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Michael Brown Shooting

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Skeptic Tank said:
Make no mistake, if this officer ends up charged with anything whatsoever that will represent a travesty of justice and an enormous victory for mob rule and racial pandering.

We're creating a situation where we send cops into the worst of the worst parts of our country, and ask them to police said areas... and then we make it impossible for them to do their job by, as a society, deciding we favor the criminals over the cops.

I don't care what Brown was or was not doing while being shot. Of course if he lost the struggle for the gun he would try to get away from the ensuing gunfire, when at least one shot had already happened in the car. That's no great credit to him as a person.

Once he tried to murder a police officer, that officer had an obligation to the community to punch his ticket. And I'm glad he did.
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If I had to predict, I'd guess some sort of manslaughter charge is coming.

Just a vibe I get, though.
 
jimbob said:
We do know that in 2009, the Ferguson cops charged a man with a felony for damaging their uniform by bleeding on it after they beat him up whilst being wrongly arrested.
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And that matters not at all regarding the discussion of this case in 2014.
 
William Parcher said:
But the suspect became a violent felon the moment he assaulted the cop at the car. Then 35 feet away he is shot dead.
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Question is going to be how much of a threat he posed when he was shot dead.
That is why I predict this case is not going to end well,no matter what happens, and might well be the Rodney King for the new millinium. It is going to hinge on a very technical question about clear and present threat.
 
Giordano said:
Yes, resisting arrest and assault of a police officer are crimes and you could be arrested if you did these things. You might even even be justifiably shot if you were struggling for the police officer's gun. But even if you did this (which is far from established in this case) you cannot justifiably be shot latter, when fleeing, unless you represent a likely and imminent threat of harm to other people it is the law.

At yes, if you approach a police officer with a hand in your back pocket, and don't stop it on command, you do represent a likely and imminent threat of harm to the officer. It may be an empty threat. But it is a threat. The police officer is then allowed to do whatever neutralizes the threat: they may shoot you if they think that is the minimum use of force required to eliminate the threat. But they can't shoot you legally if you then run. They certainly can't keep pumping bullets into you once the threat is eliminated. That is an execution.
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"Might"?
 
Skeptic Tank said:
Make no mistake, if this officer ends up charged with anything whatsoever that will represent a travesty of justice and an enormous victory for mob rule and racial pandering.

We're creating a situation where we send cops into the worst of the worst parts of our country, and ask them to police said areas... and then we make it impossible for them to do their job by, as a society, deciding we favor the criminals over the cops.

I don't care what Brown was or was not doing while being shot. Of course if he lost the struggle for the gun he would try to get away from the ensuing gunfire, when at least one shot had already happened in the car. That's no great credit to him as a person.

Once he tried to murder a police officer, that officer had an obligation to the community to punch his ticket. And I'm glad he did.
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No one said being a cop is easy: we demand a lot of them. One of the things we demand is that they be very careful to not kill people unless they absolutely have to. It is the law, and most cops keep to it and still do an adequate job. The decision we have made as a society is that it is better for the guilty to get away than for an innocent person to die. And I remind you that Mr, Brown has never been proven in a court of law to be guilty of anything. It is not even clear if the cop only suspected him of jaywalking. It doesn't matter, and he should not have been killed if innocent (as presumed) or guilty (as you personally have convicted him) of jaywalking or of strong-arm robbery.

So there is no proof that Brown tried to murder a police officer as you claim, nor that did his "community" apparently wants him dead (who is protesting?).
 
Kaosium said:
According to early reports the officer was treated for a 'swollen head.' Have you seen anything indicating further injuries?
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We don't yet know what kind of car the cop had. Some call it a truck so maybe SUV? My Ford truck has a full frame around the window. It's conceivable that Brown might have slammed the door on the officer's head instead of leg. That would explain the grappling, the "let go or I'll shoot, I'm going to shoot", the initial shot (at least), the shooting of a fleeing felon.

You be squashing my head in a car door, darn right I will hit back with whatever hammer I have.

