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Man kills thief, accomplice charged with murder.

Drudgewire said:
I do agree a murder charge is extreme. The spirit of the law was for armed robbery or home invasions where there was legitimate risk of bodily harm to the intended victim. That doesn't really apply here.
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It let him act as a man, I think the spirit of the law holds up. He stood his ground as the stand your ground law says. Seems to fit the intent perfectly.
 
Cavemonster said:
If it was a base jump executed at what could be termed "excessive risk" to the extent that a robbery and using a car as a weapon constitutes excessive risk, then I'd say that criminal negligence might be a realistic charge for those involved in the base jump.
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It involves trespassing in a great many instances. So they commit the crime of trespassing and one dies purring it, so the rest are murders.

For example when that woman died in that demonstration for base jumping all the demonstrators and the rangers who stood by to arrest her should all have been charged with murder.
 
I think what distinguishes this from other murders is the shared culpability in the wrongful death.

Normally, the guilt is 100% with the murderer. Off the top of my head, I can't think of any circumstances in which someone might contribute to his own wrongful death. People do contribute to their own justifiable deaths all the time, when they are killed by someone protecting his own life or that of someone else, or killed in the process of committing some other crime. In such cases, the killer isn't prosecuted, because the killing was justifiable - the blame for the death lay entirely with the deceased.

But here we have a case where the blame is shared by both the dead woman and her accomplice. He has blame because he was committing a felony with her. Had he not chosen to steal the SUV, they would not have been shot. She has blame because she (presumably) willingly took part in the felony that ended with her death.

So the question at the root of this is, can someone be held responsible for someone's death when the victim was also partly responsible through her own felonious actions?

It appears the Florida law says, "yes."

Interesting case. I find myself in the odd position of not disagreeing with Lonewolf. Not sure I agree with him, either, though.
 
Lonewulf said:
Yeah, poke the "aetheists" in this forum. That'll get you far and totally won't cause a derail...
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Surely you're not suggesting aetheists are as humorless in their lack of belief as fundies are in their excessive belief?:)
 
ponderingturtle said:
It involves trespassing in a great many instances. So they commit the crime of trespassing and one dies purring it, so the rest are murders.

For example when that woman died in that demonstration for base jumping all the demonstrators and the rangers who stood by to arrest her should all have been charged with murder.
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There is a meaningful difference between engaging in a dangerous activity and being present at a dangerous activity. I don't know the details of the case you're referring to (link maybe?) but everyone who actively assists in a group activity with an unreasonable risk is responsible for the consequences. Simply being there is not at all similar.
 
Holler Hoojer said:
Surely you're not suggesting aetheists are as humorless in their lack of belief as fundies are in their excessive belief?:)
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I'm not sure what the joke was supposed to be, exactly.

Some "humor" is actually funny. Some isn't.
 
BPSCG said:
I think what distinguishes this from other murders is the shared culpability in the wrongful death.

Normally, the guilt is 100% with the murderer. Off the top of my head, I can't think of any circumstances in which someone might contribute to his own wrongful death. People do contribute to their own justifiable deaths all the time, when they are killed by someone protecting his own life or that of someone else, or killed in the process of committing some other crime. In such cases, the killer isn't prosecuted, because the killing was justifiable - the blame for the death lay entirely with the deceased.

...
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I'm just thinking out loud here but there may be circumstances where the deceased made a mistake but the owner or police behaved over-zealously and caused a tragedy.

For instance, that story a few years ago of some kids in Ohio who snuck onto someone's property because they believed the house was haunted. The owner didn't like visitors and he had a big ol' gun and the story ended in tragedy.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/conten...7/15/rachel1.ART_ART_07-15-07_A1_1V798GI.html

Blame on both sides. The kids were idiots and the owner was crazy.
 
EeneyMinnieMoe said:
I'm just thinking out loud here but there may be circumstances where the deceased made a mistake but the owner or police behaved over-zealously and caused a tragedy.

For instance, that story a few years ago of some kids in Ohio who snuck onto someone's property because they believed the house was haunted. The owner didn't like visitors and he had a big ol' gun and the story ended in tragedy.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/conten...7/15/rachel1.ART_ART_07-15-07_A1_1V798GI.html

Blame on both sides. The kids were idiots and the owner was crazy.
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Given that the owner shot them as they were in their car driving away, it's a bit more clear cut than you make out.
 
quixotecoyote said:
Given that the owner shot them as they were in their car driving away, it's a bit more clear cut than you make out.
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Well, they were trying to get into someone's house. They should never have been there and probably were breaking the law.

The owners had a right to be angry, though they should have called the cops instead of going Dirty Harry on three dumb kids.
 
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EeneyMinnieMoe said:
Well, they were trying to get into someone's house. They should never have been there and probably were breaking the law.
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Say rather that they had been trying to get into someone's house and they probably had been breaking the law.

The owners had a right to be angry, though they should have called the cops instead of going Dirty Harry on three dumb kids.
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True.
 
EeneyMinnieMoe said:
Well, they were trying to get into someone's house. They should never have been there and probably were breaking the law.

The owners had a right to be angry, though they should have called the cops instead of going Dirty Harry on three dumb kids.
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Obviously, given some people's position on this thread, the surviving kids should all be thrown in jail for life for Murder II.
 
Cavemonster said:
There is a meaningful difference between engaging in a dangerous activity and being present at a dangerous activity. I don't know the details of the case you're referring to (link maybe?) but everyone who actively assists in a group activity with an unreasonable risk is responsible for the consequences. Simply being there is not at all similar.
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link

That is the specific case, but base jumping often involves entering high buildings with our permission to jump off them. SO it would seem to be a death in the course of a felony.
 
Bob Blaylock said:
Apparently, illiteracy counts as a superpower.
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Beeps can crack jokes at my expense; he's cool enough to get away with it.

You, on the other hand, are not.

Hint for you, as you seem to miss the obvious: Intentionally misspelling something does not mean "illiteracy". I know, it's hard for you to comprehend. That's okay. I forgive you for it.

For the record, "Lonewulf" comes with emulating "Beowulf". I know, it's literature, so I doubt you're familiar with it.
 
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