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Loch Ness Monster real?

William Parcher said:
Doc, "alien big cat" sighting claims are also common in the USA and Australia. It isn't just the Brits; but they do seem to be a bit more fervent and established in their cultish occupation with the issue. Here in the USA, we have regular reports of folks seeing black panthers (also for pumas in weird places). It's more of the same in Oz. But it's the same damn thing from each country... photos and videos of moggies that were supposed to have been panthers. Ugh!

What blows my mind is that in most of the recorded sightings the cat is black. Fairly regularly, the witness goes as far as saying that the cat was a black puma. This is a hypothetical color variant that has not yet been documented as existing anywhere at any time. Black panthers (melanistic leopards & jaguars) would be very expensive pets and are not at all common in the first place.

From my skeptical perspective, it looks like a very limited form of mass hysteria. Where there have been published reports of big cats, folks will think that any roaming moggie is "that beast everyone has been seeing". All the photos of housecats on the websites show that people are making big mistakes, or maybe trying to see just how goofy this fiasco can get.
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Reply: IMHO, both BIg Dogs and BIg Cats are mind-manifestations of an OOBE situation.

Hence, never caught.

Mostro
 
drapier said:
Indeed. From wyrdology.com/cryptozoology/owlman.html:

"The Cornish Owlman (sometimes "Owl Man") is one of the lesser known cryptids. Unlike many of the more famous "monsters" in the field of cryptozoology, it appeared only in one specific place for a very short period of time. There is no body of folklore surrounding it and there have been very few recent sightings. It could easily be dismissed out of hand were it not for the curious circumstances surrounding it.

What is the Owlman?
The Owlman was seen during the years 1976 - 1978 in the county of Cornwall. More specifically, it was seen in the vicinity of the Mawnan Village. Some of the sightings were reported to the well-known cryptozoologist Tony "Doc" Shiels who reportedly coined the name "Owlman".
The first sighting took place on April 17, 1976 and was reported by two girls, June and Vicky Melling. They reportedly saw a large, feathered "bird man" hovering over the Mawnan Church on Morgawr's Mile. The sighting left the two girls so frightened that the family cut short its holiday.

Similar sightings were reported over the next two years and a picture of the Owlman emerged: a partially feathered man sized owl with pointed ears and clawed feet. It was a silvery grey colour with slanting red eyes. Some people have seen similarities between the Owlman and the better known Mothman.

There were several sightings of the Owlman between 1976 and 1978, all in the vicinity of Mawnan Church, after which it seems to have disappeared. There have been one or two reports since then but not many."
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reply:
Likely another OOBE being, as noted in JOURNeyS OUTSIDE THE BODY

by Robt Monroe.

When you dream, and fly, you look like owlman

monstro
 
Big Les said:
Look, Carcharodon, I understand your frustration with what you see as our perceived stubbornness and "closed-mindedness". I understand that to you and many others, many reported sightings = evidence of a "monster" in Loch Ness. As sceptics, we aren't buying that. It's conjecture until you show us verfiable evidence. You must understand that at least.

I understand that the cat thing is much more of a grey area than other instances of what we refer to as "woo". There have been documented cases of it happening! What I don't understand is that in the case of the cats, you add the two things together; a few documented cases + lots of reported sightings, and come up with a correlation and therefore the idea that there have been and still are, several or more (?) big cats abroad in the UK.

Why can't it simply be that several cats have escaped/been released, subsequently found, but that the majority of the eyewitness and photo/film evidence refers to misidentifications, misinterpretations, wishful thinking, faulty memory, and all of the other fallibities inherent to the type of source?

It's not as simple as empty dismissal of your ideas, or "scoffing" at them. It's that there need be no correlation between what you see as evidence, and there actually being something real to explain them. Do you see where we're coming from at least?
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MYSTERY CATS DO NOT BELONG HERE!!!!!!!!!!

monstro
 
monstro said:
reply: Jon Downes and his beard notwithstanding,

there is some water monster in one of the lakes by Windemere.

A young black girl from London has videotaped a large, shape-changing
dark thing that had clouds of sea gulls around it, maybe 50 feet long,
absolutely not an eel.

Eels in Loch Ness? Not 20 feet for sure, and not at the surface.

Sorry John - being a brit does not make you right.

Monstro
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Why does it matter that the girl is black? Does that give her more credibility or less, in your mind? Do you regularly classify people by their skin color?
 
Blacks do not usually see paranormal things.

You seem to want some excuse to call me a racist.

So -- try this --- if you shave Bigfoot, what color is it?
 
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monstro said:
Blacks do not usually see paranormal things.
You seem to want some excuse to call me a racist.

So -- try this --- if you shave Bigfoot, what color is it?
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Are you serious?

I don't need to accuse you of anything since you seem to be running along quite well on your own.

[Bolding mine]
 
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Loch Ness Monster sighting reported by locals


Foyers shop and cafe owner Jan Hargreaves and her husband Simon believe they caught a glimpse of Loch Ness's most elusive resident — Nessie.

It was while taking a break on the store's front decking — looking out to the loch — when Mrs Hargreaves and kitchen worker Graham Baine spotted an unusual figure cutting a strange shape through the water.

