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Lucianarchy and remote viewing

thaiboxerken

Penultimate Amazing
Joined
Sep 17, 2001
Messages
34,537
So, Luci, do you think that you can divine what's in Randi's "remote viewing" locker? Read the Randi comments for the details.

When you beat that simple challenge, I'll apologize and admit that you have superpowers.

:D
 
thaiboxerken said:
So, Luci, do you think that you can divine what's in Randi's "remote viewing" locker? Read the Randi comments for the details.

When you beat that simple challenge, I'll apologize and admit that you have superpowers.

:D

The psi effect works only through co-operation, that is why Randi has the "Out" in his challenge, a challenge is not co-operation. ladybrook
 
The psi effect works only through co-operation, that is why Randi has the "Out" in his challenge, a challenge is not co-operation. ladybrook

The object in the locker has to co-operate?

The locker has to co-operate?

The air between you ans the object has to co-operate?

Etc, etc, etc.

Some super power... :rolleyes:
 
That should explain why they didn't catch the snipers back then, or why corpses and kidnaped people (the Lindberg's son case comes to mind) cannot be located by remote viewing.

Sheesh, nobody seems to cooperate ever!
 
Re: Re: Lucianarchy and remote viewing

Lucianarchy said:


The psi effect works only through co-operation, that is why Randi has the "Out" in his challenge, a challenge is not co-operation. ladybrook
:dl:
 
Re: Re: Lucianarchy and remote viewing

Lucianarchy said:


The psi effect works only through co-operation, that is why Randi has the "Out" in his challenge, a challenge is not co-operation. ladybrook

This is an silly statement. Randi is more than willing to work with remote-viewers. What more does Randi need to do in order to be "cooperative" in this challenge. Maybe if he sent you an e-mail telling you what's in the locker, you'd be able to remote-view it, is that what you mean?

Yet again, Luci has come up with a lame-ass excuse for not being able to show off his superpowers.
 
Why doesn't Randi just put one or several unusual objects on his desk at JREF and see if a RVer can see his desk and what's on them, keeping more in line with their claims. I am not familiar with their claim that they can remote view the inside of blacked out boxes such as lockers. Randi always seems to want to change the claimant's claim. The penchant for doing this seems to pervade a number of members here who also facetiously offer up feats they think psychics or remote viewers should be able to accomplish. I think it is extremely important to see what the claim is and then stick to it.

When Brig. General Dozer, was kidnapped by the Red Brigades in 1981, remote viewers identified the block, by description he was on, named the city (Padua-He was kidnapped from Verona) that he was in an apartment and in the apartment they had seen a blue tent set-up in the middle of the floor. Dozer was kept inside this tent in the apartment but an RVer could not see inside the darkened tent. Nevertheless, this info passed by US intelligence to Italian anti-terrorist police, and was later verified as veridical.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Er this is the account Claus also asked me to report immediately to the authorities. He said I was witholding vital information about this kidnapping and that I must report it. Needless to say I didn't report it but now, do so here:

On December 17, 1981, Red Brigade terrorists kidnapped Brigadier General James Dozier from his apartment in Verona, Italy. Dozier, the highest ranking U.S. NATO officer in Italy, was eventually rescued in Padua by an elite Italian anti-terrorist police unit, which also effected the arrests of five of his captors. The rescue team was comprised of elements from the Nucleo Operativo Centrale di Sicurezza (NOCS).

In January 1982, members of NOCS carried out a lightning raid on an apartment in Padua to free Gen. Dozier. Assaulting at just after 11:30 a.m. to take advantage of the bustle on the streets and the noise of a construction crew's bulldozer nearby, ten NOCS men arrived in front of the apartment building in a moving van and were dressed in civilian clothes (though they wore ballistic vests and balaclavas). One assault team member split off to seal a supermarket door near the apartment entrance so the innocent bystanders could not wander out, while the other nine men assaulted the apartment. One member of NOCS - a competitive weightlifter - took out the door quickly; another NOCS man efficiently took out a terrorist encountered in the hall with a karate blow to the forehead. As still another terrorist prepared to execute Gen. Dozier, a NOCS man felled him with a blow from the butt of his M12. The layout, as given by remote viewers in the U.S. was obviously crucial to the success of this operation.

In a recent interview with Jeff Rense, McMoneagle had this to say, "the only information that I was given was a photograph of the General, his name, and I was asked to describe the location in which he was being held. No one had any idea which country he was even being held in at the time." When asked if he was correct, he responded, "Yes, I was the only one who produced the actual name of the city that he was being held in."
 
