Mediums offer "Comfort" to bereaved - comments?

[jambo372]

To see if skeptics can manage to persuade me of otherwise but so far the answer to that is certainly no.

 

[De'Ville's Advocaat]

Re: Re: Mediums offer "Comfort" to bereaved - comments?

A good injection of morphine would also provide comfort to the paying customers. But you wouldn't suggest that we do that for grieving people, surely?

But GP's do regularly supply the berieved with mind calming drugs. Some people want that. some will drink a bottle of fine wine, if another goes to the medium and gets the same result, who is anyone to deny it?

 

[jambo372]

They're a bunch of marvels.

 

[Blondin]

Re: Re: Re: Mediums offer "Comfort" to bereaved - comments?

But GP's do regularly supply the berieved with mind calming drugs. Some people want that. some will drink a bottle of fine wine, if another goes to the medium and gets the same result, who is anyone to deny it?

I guess it just goes against the grain with me. Are you saying that we should pretend we believe what the mediums might tell us if it makes us feel better?

Being lied to just doesn't do it for me (even if it is for free) and I can't understand how you can draw a line somewhere between feel-good mediums and crooks. Fraud is fraud.

If they really have something then by all means they should sell their services and benefit themselves as well as their clients. It just seems to me like it's a cop-out and dangerous to say it's okay to have blind unsubstantiated faith in some things because they make us feel good and not in others if there is a perception of risk. The whole point is that perceptions can be misleading. How will you know you're not being used or manipulated or ripped off if you don't ask for proof?

 

[jambo372]

What risk ?

 

[Blondin]

What risk ?

Well that was my question, actually. How do you know there is no risk if you are just going to have blind faith? How do you know the person you are trusting doesn't have some ulterior motive?

Suppose they're only using you to establish a clientelle in order to build perceived credibility via word of mouth so they can rip someone else off. No skin off your nose, right? You go on various internet forums and preach about the harmless nature of these benevolent souls because they've never harmed you. Meanwhile, for all you know, they could be telling your mother that your poor deceased father wanted her to leave all her worldly goods to a worthwhile charity who helps others in the community like oh, say your friendly neighborhood psychic councellor.

I'm not even suggesting all psychics are devious crooks up to no good. I'm sure a lot of them are quite nice people who are very sure of their abilities. They could still be wrong and they could still give bad advice. Or it could just be that you don't have anything they want but maybe the next sucker does.

 

[jambo372]

Do you actually know any mediums ?

 

[Blondin]

Do you actually know any mediums ?

Nope.

I do have one aquaintance who believes and repeats any and all spooky gibberish she comes across whether it's spirits/ghosts, astology or magic bracelets. We call her "Flaky Sue" and she is a very lonely person. She tends to hassle those who are too polite to tell her to ◊◊◊◊ off so I was her target for a while. When I told her I didn't want to be one of her "downline" for the magnetic gas mileage gadget she was selling because I thought it was a ripoff she kind of cooled toward me, too. Like you she just didn't understand the difference between thousands of satisfied customers and objective testing.

 

[jambo372]

To me the mediums don't need tested - they've given me plenty of accurate information.

You really shouldn't express your fantasies of mediums taking into account you don't even know any mediums.

Incidentally, how much do her gadgets cost ?

 

[B.S]

More likely you've given them plenty of accurate information.

Ask yourself, have you been answering their questions? Or have they been making statements?

 

[jambo372]

No, I told them nothing.

 

[B.S]

I'd have to see that, to believe it.

 

[JPK]

Good orning Jambo372.

Nothing is wrong with Mediums - I'm not just saying that because I believe they talk to the dead - I don't have anything against them at all, not even fraudulent ones.

Naturally being a spiritualist I'm obliged to trust mediums anyway.

It's my religion.
They don't use or manipulate me anyway.

I believe they have the power anyway.

To see if skeptics can manage to persuade me of otherwise but so far the answer to that is certainly no.

To me the mediums don't need tested - they've given me plenty of accurate information.
You really shouldn't express your fantasies of mediums taking into account you don't even know any mediums.

Incidentally, how much do her gadgets cost ?

I just wanted to see what this looked like all together.

Jambo372, I was just wondering if there is anything you wouldn't do if your spiritual leader instructed you to? I'm not trying to be a smart ass here but your blind faith is pretty spooky. I'm not sure if anyone pointed you to this site before by you might want to take a look at it and see if any of this looks farmilar.

Common Signs of Destructive Cults

Just a suggestion.

JPK

 

[JPK]

Jambo372,

No, I told them nothing.

You do realize your mediums share all of your personal info between them so that even the first time you sit with a new medium, they most likely have all the info from other mediums you have sat with before. It's all on your permanent record

JPK

 

[littleblackpistol]

I think it's inarguable that mediums offer a form of counselling to the bereaved - what is in question is whether their particular brand of counselling is beneficial, destructive or simply harmless in the long-term. It would be interesting to have a study done to see if those who visit mediums in the hope of maintaining contact with their loved ones find the grieving process more difficult to work through compared to those who visit qualified grief counsellors or who work through their grief unaided by outside agencies.

I am predisposed to believe that mediumship is pernicious as it holds up the grieving process. Trying to talk to the dead as if they were still living and concerned with earthly problems seems to be to be the equivalent of maintaining a 'shrine' to the loved one and refusing to accept the loss and move on and accept that person is not in your life anymore. There's also the issue of fraud - even if it is beneficial to a few people, the fact that the benefit is based on a lie, and moreover a lie told for great personal profit in some cases, to me cancels out any perceived benefit in the long run.

 

[Savagemutt]

Priests and Rabbis do it for money also. Their wages are paid by people who are afraid of death.

Yes, its a tricky question. But I'm not going to walk up to a friend or family member dealing with a loss and say "Hey, that church you've been involved with your entire life is b.s. and you shouldn't be talking to your pastor about this death."

That's a little too cold for me. However, given mediumships less-pervasive hold (on most people), I don't think I'd have a problem telling a griever that they're not spending their money or time wisely.

 

[jambo372]

JPK
Permanent record.
Still wouldn't fit.
New mediums often give information that previous mediums never gave me.

I never gave anything away to the original medium either.

 

[JPK]

JPK
Permanent record.
Still wouldn't fit.
New mediums often give information that previous mediums never gave me.

I never gave anything away to the original medium either.

Jambo372, let me get this straight. You go to a medium. You sit there with a perfect poker face. You say nothing at all. You stare blankly and make no head movements of facial movements. The medium goes through the act while you sit there like a statue. When they are done , you just get up and walk away. Is this how it goes?
I realize this really doesn't mean anything since you have already stated that some are frauds but you are obligated to listen to them anyway. With the amount of times you go and care nothing about all of the wrong and fraudulent information given to you I would imagine some gueses on the mediums part would be right anyway.

JPK

 

[Blondin]

To me the mediums don't need tested - they've given me plenty of accurate information.

You really shouldn't express your fantasies of mediums taking into account you don't even know any mediums.

Incidentally, how much do her gadgets cost ?

You prove my point for me. If anecdotal testamonials are all you require then why should anybody bother to provide real evidence for any ridiculous claim. There is no shortage of gullible believers to build up an impressive portfolio without ever actually providing anything useful.

If you're really interested:
Gas mileage magnet
and
Some useful info

 

[B.S]

Yes, its a tricky question. But I'm not going to walk up to a friend or family member dealing with a loss and say "Hey, that church you've been involved with your entire life is b.s. and you shouldn't be talking to your pastor about this death."

Yeah, I understand. I just wanted to point out that they are not innocent of any of this, and I include what they do with what the mediums do.