Loose Change

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Pardalis said:
Does that mean that geggy's shift is over? Are they switching places like in a relay race? Damn, I was looking forward to reading his explanation of his controlled-demolition-looking-like-a-false-failure-from-the-top theory...:(
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And I was kind of looking forward to learning whether pretty much every surviving member of FDNY was either in on the conspiracy or dumb as a bag of rocks not to notice the thousands of detonators which were doubtless in the rubble of the World Trade Center.
 
Zoilus said:
Okay so I'm on the fence but I wanna believe the OV. Tell me something that will make me believe it. Give me your strongest case (I've read some of this thread, but 3,000+ posts--fuhgedaboutit).
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Be gone, troll!

Oh, wait, I thought this was the LC forum for a second.

I mean: Welcome, Zoilus!
 
Hello to Zoilus.
Strongest case? Im unsure how to respond to that? Its not like a murder case of someone stabbing someone else and dna puts them at the scene. Its a complex detailed operation performed by some mad religious folk. In the end the complexity was shown to be just faults in the methods of departments and communication between them in the USA. These guys wlaked in, hijacked planes and smashed them into landmarks with the intent of a major catastrophy.

I suggest you do read the entire thread and skip the parts that have at times degenerated to a bit of slander here and there.

There was a few notable posters.
Alek, then there was Roxdog - I believe he is a bit of a big Kahoona at the LC forum, and of course Geggy.

Very much everything they posted was based on their own assessment of the situation without the desire to learn. I mean that in an unoffensive way such as me building a house without any help or instruction. Then a windy night smashes it to twigs. However depsite my friend in the building industry saying 'nah nah you idiot, look, this is how it works' I close my ears and eyes and say 'I KNOW WHAT IM DOING OK! I dont need to know or learn how it works, I just do!' These guys posted ad hoc videos and pictures and pointed to distortions in video quality as evidence of bombs and 'controlled' demolitions despite the actual time and skill and knowledge needed for such a thing being something well away from their grasp. Seriously, video pixelation was used as evidence of 'squibs'. Please....

Some simple things or facts which are shown in high detail throughout the thread refute much of what is the crust of the arguement the CTers put forth.

Again I do suggest you read the thread or I can see you will get yelled at as seriously, the main guys here have been through the same arguements at least 4 or 5 times. Within those 4 or 5 times we hear things like:

"It was a controlled demolition made to not look like a controlled demolition"
No timers. No thermite. No Explosive chemicals. Uniquely done by thousands of demo experts without thousands of people noticing the explosives or strange personnel in the building. Lets just imagine 'they' (those all secretive globalists) did put the explosives there. Can you envision the amount needed? I cant, and im not even an expert. Problem from this point is neither can the experts. Since they all agree that the building fell on its own accord from damage sustained from two airliners slammed into it without pre planted explosives.

"I believe the passengers were offloaded and the planes remotely flown in"
Never mind the amount of people to conduct fake calls etc, the DNA of passengers, luggage, body parts, the air traffic controller records, black box recorders, but the sheer amount of people needed to be involved to pull this off all needing to be 'paid' off....

Then of course the missle theory....I just wont bother - please READ the thread.

Other examples of such idiocy in the face of just basic evidence is actually amazing to think that it even needs to be addressed. Its completely illogical. Its like argueing that red is blue and not red.

Seriously, please read the thread before posting further. Its an effort yes, but worthwhile. Good things come to those who wait. If you want to gather knowledge and wisdom, you need to invest time.

Cheers
 
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Pardalis said:
Does that mean that geggy's shift is over? Are they switching places like in a relay race? Damn, I was looking forward to reading his explanation of his controlled-demolition-looking-like-a-false-failure-from-the-top theory...:(
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That's the brilliance of their strategy - right when we get one having to defend what borders on insanity, a new one comes in to start from point A again.
 