Why doesn't Randi just put one or several unusual objects on his desk at JREF and see if a RVer can see his desk and what's on them, keeping more in line with their claims.

Why is having an object in a locker different?

I am not familiar with their claim that they can remote view the inside of blacked out boxes such as lockers. Randi always seems to want to change the claimant's claim.

So, remote-viewers can see without their eyes around the globe.. but put it in a locker and they can't? Is this what you are asserting? Their claim is that they can see anything, anywhere. Inside of a locker qualifies as anywhere.

I think it is extremely important to see what the claim is and then stick to it.

The locker is well within their claimed abilities.

When Brig. General Dozer, was kidnapped by the Red Brigades in 1981, remote viewers identified the block, by description he was on, named the city (Padua-He was kidnapped from Verona) that he was in an apartment and in the apartment they had seen a blue tent set-up in the middle of the floor. Dozer was kept inside this tent in the apartment but an RVer could not see inside the darkened tent. Nevertheless, this info passed by US intelligence to Italian anti-terrorist police, and was later verified as veridical.

So goes the story. But this fictional account is just that. Are you asserting that remote viewers can't see inside of a dark locker? Or they can't see in the dark? Or that they can't see inside of tents? What are you asserting here?


In a recent interview with Jeff Rense, McMoneagle had this to say, "the only information that I was given was a photograph of the General, his name, and I was asked to describe the location in which he was being held. No one had any idea which country he was even being held in at the time." When asked if he was correct, he responded, "Yes, I was the only one who produced the actual name of the city that he was being held in."


Yep, and I turn big and green when I get angry.

So, bring on a remote-viewer that you know and have that person apply for the JREF challenge. I'm sure Randi can cater a test more inline with what that particular remote-viewer claims. Right now, Randi's little challenge is just exactly what it says, he's challenging anyone to use paranormal ability to find out what's in his locker.

If you don't think remote-viewers can do it, just say so and quit making excuses for why they can't.




:rolleyes:
 
I'd like to also point out that self-proclaimed remote-viewer, Lucianarchy, has stated "uncooperative" as the reason he can't do the locker test. He didn't mention that lockers and dark places being a limit.

Why would mundane factors, like lockers and light, be a limit to remote-viewers anyway?
 
Why would mundane factors, like lockers and light, be a limit to remote-viewers anyway?

All superpowers have a weakness. Superman can't see through lead with his x-ray vision, Green Lantern's powers are countered by the color yellow, and remote viewers can see anywhere except a dark locker. Makes sense to me.
 
THAI: Why would mundane factors, like lockers and light, be a limit to remote-viewers anyway?


Reply: Your remarks ignore my statement. These mundane factors which you call them are not part of their claim. Are you saying you would ask a remote viewer to do something which they do not claim to do? That is what Randi is asking with this new little farce of his. This ishis game and he plays it so well he's got you and a lot of people fooled. He could set up a much simpler experiment that meets RV's relatively simple conditions and fits its claims.

Randi tried to do this with Natalia as well -- placing her reading material inside a black box. This was not her claim. And you thai,
are now doing it also ........... Randi loves black boxes and doing experiments in he dark. I wonder why that is.

If learn anything here, please learn that if you want to test some extrasensory form of perception you should do so in
response to the claim of the posessor and not make up your own
claims.

:book:
 
Of course you are assuming that the inside of the locker is not lit.

Perhaps a remote viewer could take a peek and tell if they need some light on the subject? I'm sure Randi could put a battery powered lamp in there. Perhaps a cooperative lamp for Lucianarchy?
 
c0rbin said:


The object in the locker has to co-operate?

The locker has to co-operate?

The air between you ans the object has to co-operate?

Etc, etc, etc.

Some super power... :rolleyes:

No, just the living systems which are consciously involved. You are more likely to get a positive result that way.
 
Reply: Your remarks ignore my statement. These mundane factors which you call them are not part of their claim. Are you saying you would ask a remote viewer to do something which they do not claim to do?

What, exactly, is their claim? Randi is making a broad challenge, it's not a specific challenge aimed at a specific remote-viewer. It's not uncommon for a remote-viewer to claim the ability to see into places.

He could set up a much simpler experiment that meets RV's relatively simple conditions and fits its claims.

Feel free to e-mail Randi and give some advice then.

Randi tried to do this with Natalia as well -- placing her reading material inside a black box. This was not her claim. And you thai,
are now doing it also ........... Randi loves black boxes and doing experiments in he dark. I wonder why that is.


