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Measles exposure

Don't forget that this was the same weekend as Emerald City Comic Con, so tens of thousands of people from arouond the country and world were in downtown Seattle for that.

Cons are normally big petri dishes of mass exposure as is (search "con crud" for more on that) and many of these people, especially dealers, travel from con to con. She's exposed a lot more people than an ordinary weekend in Seattle.
 
luchog said:
No, they were all at ECCC; which may not be a particular improvement, depending on the size of the crossover attendance.
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The only risk they would have is if one of their friends was exposed and came down with it later and then exposed your friends.

Reassure them one cannot be contagious after exposure unless one contracts the infection and then only after about a week. I'd need to look up the exact time, 5 days, 7, I don't recall without looking but it's about that. So people attending both events would not have spread anything.
 
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No, but if they attended both events, or happened to be in Pike Place Market or whatever, they could certainly be exposed themselves. And if they went on to vend at or attend another con next weekend, they'll be the contagion vectors. Especially if word doesn't get out that they may be at risk for measles.

A lot of recent outbreaks have been complicated by patients *and* doctors not recognising measles, after 40-50 years of immunization. It leads to lots of people being unnecessarily exposed.
 
deadrose said:
No, but if they attended both events, or happened to be in Pike Place Market or whatever, they could certainly be exposed themselves. And if they went on to vend at or attend another con next weekend, they'll be the contagion vectors. Especially if word doesn't get out that they may be at risk for measles.
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I was mostly asking if Luchog's friends may have been exposed.

deadrose said:
A lot of recent outbreaks have been complicated by patients *and* doctors not recognising measles, after 40-50 years of immunization. It leads to lots of people being unnecessarily exposed.
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For doctors, that was certainly true in the 90s but the word is out now so it's much rarer. Not saying it never happens, but measles is a worrisome enough disease, doctors pay attention to things that rare but serious.

Patients on the other hand likely have little clue what they have until they get to the doctor.
 
deadrose said:
Actually, there was just an article in the NYTimes about this problem, even in NYC.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/19/nyregion/measles-outbreak-in-new-york-may-have-spread-in-medical-facilities.html
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Not surprised.


And Luchog's friends are also my friends. We're married, and travel in the same geeky circles, which include several pros in the comics & games industries. :D
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Cool! I figured the wet side of the mountains was here or close but I apologize if I've met you and forgotten. I've met him, gave him a ride once, years ago. I think it was after a get together with Hutch who was passing through town.

I have been absent from the Seattle skeptics group for a while, just don't seem to get over there when meetings are on.
 
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Nope. we haven't met, and Luchog and I have been pretty awful about attending any meetings, thanks to his work hours.

But yeah, I'm a Seattleite, and before that a Vashon Islander (my dad was a family doctor over there till about 3 years ago), so I know all about the antivax crowd there - though it's lessened a bit since they had a nice pertussis outbreak a year or so ago.
 
Just a quick note for religion watchers: although the roots are the same, there is a significant difference between the "Netherlands Reformed" folks under discussion here, and the mainstream "Dutch Reformed" church, whose name will often appear on old New England churches. The split is an old one, and the latter are pretty ordinary UCC types, merged with Congregational and other denominations, more likely to be rather liberal, in favor of vaccination, ordination of women, and gay marriage.
 
I see. I was working for Whatcom County public health when the polio outbreak occurred. We went out to Sumas to give people polio vaccine. All I recalled was it was a Dutch community that didn't vaccinate and the cases were in three countries.
 
bruto said:
Just a quick note for religion watchers: although the roots are the same, there is a significant difference between the "Netherlands Reformed" folks under discussion here, and the mainstream "Dutch Reformed" church, whose name will often appear on old New England churches. The split is an old one, and the latter are pretty ordinary UCC types, merged with Congregational and other denominations, more likely to be rather liberal, in favor of vaccination, ordination of women, and gay marriage.
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AFAIK, the American churches labeled "Dutch" all have corresponding originating denominations in the Netherlands. Wiki has a nice simple diagram of the various splits (and mergers) and a more elaborate diagram, including non-Calvinist Christian denominations, which also gives an impression of the size of the denominations. The latter groups the Calvinist ones (see the heading) in "vrijzinnig" (=liberal), traditional, orthodox and "bevindelijk".

The label "Dutch Reformed", without ado, refers to the biggest church, "Nederlands hervormd", which in earlier times was the state church.

The label "bevindelijk" refers to those churches where people live and breathe according to the Bible, and their religion permeates their daily lives. In the Dutch context, these are the only churches where you find the non-vaccination crowd (*). Though it must also be mentioned, that none of those churches actually advocate not vaccinating, and that vaccinating and non-vaccinating runs right across these handful of churches. Surprisingly, the issue has never led to a split. :) The church in question in Lynden, WA, is of this type.

And although the earliest split was only in 1834, the "bevindelijk" tendency has its roots in the "Further Reformation" of the 17/18th Century.

(*) from a religious perspective; there are of course also sCAM people, and immigrants who are simply ignorant of the issue.
 
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Oh goodie. Another person made a couple of public visits in West Seattle before being diagnosed with measles. He apparently contracted it from being on an airplane with a Californian who was contagious after visiting Europe.

So we have the planeful of people, anyone who was in 2 of the terminals during the times the Californian was, and 9 days later, a mall and grocery store in West Seattle.

And all this is unconnected to the exposures from the Lynden woman that started this thread. This could get ugly with all the anti-vaxxers around here.

Alert for the Californian victim: http://www.kingcounty.gov/healthservices/health/news/2014/14032801.aspx

Alert for the second victim: http://www.kingcounty.gov/healthservices/health/news/2014/14040801.aspx
 
Hmmm, you got a notice before I did. I knew about the March pass through SeaTac. But there is no PHD email in my inbox yet for the new one. I'll probably get one soon. :)
 
Well...y'all have 1-3 years-ish (depending on post-doc opportunities) to clear that Pacific NW anti-vaxxer thing up before we look hard at moving back, good luck!
 
Finally got the PHD notice on the new case.

Diogenes: Do you think we are the only ones with anti-vaxxers?
 
Interesting maps, Puppycow. I see KY is safer than WA.

I'd love to see an overlay of the two maps. It does appear only Utah and Georgia's rates of vaccination coverage contradict stricter exemption rules.
 
The maps aren't correct for many states regarding immunisation rates and ease of exemptions. Most states are very easy to obtain exemptions and don't require a healthcare professional signature nor detailed explanation. Additionally, most states have "all or nothing" exemptions in that some children may be partially vaccinated but the states don't track that. These have to change and there is no reason for religious exemptions and exemptions should be modified to require a cap and tracking for partial vaccination.

Este
 
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