Somebody's set a new standard in debunking debunkings. looks like Gravy has another looooong night ahead of him with this one:

911physicsDOTatspaceDOTcom/Pages/Debunking911Myths.htm

(stinkin 15 post requirement)
 
I would love to see a major company sue these f***wads for slander. Just claiming all this crap without thinking it. The same claims over and over and over.

God damn it. These guys are immensly stupid. Uh...its a blight on humanity.
 
When it's written is it Libel or Slander? I forget which is which.

Either way, they should be more careful in the accusations they make. The LC producers should distance themselves from this statement. It would be the first intelligent thing they've done yet.
 
I'm typing a heads up for thier PR contact right now.

A case like this will be an easy pick-up for a junior trial lawyer looking for his first win.

The big question is, how retarded are they? Are they so insane that they'll think getting thier day in court will help them?

Or will we see thier true colors shine through as they desperately try to settle out of court for something less than the mortgage on grandma's house?
 
My quick rebuttal of the first page of http://911physics.atspace.com/Pages/Debunking911Myths.htm follows.

Quotes taken from http://911physics.atspace.com/Pages/Debunking911Myths/Hijackers.htm

Why doesn't Mike mention the following:

THREE OF THE alleged hijackers listed their address on drivers licenses and car registrations as the Naval Air Station in Pensacola, Fla.—known as the “Cradle of U.S. Navy Aviation,” according to a high-ranking U.S. Navy source.

Why would the hijackers put their home addresses as being the Naval Air Station if they didn't train there? Or did the Hijackers manage to steal the identifies of several Arabs who just coincidently were being trained by the US Military?
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My Answer: You need to provide a cite other than an anonymous source for the claim that the hijackers gave Pensacola as their address. Scans of their licenses and registration papers would do. Until then this is an empty assertion.

Here it would appear 911Myths is attacking a straw man, no serious 9/11 researcher has ever sighted this a key piece of evidence. You can choose to believe that Mohamed Atta's passport did survive. However this story like many others was later retracted. If Mike had done some serious research he would know this. I think it's pretty sad he is trying to prove something which is now denied by the US Government.
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My Answer: This is the No True Scotsman fallacy in action. You can't just define away all the wingnuts who referred to the passports as "not being serious".

His response is not true, for the reason that the Hijackers saw there names and photos on television and actually went to the American embassy in Saudi Arabia and told the authorities that they wanted there names and photos taken off the FBI most wanted list.
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My Answer: As above, get some evidence.

All he seems to be investigating is whether or not Hani Hanjour was a poor pilot. At best he was said to have below average to average piloting skills. Mike fails to discuss the difficulty of the maneuvers the alleged hijackers supposedly made.

Russ Wittenburg a former Vietnam Combat and Commercial Pilot says there is no way any commercial pilot yet alone an amateur like Hani Hanjour could of possibly flown "Flight 77" in the manner it was flown.
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My Answer: Russ Wittenburg is a lunatic and no other pilots agree with him. Nor has he shown his work.

Mike's response is basically that the planes could not of been remote controlled because they would of had to have had several cameras aboard them. This is not true at all, the planes could simply be programmed to fly exactly where they wanted to, how do you think autopilot works?
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My Answer: Autopilots can't magically compensate for wind and whatnot at the last second. Sufficiently advanced instruments and computers could conceivably do the job, but then you have the job of explaining who created this amazing technology and installed it, why nobody phoned the ground saying "Hey, this plane is flying itself!" and so on and so forth. This idea requires a ridiculously complicated conspiracy to work.

Since this information came from the US Government we cannot conclude that it is at all accurate or that it has any truth to it what so ever. It may just be a coincidence that none of the hijackers bodies were identified, but how many coincidences are you going to believe?
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My Answer: It's not a coincidence, you moron. Can't you read? The hijackers could not be identified by DNA because nobody had DNA samples from them at the time. Thus they are not on the list of people identified by DNA. How is that a coincidence?
 
Thanks Gravy

Gravy said:
Welcome! Why do you want to believe the official version?