LOL. She claimed she can read without her eyes. A box sufficiently would demonstrate her ability, if she had one.

If learn anything here, please learn that if you want to test some extrasensory form of perception you should do so in
response to the claim of the posessor and not make up your own
claims.


Or that some people will make any excuse as to why remote-viewers fail.
 
Luci: No, just the living systems which are consciously involved. You are more likely to get a positive result that way.

Luci, surely you know that during the cold war our remote viewers rv'd many soviet targets and they were not exactly on friendly terms with us let alone cooperative. If you are concerned about the experimenter effect, which would be present in Randi, then this could be a problem. I do know that all their best known targets have not been locked up in the pitch darkness because they purport to see their targets in the light. I cant think of any precedents for RVing in total darkness but I could be wrong.
Variations including map RVing and coordinate RVing could probably be in the dark but not target RVing such as Randi is
proposing.

I think this is another Randi effort to foist unclaimed abiliies on
claimants and he knows better than all of us that what he proposes is not their claim, its his perception of how to screw them over. Hence the experimenter effect.
 
Lucianarchy, can you do remote viewing? If so, what would it take for you to, say for example, describe the poster on my bedroom wall?
 
If any remote viewer actually . . . oh, I don't know . . . ACCEPTED the challenge, they could request a lighted area. At the moment, you are throwing out hypothetical objections from hypothetical people with hypothetical powers with hypothetical limitations who might, one day, if the stars align, actually deign to get up off the couch and have world-changing powers tested.

But UNTIL THEN, since no one has actually accepted the challenge, I would say that neither they nor you -- speaking on their behalf hypothetically -- have much say.

If they can see things and if they need light, they can fill out the form and give that as a condition of the test.


The form can be downloaded; many Notaries will verify your document for free; stamps are cheap; the form can be filled out and mailed inside 10 minutes.

It would shut up the critics, it would shake the very foundations of what we know about the human body, it would earn a million dollars for the hypothetical person or their hypothetical charity of choice.

So if any of these gifted people actually need a lighted area for remote viewing, have them use their awsome powers to find a pen or pencil and fill out the bleeding form.

Good night.
 
I absolutely agree. If anyone accepts the challenge they should be able to stipulate the conditions by which they can exert their claim.

Randi's offer, however, is not hypothetical. My understanding is its on the table. He really should not be setting conditions without consulting an actual challenger. In other words he
should familiarize himself with all the flavors of remote viewing
and agree to stipulate to the conditions required before
publicizing any of his own... but what the hey, its his challenge
or thats's what everybody says.
 
SteveGrenard said:
I absolutely agree. If anyone accepts the challenge they should be able to stipulate the conditions by which they can exert their claim.

Randi's offer, however, is not hypothetical. My understanding is its on the table. He really should not be setting conditions without consulting an actual challenger. In other words he
should familiarize himself with all the flavors of remote viewing
and agree to stipulate to the conditions required before
publicizing any of his own... but what the hey, its his challenge
or thats's what everybody says.

(1) What "actual challenger?" As no one has come forward to say whether their hypothetical power may or may not hypothetically work this way, -there- -IS- -no- -challenger-.

You seem to be willfully confusing this remote viewing "challenge" with the standard JREF challenge which sets no conditions apart from what both parties agree to.

Me: At the moment, you are throwing out hypothetical objections from hypothetical people with hypothetical powers with hypothetical limitations who might, one day, if the stars align, actually deign to get up off the couch and have world-changing powers tested.

Randi does not have any duty to scout the globe for people who won't fill out a form and accept his challenge to find singularly ill-named "challengers" who don't actually challenge.

(2) As above. If a "challenger" wants input in how anything is set up, then they can "accept" the "challenge."

Again, for those in the back row: If someone with these abilities has an actual problem with this test, they can come to an arrangement with Randi concerning test conditions by taking a very small amount of time and filling out the form. If they want a lighted room, great. If they only view vegetables, fine. If they need a color-wheel plugged in nearby and Nirvana playing in the background, just ask.

NA
 
Lucianarchy said:


No, just the living systems which are consciously involved. You are more likely to get a positive result that way.

This must be why RVers have such difficulty finded dead bodies.

Steve,

If physical factors such as darkness can be so limiting as to negate the TRV ability, why was Psi Tech so positive that Elizabeth Smart's body was located in the crypt it was supposedly located in. I can't imagine it was would have had any light in there, or any more light than might seep under the door.

I also am continually bemused at how Psi powers that seem to be completely unrestrained by the laws of physics can suddenly be rendered useless by something as mundane as a burned out light bulb.
 

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