Manhattan explosion

[jimbob]

Smokeless or black powder produce volumes of white smoke when they're ignited in quantity - true HE when detonated produces black smoke.

I am not so sure about that - I have a vague recollection about reading a Biggles story as a kid which mentioned in passing that they could tell the difference between the German and British AA artillery explosions from the colour of the smoke, and presumably both would have been using High Explosive.
e.g. here:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...GjAC#v=onepage&q=biggles archie smoke&f=false

A cloud of white archie smoke had appeared just in front of him. White archie! Only British archie was white! Why were they shooting at him? The answer struck

The author had been a WWI pilot so presumably he'd based that on his own knowledge

 

[smartcooky]

I am not so sure about that - I have a vague recollection about reading a Biggles story as a kid which mentioned in passing that they could tell the difference between the German and British AA artillery explosions from the colour of the smoke, and presumably both would have been using High Explosive.

CRUN: It's too dark to see - strike a light.

SEAGOON: Not allowed in blackout.

MINNIE: Strike a dark light.

SEAGOON: No madam, we daren't - why, only twenty-eight miles across the Channel the Germans are watching this coast.

CRUN: Don't be a silly-pilly policeman - they can't see a little match being struck.

SEAGOON: Oh, alright.

FX: MATCH STRIKING - WHISTLE OF INCOMING SHELL - SHELL EXPLODES.

SEAGOON: Any questions?

CRUN: Yes - where are my legs?

SEAGOON: Are you now aware of the danger from German long-range guns?

CRUN: Mnk ahh! I've got it - I have the answer - just by chance I happen to have on me a box of German matches.

SEAGOON: Wonderful - strike one - they won't fire at their own matches.

CRUN: Of course not – now …

FX: MATCH STRIKING - WHISTLE OF INCOMING SHELL - SHELL EXPLODES.

CRUN: ...Curse the British!!!

 

[jimbob]

CRUN: It's too dark to see - strike a light.

SEAGOON: Not allowed in blackout.

MINNIE: Strike a dark light.

SEAGOON: No madam, we daren't - why, only twenty-eight miles across the Channel the Germans are watching this coast.

CRUN: Don't be a silly-pilly policeman - they can't see a little match being struck.

SEAGOON: Oh, alright.

FX: MATCH STRIKING - WHISTLE OF INCOMING SHELL - SHELL EXPLODES.

SEAGOON: Any questions?

CRUN: Yes - where are my legs?

SEAGOON: Are you now aware of the danger from German long-range guns?

CRUN: Mnk ahh! I've got it - I have the answer - just by chance I happen to have on me a box of German matches.

SEAGOON: Wonderful - strike one - they won't fire at their own matches.

CRUN: Of course not – now …

FX: MATCH STRIKING - WHISTLE OF INCOMING SHELL - SHELL EXPLODES.

CRUN: ...Curse the British!!!

Peter Sellers fan by any chance?

 

[smartcooky]

Peter Sellers fan by any chance?

Well goodness, gracious me, how did you guess?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I didn't come up with the definition.

...

No, you just decided to use a narrow definition to confirm your bias.

 

[jimbob]

Well goodness, gracious me, how did you guess?

I think that France's greatest detective would have been able to guess it from the clues that you have left.

 

[A'isha]

True. Furthermore, it should be clear by now that the approach we've tried for several decades now - little retaliation, no challenge to Muslims who pretend Jihadism is not connected to Islam and so on - is simply not working.

I've said this many times over, but it can never be said too many times - do you guys know what happens when sufficient anger is accumulated and it boils over? Suppose an equivalent of Beslan siege happened in, say, Paris and hundreds of children died. How do you think the French would react when the Islamic leaders would yet again meekly claim this had "nothing to do with Islam"?
Random pogroms aren't even the main concern. Electing leaders who will make it an official policy is.

Do you guys want that? Because that's quite possibly the future. Donald Trump isn't the problem, he is the symptom of a problem that went essentially unaddressed for some forty years. I'm not prepared to sacrifice the decades and centuries of humanist progress so a devout follower of a 7^th century warlord isn't offended. Because that's what's at stake here, honestly. Their feelings versus our civilization.

McHrozni

If your reaction to a terrorist attack is to go on a genocidal tear against the one fifth of the human population that had nothing to do with the attack save for sharing the same religion as the perpetrators, you've pretty much forfeited any claim to the decades and centuries of humanist progress.

 

[cullennz]

True. Furthermore, it should be clear by now that the approach we've tried for several decades now - little retaliation, no challenge to Muslims who pretend Jihadism is not connected to Islam and so on - is simply not working.