The choices you gave and comments you made don't sound like they came from someone who wants to believe the OV. Are those really tha only ways you think 9/11 could have played out? And what would you like to see investigated more thoroughly, and why?
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Who would they trust to do the investigation? Structural engineers? No the've already spoken so we can't trust them. A professor at a religious school? Sounds reliable to me.

These worthless liars are scamming thier cluesess sheep, oh wait they have a lot of clues, they just can't tell us what they mean


Thanks Gravy, you, along with the other posters are truely doing a rotten job that needs doing and doing it well.
 
Sword_Of_Truth said:
Somebody's set a new standard in debunking debunkings. looks like Gravy has another looooong night ahead of him with this one:

911physicsDOTatspaceDOTcom/Pages/Debunking911Myths.htm

(stinkin 15 post requirement)
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Nah. One line "rebuttals?' Laughable photo "evidence?" More wild speculation? This guy's not bright at all. He's still using Karl Schwarz as an expert! Next.
 
Sword_Of_Truth said:
I'm typing a heads up for thier PR contact right now.

A case like this will be an easy pick-up for a junior trial lawyer looking for his first win.

The big question is, how retarded are they? Are they so insane that they'll think getting thier day in court will help them?

Or will we see thier true colors shine through as they desperately try to settle out of court for something less than the mortgage on grandma's house?
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Sultanist had given CDI a heads up about this stuff a while ago, and got a response from Stacey Loizeaux:
I had a suspicion this was probably just more of the mountain of 9-11 bul***it being circulated on the Internet, so I decide to make contact with CDI to get at the bottom of it.
I sent them this email...
_____________________________________
Gentlemen,

Speaking as an American, I am in desperate need of your assistance.
You may or may not be aware that upwards of six hundred thousand pages of the World Wide Web are now devoted to advancing "theories" to explain the events of 9-11. One of the widespread claims being that the three skyscrapers in the World Trade Center were collapsed by "controlled demolition" .
It has now gotten to the point that one of the individuals in the forefront of this, a former Professor of Religion at the Claremont School of Theology (Claremont, California), Dr. David Ray Griffin, is making the claim that "a demolition expert employed by Controlled Demolitions Inc." is stating that "this type of collapse could only have been done through a planned event, using precisely placed explosives".
Dr. Griffin's claim is being advanced on the Internet as we speak. And believe me a great many people are reading this. A claim which is now directly involving the reputation and credibility of your organization.
I ask you to please set the record straight. Is it or is it not true that anyone involved with your organization has made this statement? And does anyone in your organization believe that the three skyscrapers of The World Trade Center may have collapsed due to controlled demolition?

Sincerely,
Bob XXXX
_______________________
I received this email reply...
_______________________
Bob,

Thank for your email and your concern for the reputability of our organization.
Of course, we’ve been aware of the numerous ludicrous conspiracy theories floating around out there and have received literally thousands of emails containing everything from simple questions to unveiled threats. Our position up until now, as a family and a firm, has been that “to acknowledge the claim is to lend it credibility” and therefore, they should be ignored.
After reading your email, however, I’m afraid we may have to take a new tack.
To put your mind at ease, I can assure you that NO individual from CDI made any such statement as that purported by Dr. Griffin, and I would greatly appreciate your forwarding me a link to the page where this is stated. If he has, indeed, committed libel in some regard, rest-assured that legal action will shortly follow.
Thanks again for the “heads-up.” I look forward to hearing back from you soon.

Regards,
Stacey
======================
Stacey S. Loizeaux
The Loizeaux Group, LLC
Controlled Demolition, Inc.
2737 Merryman's Mill Road
Phoenix, Maryland 21131 USA
______________________________________
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http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1547853&postcount=84
 
Woo Woo

Hi Gravy, just as I posted a program came on tv about 911 woo woo! lol

Funny they even had computer simulations of a plane crash as well as an eyewitness. The the dead bodies made me very mad at the LCers.

We know the passengers bought ticket and thier bodies are there on the ground under white sheets; anyone who denies that are ghouls, digging up dead people and hijacking them again
 
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