Marriage between first cousins

Mick Houlahan said:
"Whatever their motivations, the laws are not supported by science. According to the National Society of Genetic Counselors, birth defects are 2 to 3 percent more common in children born to first cousins than among the general population — a real risk, but not enough to justify the bans."


2-3 percent seems like a pretty big number to me, particularly when applied to the possibility of producing a flipper baby. That better be one HOT cousin.
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My recollection is that the risk of birth defects from cousin parents is comparable to that from a mother being 35 or older. Nobody seems all that agitated about women that age giving birth, and there's certainly no movement to criminalize it.
 
Mick Houlahan said:
"Whatever their motivations, the laws are not supported by science. According to the National Society of Genetic Counselors, birth defects are 2 to 3 percent more common in children born to first cousins than among the general population — a real risk, but not enough to justify the bans."


2-3 percent seems like a pretty big number to me, particularly when applied to the possibility of producing a flipper baby. That better be one HOT cousin.
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Birth defects are 2 to 3 percent more common, this is not to say that 2 to 3% of babies will be born with genetic defects (I'm pointing that out just in case you misinterpreted the number. If you didn't, then it's for the sake of others).

And, according to the article in the OP, that's the same as with pregnancies in women over 40. Is anybody proposing to ban those pregnancies?

Not all marriages end up with pregnancies. And with the current advancements in genetic testing, the risks can be minimized with more rigorous screening of fetuses.

There's no rational reason to prohibit cousin marriages. It's discrimination.


ETA: Dunstan said it better, but I only read it now.
 
Luciana said:
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Not all marriages end up with pregnancies. And with the current advancements in genetic testing, the risks can be minimized with more rigorous screening of fetuses.

There's no rational reason to prohibit cousin marriages. It's discrimination.


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"... more rigorous scanning of fetuses."
So cousin marriage will lead to abortion.
Not all of the time, but aren't any such abominations?
Do two wrongs make a right? :)
 
Are any of these laws newly enacted? I imagine that they are relics of a time when family units lived for generations in the same area. In that case, the real danger, i.e., cousins marrying for more than one generation, would be more significant.
 
I Ratant said:
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"... more rigorous scanning of fetuses."
So cousin marriage will lead to abortion.
Not all of the time, but aren't any such abominations?
Do two wrongs make a right? :)
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Well, in that case all screening of babies should be prohibited because more and more women are resorting to those for various reasons. It's entails low risks, it provides hightly useful information, the methods are less invasive, etc. Women giving birth over the age of 40 should be a much more worrisome trend in this regard, because the number of cousin marriages are probably much, much lower than those of women wishing for late pregnancies. If it's not much, much lower, I may review my opinion, but I doubt I'm wrong here.
 
Cuddles said:
Well there are two aspects to that. From the genetics point of view, it's very easy to draw a line between parents and siblings, and everyone else. If the risk of defects with first cousins is noticeable, although small, the risk with people who share half their genes will be very significant.
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The thing is that there are cases were it is known that there is a very very high risk of birth defects and they can legaly marry and have kids, as long as they are not related. See various forms of dwarfism. The most common form is mostly from a mutation that creates a dominant gene. But two copies of this gene are not condusive to life but it is still legal for people with copies of this gene to marry.

These laws predate good medical understandings, and are not reexamined for logical sense.
 
Mick Houlahan said:
"Whatever their motivations, the laws are not supported by science. According to the National Society of Genetic Counselors, birth defects are 2 to 3 percent more common in children born to first cousins than among the general population — a real risk, but not enough to justify the bans."


2-3 percent seems like a pretty big number to me, particularly when applied to the possibility of producing a flipper baby. That better be one HOT cousin.
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So you are for banning sexual relations between heterosexual couples that share recessive genes? Why not make a law that is clear, specific and fair.
 
ponderingturtle said:
So you are for banning sexual relations between heterosexual couples that share recessive genes? Why not make a law that is clear, specific and fair.
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Waitaminnit - lemme review my post real quick.....
Nope, I can't find the part where I advocate banning anything. Nice shared recessive gene reference though.