I've said this many times over, but it can never be said too many times - do you guys know what happens when sufficient anger is accumulated and it boils over? Suppose an equivalent of Beslan siege happened in, say, Paris and hundreds of children died. How do you think the French would react when the Islamic leaders would yet again meekly claim this had "nothing to do with Islam"?
Random pogroms aren't even the main concern. Electing leaders who will make it an official policy is.

Do you guys want that? Because that's quite possibly the future. Donald Trump isn't the problem, he is the symptom of a problem that went essentially unaddressed for some forty years. I'm not prepared to sacrifice the decades and centuries of humanist progress so a devout follower of a 7^th century warlord isn't offended. Because that's what's at stake here, honestly. Their feelings versus our civilization.

McHrozni

Slightly over the top.

By about 80 feet

 

[smartcooky]

If your reaction to a terrorist attack is to go on a genocidal tear against the one fifth of the human population that had nothing to do with the attack save for sharing the same religion as the perpetrators, you've pretty much forfeited any claim to the decades and centuries of humanist progress.

Slightly over the top.

By about 80 feet

Way to completely miss the point.

Well done guys!

 

[cullennz]

Way to completely miss the point.

Well done guys!

Our civilisation?

 

[smartcooky]

Our civilisation?

Still missing it I see

 

[cullennz]

Still missing it I see

Not sure.

You could try enlightening me

 

[smartcooky]

Not sure.

You could try enlightening me

Well if you bothered to look it up (which you are obviously too lazy to do for yourself, so I'll do it for you) you would find that "civilization" has more than one meaning. The most common one is "the stage of human social development and organization that is considered most advanced."

However, in this case I believe McHrozni may be referring to the meaning "the society, culture, and way of life of a particular area."

So, if we substitute that into the bit you think is OTT...

"I'm not prepared to sacrifice the decades and centuries of humanist progress so a devout follower of a 7th century warlord isn't offended. Because that's what's at stake here, honestly. Their feelings versus our culture, and way of life!"

No so OTT now eh!?

Now while I do not presume to speak for McHrozni, I am pretty sure this is what he means, and if so, I agree with him 100%. They are already affecting our way of life.

 

[cullennz]

What utter pants.

It's a few nutters mixed in with the US ones

 

[John Nowak]

What utter pants.

So are pressure cooker bombs, according to you.

 

[McHrozni]

Now while I do not presume to speak for McHrozni, I am pretty sure this is what he means, and if so, I agree with him 100%. They are already affecting our way of life.

Precisely, and thank you.

What exactly is the upside of not offending them anyway?

McHrozni

 

[cullennz]

So are pressure cooker bombs, according to you.

In a dumpster with nothing in it while using the most stupid method known to man?

 

[smartcooky]

In a dumpster with nothing in it while using the most stupid method known to man?

That "most stupid method known to man" was pretty effective in killing three people and wounding 264 in Boston, 2013.

Please don't tell me you are one of those nutjobs who think the Boston Marathon Bombing was a hoax and all the dead and injured (including those who got limbs blown-off) were vicsims.

 

[John Nowak]

In a dumpster with nothing in it while using the most stupid method known to man?

Please, you're just embarrassing yourself at this point.

Stop acting as though your knee-jerk "common sense" trumps reality. Learn a bit before you post, or add a bit of humility.

 

[ddt]

The problem is that you can't begin to adress an issue correctly, far less cure it, unless you understand it. Or leaders saying things like "islam is peace", "ISIS is not Islamic" are just wrong. If they really believe that, then they will be unable to formulate a long term strategy and will only be able to apply short term tactical band aids to the problem via done strikes and the like.

There is a battle of ideologies. And so far we aren't even fighting it. ..

There are two different, related problems. The first is that ISIS has conquered vast parts of Syria and Iraq and has instituted an Islamist terror regime there. The second is that some Muslims in the West feel attracted to ISIS' ideology and either try to get to Syria to join ISIS, or plan and commit terror attacks in their home countries. These radicalized form a small part of the Muslim communities in the West, and they're invariably late teens or twens, and second generation immigrants. That is what happens, and, frankly, I don't understand why that happens either.

But the vast, vast majority of Western Muslims are against this. Their clerics speak against it; these youngsters typically don't get radicalized in their local mosque, but online. Their parents are against it; often they don't know about it until it's too late, and they're aghast when they find out. There are legion stories of parents going to the police saying "my son wants to join ISIS, please stop him". Look at the figures in the link Aisha posted: 26% of the jihadists that the American security services track, have been tipped off by family or their community.