have any magnetic coating at all. Anything that you tried to record on that first part was lost. What was that first part of the tape called?

Just out of curiosity, what's the purpose of this question?

I'm aware of quite a few names for it. "Leader" would be one (the name originates from the transparent celluloid that perpetually runs through a film processing machine at a lab, which the film stock is attached to).

In post-production it's usually referred to as "roll-back". We seldom referred to it directly because you always lay down bars and tone and 30" of black before you record anything anyway. So the beginning of the tape was usually just called "bars and tone" or "black". Modern tape recorders and playback machines spool through the leader automatically anyway, so you can't record onto it.

-Andrew

 

[gumboot]

Gosh, thats some picture. How did that photographer avoid getting killed by falling debris? I'm sure "truth"seeker will claim the photo is evidence of Thermite, however.

I could be mistaken, but I believe that photographer was killed on 9/11. Their camera was recovered, and the photos developed, however.

It is an incredible photograph. Note all the fine particles of debris - clear sign of a very fast shutter speed. You don't normally see that in video footage because the exposure time for each frame is too long, thus tiny particles like that just blur into the sky and vanish.

Using a very high electronic shutter speed (on a video camera) or a narrow shutter angle (on a film camera) captures sharper details like small pieces of dirt and debris, and produces the distinct "strobing" effect that was used most distinctly in works like "Saving Private Ryan", "Band of Brothers", "Gladiator", and "Black Hawk Down".

-Andrew

 

[Loss Leader]

Just out of curiosity, what's the purpose of this question?

It's just how I chose my screen name, is all.

 

[apathoid]

I could be mistaken, but I believe that photographer was killed on 9/11. Their camera was recovered, and the photos developed, however.

It is an incredible photograph. Note all the fine particles of debris - clear sign of a very fast shutter speed. You don't normally see that in video footage because the exposure time for each frame is too long, thus tiny particles like that just blur into the sky and vanish.

Using a very high electronic shutter speed (on a video camera) or a narrow shutter angle (on a film camera) captures sharper details like small pieces of dirt and debris, and produces the distinct "strobing" effect that was used most distinctly in works like "Saving Private Ryan", "Band of Brothers", "Gladiator", and "Black Hawk Down".

-Andrew

It really burns me up that a CT site is hosting that photo if the photographer gave his life taking it.

 

[TruthSeeker1234]

You OCT's sure can't answer direct questions, can you?

We can talk about this picture too, if you like

It's very interesting. In this picture, the "white dots" do appear to be pieces of debris, unlike in the video I linked, where large flashes appear and disappear suddenly in the exact place where the structure breaks.

But this picture of WTC2 is quite revealing for another reason. The top of the tower is falling away from the right side. Yet large clouds of dust and smoke are exiting and growing on the right side. What is the explanation for this? Pressure from above? Can't be. The top is falling the other way, increasing pressure on the opposite side, but relieving pressure (if anything) on this side.

 

[David Wong]

Here is your answer. Please read this. I concur with this study, as it proceeds scientifically, trying to construct a demolition theory which is consistent with the observations.

http://gordonssite.tripod.com/id2.html

Waaaait a second. That guy is posting the pics of workers standing around "Angle cut" beams to support his theory for those supports being cut at a 45-degree angle as part of a controlled demolition.

No way those could have been cut by the workers who were there cutting on the wreckage, right?

http://www.jod911.com/evidence.pdf

 

[TruthSeeker1234]

those angle cuts are a whole subject. I suspect they were cut as part of the demolition, based on the slag, and that these types of cuts are typical in demolitions. However, there certainly were welders at GZ cutting up steel, and we don't know for sure when the picture was taken.

 

[Loss Leader]

But this picture of WTC2 is quite revealing for another reason. The top of the tower is falling away from the right side. Yet large clouds of dust and smoke are exiting and growing on the right side. What is the explanation for this? Pressure from above? Can't be. The top is falling the other way, increasing pressure on the opposite side, but relieving pressure (if anything) on this side.

Even I, with NO engineering background, can answer this one. The top of the tower is not falling away from the right side. Once again, you are looking at a two-dimensional picture and imagining that it is giving you more information than it really is.

As we know, tower two fell entirely within its own footprint. Heck, the "footprint" argument has been a centerpiece of CTist nonsense for years. So, the top of tower two can't be falling over to the left.

In fact, the top of tower two is being pulled inwards, towards the core. Oh, it's leaning left, alright. But it's actually doing so entirely within the tower's footprint as the collapse of the core brings it in and down. So there is no "release" of pressure on the right side. Pressure is still equal on all sides of the tower. And it's quite a lot of pressure blowing drywall and paper all the hell over the place.

And please, please, please stop making engineering pronouncements based on pictures. It's just that ... well ... you're not very good.

 

[CurtC]

It's just how I chose my screen name, is all.

I've always heard of the non-magnetic first part of a tape being called the "leader."

The term "loss leader" is a common term, but means something completely different. At least in my experience.

 

[apathoid]

....{good stuff}.....

And please, please, please stop making engineering pronouncements based on pictures. It's just that ... well ... you're not very good.

..and not very scientific either.

 

[apathoid]

those angle cuts are a whole subject. I suspect they were cut as part of the demolition, based on the slag, and that these types of cuts are typical in demolitions. However, there certainly were welders at GZ cutting up steel, and we don't know for sure when the picture was taken.

{bolding mine}

"Truth"seeker, you should know better - this isnt the Loose Change forum. Noone here is going to believe you without evidence.

a.) So can you explain how Thermite can make a perfectly straight 45 degree cut like that?? I mean really explain it, or point me to someone who can.

b.) Can you explain how the 45 degree cut is typical of a demolition?

c.) Can you point me to any CD in the history of the business that used Thermite, so that (b.) is actually possible.

 

[TruthSeeker1234]

loss said

As we know, tower two fell entirely within its own footprint.

Absolutley false. A very large percentage of both twin towers landed way outside the footprint. Steel and aluminum and concrete dust were projected hundreds of feet in all directions. Please, look at the evidence.

Loss thinks the top of the south tower is not tipping over. This is a great example of the ridiculous lenths people will go to protect the world view. Denying the plainly obvious. Frightening. Anybody else agree with Loss?