[Merged]Flight 93 - The Cell Phones that worked!

[V23]

One issue I've seen with some "experiments" was the type of phone. I know that the older analog phones and service had a much better range than today's digitals.

I think to really evaluate the validity of the cell call claims (from UA 93) you need to know the altitude and more important the type of phone and the planes exact location. That's a lot of investigation to try to disprove a call to someone that has no question about the validity of the call.

ETA My 9 year old can't stop laughing at the elephant on the trampoline.

I cant agree with you more. However, all I want is a chart.

I want a chart that gives the exact times of the phone calls, whether it was an air phone or a cell phone, how long they lasted, who they came from, what type of cell phone used, what Alt. was the plane, and what was the air speed of the aircraft.

If i can get that, (or make it rather, cause I figure this is where this is going), then I can figure out which one's full of crap, the 9/11 Report or the CT's.

(Personally i think it's both . . .but I thnk that the CT's have reached load capasity)

 

[V23]

ETA My 9 year old can't stop laughing at the elephant on the trampoline.

Thanks, my 3 year old picked that one out for my avatar . . .

 

[T.A.M.]

see the moussaoui trial exhibits.

http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution.html

It is one of these files, I have it downloaded, but I cannot recall which file on the site it is...it lists all the flights and the calls, where they were made from etc...

TAM

 

[V23]

The flight 93 cell calls that we know got through weren't made at high altitude. That's easily determined by matching the call times with the plane's altitude at those times. That information is at the sites linked above.

But none of that is necessary. This is the real world, not a fantasy world. The calls happened. If you don't think they should have, you need to adjust your beliefs to fit the facts, not vice-versa.

Not true. And there is my problem.

"Ultimately, there were six cell phone calls, three of which were made by Tom Burnett starting at 9:30, presumably when the flight was first hijacked and traveling at its cruising altitude of 30,000+ feet (it's actually about 34,000 feet if you look at the actual data and account for the height above sea level)."

http://911debunker.livejournal.com/7697.html?mode=reply

30,000 feet for a digital phone is just about impossible. 30,000 ft for an older analog phone is somewhat improbable. So which is it?

1. Tom Burnett didn't use a cell phone, he used an air phone and the report is wrong.

2. Tom Burnett called from his cell phone, but the plane was already lower in alt. by that time, thus he was able to talk to the his party for at least one minute.

 

[T.A.M.]

I believe this is the one...it is for Flight 11, but the Flash presentation has all of the flights etc...

http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution/flights/P200018.html

TAM

 

[Magenta]

I cant agree with you more. However, all I want is a chart.

I want a chart that gives the exact times of the phone calls, whether it was an air phone or a cell phone, how long they lasted, who they came from, what type of cell phone used,

See the relevant Moussaoui trial exhibit. Summary here:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3088310&postcount=54

what Alt. was the plane, and what was the air speed of the aircraft.

Check the FDR printout.

All this has been covered in previous threads. Try using the tags at the bottom of the page to bring up relevant threads.

 

[Gravy]

I cant agree with you more. However, all I want is a chart.

I want a chart that gives the exact times of the phone calls, whether it was an air phone or a cell phone, how long they lasted, who they came from, what type of cell phone used, what Alt. was the plane, and what was the air speed of the aircraft.

If i can get that, (or make it rather, cause I figure this is where this is going), then I can figure out which one's full of crap, the 9/11 Report or the CT's.

(Personally i think it's both . . .but I thnk that the CT's have reached load capasity)

Call chart (use color chart):
http://911debunker.livejournal.com/7697.html?mode=reply

Altitude chart and times of the two cell calls:
http://www.debunk911myths.org/topics/Cell_phones

These are links you posted in this thread. I don't think you're trying very hard here, V23. Great avatar, though.

 

[T.A.M.]

I suspect that Brunett had to make at least one call from an airfone, as in the flash presentation linked above, used in the Moussaoui trial, they have the row he made the calls from...a different row than his seat assignment.