But where did the report of the officer giving warning come from? Do witness stories differ on that?
 
casebro said:
If Johnson's report is fudged by him just a little, and instead of the the cop hitting Brown with the door, Brown got proactive and slammed the door on the officer's leg. That assault would make the cop a "direct witness". Fleeing felon, slam dunk.
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Nope, you are still not allowed to shoot him. Sorry.
 
LTC8K6 said:
So, what if Brown was shot once during a struggle for his gun at the car. The gun fired during the struggle.

Then Brown ran 35 feet away and tried to surrender, but was shot again anyway.

And the coroner rules that the first, and legal, shot was already fatal?
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It would still be illegal for the cop to shoot at Brown one he tried to surrender, even if the cop's latter bullets were not the fatal ones. It was not just illegal to kill Brown once he was fleeing; it was illegal to shoot at him once he was fleeing.
 
Giordano said:
Nope, you are still not allowed to shoot him. Sorry.
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How about slamming the car/truck door on the officer's head repeatedly?

I could see that happening.

But really, we have a claim of trying to get the officer's sidearm.

That sounded ridiculous at first.

But now we have a kid who was likely going to jail for felony robbery if he got arrested.

His whole world was going to come crashing down.
 
dudalb said:
"My Mind Is Made Up,Don't Confuse Me With Facts"

theory that the security cameras evidence was faked coming in 3...2...1....
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Skeptic Ginger said:
Not sure if this is aimed at me but I can clearly see it's Brown and Johnson in the mini-mart video.
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Skeptic Ginger said:
I'm saying what the police chief said. I just watched him say it, the stop was for not getting on the sidewalk.

And the stop was not consistent with stopping suspects of a robbery.

You can believe what you want, those are facts.
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Police chief is on now and has made a very clear statement: The robbery had nothing to do with the initial stop by the cop.

Wilson did not know about the robbery.
 
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casebro said:
We don't yet know what kind of car the cop had. Some call it a truck so maybe SUV? My Ford truck has a full frame around the window. It's conceivable that Brown might have slammed the door on the officer's head instead of leg. That would explain the grappling, the "let go or I'll shoot, I'm going to shoot", the initial shot (at least), the shooting of a fleeing felon.

You be squashing my head in a car door, darn right I will hit back with whatever hammer I have.

But where did the report of the officer giving warning come from? Do witness stories differ on that?
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A lot of speculation, isn't it? But again, even if one was squashed in a struggle, you cannot shoot that person after the struggle and once he is fleeing. True of cops and (of private citizens in most places in the USA, I think). You may explain here that you would, but then you would be guilty of a crime.
 
Monketey Ghost said:
And that matters not at all regarding the discussion of this case in 2014.
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Conspriacies Theories about how Brown is being framed, and all the evidence fakes coming in 3....2...1....

No one ....except for maybe Skeptic Tank, whose racsim is shown by his posting history.....is calling the Law Enforcement involved in this case a paragon of virtue. There handling of the aftermath of the shooting could not have been worse. But still....facts are facts.
 
Giordano said:
It would still be illegal for the cop to shoot at Brown one he tried to surrender, even if the cop's latter bullets were not the fatal ones. It was not just illegal to kill Brown once he was fleeing; it was illegal to shoot at him once he was fleeing.
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I really don't know what the ruling would be on that.

It's also predicated on two things that may not be true at all.
 
LTC8K6 said:
we have a claim of trying to get the officer's sidearm.

That sounded ridiculous at first.
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Never sounded ridiculous to me.

I guess that's either because I have observed the harsh realities of areas like that, or because I'm a big, bad, mean white devil racist.

Oh wait, one implies the other... I forgot.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
Police chief is on now and has made a very clear statement: The robbery had nothing to do with the initial stop by the cop.

Wilson did not know about the robbery.
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Was his radio turned off or something?

Brown and Johnson knew about the robbery that had just committed. They must have reacted to an officer stopping them right after.
 
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