"We were standing looking out and saw something that looked bizarre," said Mrs Hargreaves. "I said to my husband to come and have a look. We stand here all the time and look out and we see boats and kayaks but it didn't look like anything we have seen here before."

Despite the unidentified creature being quite a distance from their vantage point, 51-year-old Mrs Hargreaves said it had a long neck which was too long to be that of a seal and it was black in appearance.

"It went under the water and disappeared for probably 30 to 40 seconds and then came back up again," said Mrs Hargreaves. "It was around for a good four to five minutes. It was just so strange."

Keen to stress she is not seeking publicity, Mrs Hargreaves does firmly believe what she saw was the Loch Ness Monster.
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That merits resurrecting a four year old dead thread?:confused:

Ronald Binns' The Loch Ness Mystery Solved includes a photo of an otter stretching out its body to give the appearance of a long neck, giving quite a good impression of the classic "head and neck" so associated with Nessie since the surgeon's photo. My theory is that a sincere but misguided woman allowed herself to be deluded into misinterpreting an otter (or something else) for the monster. Publicity shy or not*, she is now one of the "chosen ones" who have seen the monster first hand and her account is now part of the legend and the folklore of the loch.

Recently I observed an otter swimming across a local pond. Even knowing what it was, it was an uncanny sight at first. I'd think it would be especially so if someone were predisposed to expecting/wanting to see a monster.

ETA: Oh, and what GeeMack said.



*Apparently not "shy" enough to keep her account from being circulated around the world:rolleyes:
 
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Yes, I'm sure that the cafe owner (with views of the loch) is not making it up to boost business, then again I was sure that betamax was a great product and that getting involved in Iraq was for the greater good.
:D
the headline is factually incorrect too, Jan and Simon Hargreaves are the very new owners of Foyers shop, post office and cafe. They are from Devon. They only recently took ownership, now if they could just find some way of drumming up some business.......

GeeMack said:
What was it again that Mrs. Hargreaves does for a living?
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until last week she was a social worker
:p
 
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JohnG said:
Ronald Binns' The Loch Ness Mystery Solved...
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An excellent book, by the way. It really demolishes the myth that monster sightings in Loch Ness go back hundreds of years - the oft-repeated St Columba incident supposedly took place in the River Ness and was just one of many outlandish stories told by his biographer. The legend as we know it today didn't exist before the early 1930s.
 
Alice Shortcake said:
An excellent book, by the way. It really demolishes the myth that monster sightings in Loch Ness go back hundreds of years - the oft-repeated St Columba incident supposedly took place in the River Ness and was just one of many outlandish stories told by his biographer. The legend as we know it today didn't exist before the early 1930s.
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To clarify a couple of points I've attempted to correct with you before:

  • The River Ness is connected to Loch Ness, is in the same vicinity and shares its placename.
  • There exist traditional Scottish tales of a mythical water creature called a kelpie, which emerges from the water in the guise of a horse in order to dupe people into riding it, at which point it returns to the water of its origins and devours the victim.
  • In 1879 an Aberdeen newspaper article gave an account of a kelpie in Loch Ness.

The description of the Loch Ness monster as a "sea serpent" is a product of a modern -- that is 20th century and after -- worldview. Traditional Scottish water monsters were not held to be "sea serpents" until the modern understanding of dinosaurs and plesiosaurs developed in the late 19th century.

A Scottish water horse, namely a kelpie, is a mythical, not a real animal. An eyewitness account of a Scottish water monster that pre-dates our understanding of dinosaurs would conform to Scottish regional expectation; hence, the newspaper reported the creature as a kelpie.

See our previous discussion on this subject here.
 
I thought water monsters were old decaying logs that built up gasses that allowed them to float to the top of the water surface for a short period of time, giving the illusion of a creature...
 
tjlance1 said:
I thought water monsters were old decaying logs that built up gasses that allowed them to float to the top of the water surface for a short period of time, giving the illusion of a creature...
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Most are but the Loch Ness monster is not only real, it is sufficiently public spirited that it puts in an appearance around the start of the holiday season to drum up some publicity for local businesses.

Unfortunately due to an unfortunate series of oversights, it appears that yet again everyone forgot to take their camera to record the appearance - better leave themselves a post it so they don't forget same time next year.
 
Nessie is very sensitive to the financial needs of the locals. Logical and mathematical from its snake-like head to its plesiosaurid tail, Nessie figures that the more visitors to the Loch each year, the greater the number of algae blooms in the water, the greater the concentration of microorganisms, and so on up the food chain -- until the numbers of salmon and char increase just enough to sustain her and her mewing brood of li'l Nessies.

Of course, I gleaned this from an interview I conducted with the Beastie herself. (Yes, she speaks English, albeit with a heavy regional accent. I had to watch a lot of Ewan McGregor movies to bone up on the dialect prior to the interview.) :D
 
Vortigern99 said:
Of course, I gleaned this from an interview I conducted with the Beastie herself. (Yes, she speaks English, albeit with a heavy regional accent. I had to watch a lot of Ewan McGregor movies to bone up on the dialect prior to the interview.) :D
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Be advised. "See you, pal?" is not a Scottish TV standard. The noo.
 
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