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What about the evidence you've heard suggests it was necessary for anyone to die?

I think when someone responds to an officer catching them coming from the scene of a strong arm felony robbery by attempting to beat that officer, take his sidearm, and murder that officer with it... it is necessary for them to die.

It is certainly in society's best interest that they die.
 
A casing was found inside the vehicle. There were 'more than a few' outside the vehicle. There were 'more than a couple' in Michael Brown and he was 35' away from the vehicle. As I understand it those facts are not in dispute.

Cases can fly several feet. They could easily fly right out the car door/window.

Heck, the one in the car could have flown in from outside the car.

Now, if there are cases 15 feet away, that's probably very bad news for the cop, barring some big piece of evidence I haven't heard of yet.
 
It's Brown without a doubt. The reason this info seems "new" to people is that police have procedures about releasing information in an ongoing investigation. One of the many reasons why rioting or even "peacefully protesting" before the info has come out, are incredibly stupid.

The cop who shot him had been looking for he and his friend in particular, after the store owner called them about the strong armed robbery.

I heard this info days ago, but didn't mention anything because it was "unsubstantiated at that time" so I kept my mouth shut (see how that works?) but it was going through the grapevine. So too was the fact that the officer had serious facial injuries and was in the hospital thanks to Brown.

Why do you think the very store they stole from was burned to the ground and robbed blind in the riots? Most importantly, why do you think they spraypainted "Snitches get stitches" on the side of said store? The community knew the basic outline: Brown and his friend had stolen from the store, the store owner had the audacity to report this crime to authorities, and the rest was history.

Oh and obviously this isn't about "being executed for stealing cigars" this is about him being shot after he tried the same thing on the officer as he did the store owner: namely, using his large size and lack of morals as a way to avoid consequences - he beat the officer, tried to get his weapon, and likely would've murdered him had he succeeded.
Couldn't have happened. I have been rebuked by reliable sources when I suggested similar.events. I am told by the utmost honest, totally unbiased experts on JREF that all the protesting was PEACEFUL
 
I hope the facts will be available soon. Right now it appears to be a case of walking while black. MB just graduated high school and was headed to a community college. Doesn't sound like a trouble maker to me.

I hope people come back and own the ridiculous comments they made before any relevant facts were in.
 
People actually believe you should be able to attempt to murder a police officer, beat him bloody in the process... and then when he prevents your attempt and gets control of the situation, you should be able to just say "okay I give up" and that's the end of it?

If the officer feels he has achieved complete control of the situation, and has the time to even pause and realize that you've given up, and is confident it isn't just a trick... and somehow magically knows your accomplice isn't armed and taking aim from behind him... and is feeling really really generous that day, I suppose he can let you live if he wants.

But as far as I'm concerned, best practice is to end that person's life or at least shoot them until they're completely incapacitated.

It would be very irresponsible to let such a person escape.
 
What is the "status of the shooting"?

I don't know. That's why I used this particular phrasing.

My point is that Brown's actions leading up to this point are irrelevant.

<SNIP>


(This should be entertaining)

Was it as a good for you as it was for me?


Edited to remove breach. Please remember your Membership Agreememt, be civil, and address the argument rather than attacking the arguer.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: LashL
 
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How would that work?

http://www.wlwt.com/news/home-invasion-suspect-charged-with-murder-in-accomplices-death/27087764#!bD05Rn

"HAMILTON —A man accused of breaking into an apartment last month is now facing a murder charge for an accomplice's death.

The homeowner stabbed Heath in self defense, police said. Heath died a short time later.

On Tuesday, police said Michael Fitzgerald was arrested Monday and charged with murder, robbery and aggravated burglary.

Fitzgerald was arraigned in Hamilton Municipal Court on Tuesday morning.

The case remains under investigation."

I'm not saying it's likely in this case, but it does happen.
 
I don't know. That's why I used this particular phrasing.

My point is that Brown's actions leading up to this point are irrelevant.<SNIP>

Was it as a good for you as it was for me?

Of course his actions leading up to the shooting are relevant.

The way an officer would approach someone he has no history on versus someone he believes may have just committed a robbery are completely relevant and would certainly affect how he handled the situation.
 
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My point is that Brown's actions leading up to this point are irrelevant.
It seems relevant that the cops knew a robbery had just occurred and that Brown and Johnson matched the description.

If that robbery had not happened the cop might have done nothing more than to tell they guys to quit walking in the street.

Wait. Did the cops say that they were walking in the street when encountered or did that bit come from Johnson? He might have said that as a false reason for why the cop stopped for them.

I can't remember what the police said happened as opposed to Johnson and other witnesses.
 
Shooting someone dead is not treated lightly by police departments...

This is ********. Whether it is a botched SWAT raid or a random traffic stop, cops are constantly trying to make excuses and avoid responsibility when innocent people are killed.
 
I think when someone responds to an officer catching them coming from the scene of a strong arm felony robbery by attempting to beat that officer, take his sidearm, and murder that officer with it... it is necessary for them to die.

It is certainly in society's best interest that they die.


I see where this is going, and it aint gonna be pretty, folks....
 
Brown's actions leading up to this point are irrelevant.

They don't help us establish his state of mind and how he'd feel when a police officer came up and started questioning him?

So... if someone says to me "the officer's claim that Brown pushed him into his cruiser, attacked him, and tried to get his gun is insane and totally unbelievable. Only a racist would believe that, because you'd have to believe black men just act like complete animals for no reason." (I've seen exactly this said, paraphrasing but very close)

... you're telling me that my ability to say "well actually he was coming from the scene of a felony strong arm robbery and would therefore have realized the cop was probably looking for him in connection to that, and that if he complied with the officer, he was likely going to prison, given that he was still wearing the same clothes he knew the shopowner could ID him in, and that he was likely on video wearing... so he may have felt the weight of all that and that may have driven him to do something crazy to avoid that fate"

... has absolutely no bearing on helping us understand how believable the officer's account is, and Brown's mindset at the time?

Really?
 
My point is that Brown's actions leading up to this point are irrelevant.

Total Crap.


<SNIP>

Edited to remove breach. Please, remember your M.A., be civil, and address the argument rather than attacking the arguer.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: LashL
 
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<snip>
My point is that Brown's actions leading up to this point are irrelevant. <snip>

True. Also if he did try and grab the officer's gun, once he stopped grabbing for it, then the officer was probably not authorized to use deadly force to prevent his escape. At least in New York, police are not supposed to use deadly force unless it is to immediately protect their lives or someone else's. The circumstances in which this shooting took place sounds more like the officer was handing out punishment, not trying to take Brown into custody.
 
Of course his actions leading up to the shooting are relevant.

The way an officer would approach someone he has no history on versus someone he believes may have just committed a robbery are completely relevant and would certainly affect how he handled the situation.

Sure, the status of a robbery could dictate whether the officer could legally detain a suspect. But a momentary detention is not the issue at hand.

If the shooting was unjustified, then yeah, stopping him for jaywalking versus stopping him for robbery does make things slightly worse if you really want to focus on it that closely, but I don't think it really matters in the grand scheme of things.
 
The idea that BOTH parties could be at fault here seem to be not very popular here, since you can't work that into a preconceived ideologically based scenario.
 
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