TAM

 

[Gravy]

Not true. And there is my problem.

Yes, it is true. You are being argumentative rather than being attentive. Please read my posts.

 

[V23]

V23, I don't understand what more you're asking for. You posted the links where this information is immediately available. Specifically what information are you disputing or confused about?

Edit: Oh, perhaps I see what you're looking at. Chippy's livejournal chart shows some cell calls connecting at times that would indicate a higher altitude. He was relying on some inaccurate press sources for that information (the press sometimes reported any calls as "cell phone calls.") The Moussaoui trial chart shows that all but two of the callers, Cee Cee Lyles and Ed Felt, used Airfones, and those calls were made at about 5,000 feet. We know that by the seat numbers where the calls were made.

Ok, now I am gonna have to check in to it, but that at least is a decent explination.

(Which kinda goes with what I am thinking too)

However, as far as I know, the 9/11 report says otherwise, and that the cell phone conversations started at 9:30 AM and at 30,000 ft.

(Which goes to show that they got their facts wrong as far as I am concerned.)

 

[V23]

I hope you did you experiment with pre 2001 towers and phones!!!!!! I did, it worked when flying, I am a pilot. Now there is no reason a cell phone can not work in flight; get the technical manuals, they prove it is possible. So, the phone calls on 9/11 are real. Cell phone or not they worked. Your experiment only proves you can't make a call at a certain place in space. But then you have no idea your phone specs, the specs of phones on 9/11 or what, do you? Like Hani can not fly, anyone can, and cell phones can not work, they do. Antidotal evidence is not the stuff of fact.

Exactly. Which is why I want an accurate chart whith the stuff I previously mentioned.

 

[OneRedEye]

Antidotal evidence is not the stuff of fact.

The cell phone argument is stupid...

[Edited]using the word 'antidotal' when you mean 'anecdotal'.

I hope English is not your native language.

C'mon guys, let's keep it civil.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: LibraryLady

 

[T.A.M.]

V23:
I have provided you a link to a flash presentation that gives you all the calls and who made them, where from, etc...

TAM

 

[V23]

I'm having a little trouble understanding how you can let this minor detail derail your thinking on 9/11.

If I understand what you are saying you believe almost all the evidence points towards no conspiracy, but you counter all that evidence with not being able to understand how 2 cell phone calls were placed.

One more time, just so I undertand; You don't understand how the 2 calls were placed so you are going to throw out all the other evidence and say 9/11 may have been an inside job.

Am I reading it right?

No.

Quit jumping to conclusions. I am not throwing out any evidence. I don't believe that 9/11 is an inside job.

I just don't know how this happened. And I have yet to hear a decent explination of how it occured. And by the way, it was 4 cell phones, and 17 calls, not 2.

 

[liverleef]

I really get amazed by these sort of posts. People watch jets loaded with jet fuel crash into a building at 500 mph, they watch the confession videos of the terrorists, they listen to passengers using airphones describe being hijacked by terrorists and they doubt all of it because their cell phone didnt work on a recent flight they were on. Seriously?....Seriously? I mean the reasoning that some people use just baffles me.

 

[V23]

not to mention, we have no idea how many call "attempts" were made. Perhaps 15 or 20 calls were attempted, leaving the connection percentage at about 10-15%...

TAM

37 calls by cell were made, and 17 were sucessful, that's 46%.

Little under half.

 

[V23]

Two people. The calls happened. Live with it.

Four. Deal with it

http://911debunker.livejournal.com/7697.html?mode=reply

 

[T.A.M.]

the # of cell phones, and calls, is your source the commission report?

TAM

 

[V23]

see the moussaoui trial exhibits.

http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution.html

It is one of these files, I have it downloaded, but I cannot recall which file on the site it is...it lists all the flights and the calls, where they were made from etc...

TAM

Cool man . . .thanks . . .

 

[V23]

I believe this is the one...it is for Flight 11, but the Flash presentation has all of the flights etc...

http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution/flights/P200018.html

TAM

keep passing me the good stuff . . .