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Loose Change

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Hutch said:
Edited to add: Well, I'm flabergasted; He seems to have backed completely down on his 767-300 contention.

Nicely done, CurtC.
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Good job there! I'm looking forward to reading Sun Zoo's 'The Art of Backpedaling."
 
Beleth said:
What exactly would be investigated?

I mean, the physical evidence is pretty well gone. Wherever it went, be it China or Jersey or that warehouse they put the Ark of the Covenant, the physical evidence has all been moved and cooled.

Videos? That's being done constantly anyway.

Eyewitness testimony? Given that memories change after the fact, these aren't going to be of much use either.

Sekrit gubmint files? If they exist, we'll never see them. Not for another 50 years at least.

So what is left?
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So in your opinion, NIST's soon to be released report of the collapsing of WTC7 will be inconclusive?

Videos of police and firefighter testimony of hearing explosives might be as useful of an evidence as videos of a plane hitting the pentagon?

If the fbi and the cia failed to connect the dots prior to sept 11, how were they able to name 19 hijackers within a week of the attacks? Simply by looking at the passenger manifest including the arab-sounding names? If these names are on the terrorist watch list, how were they able to get in and out of the US with the visa prior to sept 11?
 
Gravy said:
Good job there! I'm looking forward to reading Sun Zoo's 'The Art of Backpedaling."
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His response is fair. He's acknowledged the measurements I made, but hasn't vacated the idea that it was a 767-300 (and therefore couldn't have been flight 175). He's asking for more measurements, and something that won't be affected by perspective like the wingtips being raised up high.

You can read the thread here.
 
geggy said:
So in your opinion, NIST's soon to be released report of the collapsing of WTC7 will be inconclusive?

Videos of police and firefighter testimony of hearing explosives might be as useful of an evidence as videos of a plane hitting the pentagon?

If the fbi and the cia failed to connect the dots prior to sept 11, how were they able to name 19 hijackers within a week of the attacks? Simply by looking at the passenger manifest including the arab-sounding names? If these names are on the terrorist watch list, how were they able to get in and out of the US with the visa prior to sept 11?
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Still asking questions, and nothing else, eh, Geggy ?
 
geggy said:
Still no real answers, eh, Belz?
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Speaking of which, how 'bout a response for this: What do you do for a living?

As for 9/11, there have been countless answers, my little friend. That you, in your infinite density, can't seem to decipher them, does not invalidate even one.
 
geggy said:
Still no real answers, eh, Belz?
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Funniest quote I have seen all year. Easily.

Here's the first question in the Zogby poll I'm commissioning:

geggy, when will you stop your atrocious and illegal wife-beatings?

A) How can I stop beating my wife? That doesn't make any sense.
B) Maybe soon
C) Right away
D) Those arent beatings, they're controlled demolitions from the top down disguised to look like multiple doorknob contusions.
 
Lots of 911 Truthers heve cited Noam Chomsky as an important influence. I wonder if they still do after reading his absolute smackdown of the "9/11 truth Movement."

ETA: From a smart man, to one who could probably give geggy a fight for his title: This guy was apparently one of the protestors at the premiere of "United 93." Here's what he lists as "evidence" against the government (emphasis his).
13) The bio of some of the passengers is linked with military-, government and high tech companies. Two of the passengers worked for CENSUS Bureau. The reason of their trip was not disclosed.
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What an entertaining thread, Gravy. I enjoyed this bit, early on:

...don’t think it takes a rocket scientist to understand that softly burning skyscrapers don’t collapse at free fall speed into tidy piles of rubble without the aid of explosives. How many times have you seen the collapse of WTC7 on CNN? I also think the attitude of “trust the experts” is elitist...
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I encourage this loon to visit his butcher the day he needs a triple bypass.

Oh, and the fires are "softly burning" now? "Tidy piles?"

An infinite number of monkeys pounding away at typewriters 'til the end of time couldn't craft more remarkable idiocy.
 
Regnad Kcin said:
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An infinite number of monkeys pounding away at typewriters 'til the end of time couldn't craft more remarkable idiocy.
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I'll have to respectfully disagree on this one ND. They've made it pretty clear on their forums that, at least some of them, view this as a crusade to undermine the gov't and truth be d@mn3d. If they are wrong, and I believe they are, they are detracting from real issues that people should be concerned about regarding the gov't; they are promoting the destablization of the federal infrastructure; and they are aiding (intentionally or not) those that would like to see the collapse of the US.

Unlike moon-hoax theorists, or Area-51 theorists, I don't think the wild conjectures of 9/11 theorists are harmless. Heck, Chomsky said it pretty good:
...
My reasons for giving this low priority are simple: it has been draining enormous energy away from work on far more serious crimes of the administration against the US population and the world (which is why, I suspect, it is getting such a tolerant reception in the mainstream, dramatically different from the hysterical abuse and slanders that are elicited at once by anything directed to real power interests). That would be sufficient reason to give it low priority.

Further reason is that to evaluate the alleged evidence requires the kind of expert knowledge that can’t be picked up from surfing the internet: it requiressubstantial understanding of civil/mechanical engineering, the specific characteristics of the building, evaluation of photos, etc., and I don’t see dropping what I’m doing and taking off a great deal of time to pick up the requisite background and evalute the evidence. And a story will also have to be told about the planes and passengers, the massive cover-up involving huge numbers of people and (miraculously) no leaks, and why the administration would have been so utterly insane as to try something like this (which hasn’t the remotest analogue in history).

But those considerations aside, the vasts amount of energy being poured into this has been quite harmful to activism on serious and urgent issues—hence the relevance of the speculations based on the declassification documents.
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geggy said:
Miss Zogby poll: over 70 million american adults support new 9/11 investigation...
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Hmm, would that be the notoriously inaccurate Zogby poll, the one that predicted Kerry would beat Bush in 2004 by a landslide -- on election night, no less? The poll conducted by the man whose brother founded the Arab-American Institute, and thus might have strong motivation for attempting to turn blame for 9/11 away from Arab extremists? (Come on, you CT'ers would be all over that last fact like flies on manure if the situation were reversed.)

Is that the Zogby poll you're referring to, geggy?
 
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Stellafane said:
Hmm, would that be the notoriously innacurate Zogby poll, the one that predicted Kerry would beat Bush in 2004 by a landslide -- on election night, no less? The poll conducted by the man whose brother founded the Arab-American Institute, and thus might have strong motivation for attempting to turn blame for 9/11 away from Arab extremists? (Come on, you CT'ers would be all over that last fact like flies on manure if the situation were reversed.)

Is that the Zogby poll you're referring to, geggy?
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Well, one wants to be fair to Mr. Zogby. When he first broke on the scene in a big way it was because he had enormous success in election accuracy -- in particular, he did a better job than others of polling state races. His more recent polls have been somewhat less successful, as noted. But the available evidence indicates that he's a real pollster (at least for the polls his organization authors -- his recent trend of asking whatever idiot questions anyone pays him for and allowing his name to be put on it is extremely troubling) with real credibility.
 
geggy said:
Still no real answers, eh, Belz?



Watch this video and listen closely...I wonder if they were speaking of WTC7 or the towers? I cant seem to make it out.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/firefighters_bomb_in_building.wmv
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Someone posted that video link to a thread on the IIDB forum, geggy.
I had the same question.
It's obviously video of 7 and since that audio accompanies it I would expect they're talking about 7 too. I asked the poster where he got it from hoping
that would help me try to verify that. But so far he hasn't replied.

By the way, the original poster's intent in posting that video was to show us the fire must have been more extensive than the woo-woo's wanna accept because how in the hell else could it produce that much smoke.
 
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