I really just wanted to say "flipper baby" and "hot cousin." Now if you'll excuse me I have some old family pictures to flip through.:D
 
ponderingturtle said:
The thing is that there are cases were it is known that there is a very very high risk of birth defects and they can legaly marry and have kids, as long as they are not related. See various forms of dwarfism. The most common form is mostly from a mutation that creates a dominant gene. But two copies of this gene are not condusive to life but it is still legal for people with copies of this gene to marry.

These laws predate good medical understandings, and are not reexamined for logical sense.
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Exactly. If the law was meant to avoid genetically defective babies, it was based on scientifical knowledge that is now hopelessly outdated. Or maybe it was just plain old prejudice disguised as science, a common phenomenon.
 
I'd like to know what percent of all humans are products of 1st cousin marriages. Im sure it was a pretty common occorence 200 years ago.
 
Luciana,

I've lived in the U.S. my entire life, in five different states. I have never met cousins who have married in any state and have never, not once, heard anyone protest this law in any state.

WE DON'T CARE THAT IN 19 STATES PEOPLE CAN'T MARRY THEIR COUSINS.

It's really quite simple.
 
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That bears a further question. If you don't live in the United States, why in the world would you care?
 
Vic Vega said:
Luciana,

I've lived in the U.S. my entire life, in five different states. I have never met cousins who have married in any state and have never, not once, heard anyone protest this law in any state.

WE DON'T CARE THAT IN 19 STATES PEOPLE CAN'T MARRY THEIR COUSINS.

It's really quite simple.
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No? Do some quick googling and you'll find many groups petiotioning for that. New scientific evidence challenges the myth of the reasons behind the prohibition of cousing marriages. Your ignorance on the subject does not mean it is irrelevant.

Vic Vega said:
That bears a further question. If you don't live in the United States, why in the world would you care?
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Because I'm a curious creature.
 
Lonewulf said:
Yes, because if it's legal, it means everyone is doing it...

I guess the only thing keeping you from marrying your brother/sister, Wildcat, is the law, right?

It's too bad your zoo trainers failed. ;)
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Hey, I said it was creepy!

But I know it's illegal in Germany because of this video: http://www.wimp.com/justbad/

I wonder how that turned out?
 
Vic Vega said:
That bears a further question. If you don't live in the United States, why in the world would you care?
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So we can't care about issues in other countries.

Alright. I'll assume that all U.S. posters will be avoiding any discussion on, say, Iraq, Iran, Korea, Asia, Europe, South America, Canada, or anything else that doesn't have to do with their 50 states.
 
Vic Vega said:
Luciana,

I've lived in the U.S. my entire life, in five different states. I have never met cousins who have married in any state and have never, not once, heard anyone protest this law in any state.

WE DON'T CARE THAT IN 19 STATES PEOPLE CAN'T MARRY THEIR COUSINS.

It's really quite simple.
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I have heard some discussion over this. Very little, but some. Mostly in sociology courses where the fact that it's illegal in 19 states was pointed out. I remember there being a very minor debate about "kissing cousins" some time ago- it even merited a few articles in The New York Times. I even discussed it with a friend who was strongly against cousin marriage once or twice, the only time that it even came up in my life before this thread.

Mostly, though, it's no issue. You're right.
 
Ysidro said:
Why stop at first cousins? Why not siblings? Hell, why not marry your parent? Oh sure, you'll have to get rid of that pesky other parent first but after that it's clear sailing!
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"I'm My Own Grandpa"
Written by M. Jaffe and D. Latham

It sounds funny, I know, but it really is so
Oh, I'm my own grandpa!

Now many, many years ago when I was twenty-three
I was married to a (widder) who was pretty as can be
This (widder) had a grown up daughter who had hair of red
My father fell in love with her and soon they two were wed.

This made my dad my son-in-law and changed my very life
My daughter was my mother for she was my father's wife
To complicate the matter even though it brought me joy
I soon became the father of a bouncing baby boy.

My little baby then became a brother-in-law to dad
And so became my uncle though it made me very sad
For if he was my uncle then that also made him brother
Of the (widder's) grown up daughter who of course was my step-mother.

Father's wife then had a son who kept him on the run
And he became my grandchild for he was my daughter's son
My wife is now my mother's mother and it makes me blue
Because although she is my wife, she's my grandmother too.

Now if my wife is my grandmother, then I'm her grandchild
And every time I think of it, it nearly drives me wild
For now I have become the strangest case you ever saw
As husband of my grandmother, I am my own grandpa.
 
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