Lisa Williams New show same Stichk

[Orangem]

Sorry, you can't prove a negative. The claim here would be that an afterlife exists. Of course, because of this, I wouldn't say that the non-existence of an afterlife is a fact, I would just say it is very, very, likely.

I completely agree but...

Dead is dead, there's no afterlife.

...seems to me like it's stated as a truth, a done deal, a fact.
That's simply what I was reacting to. Likely as it may well be, that's all it is for now: likely.

 

[biomorph]

What I mean is skepticism should work both ways:

not really, these claims have been around for centuries, possibly longer, the scepticism is focused on these claims which have been the pretty much default accepted view in history.

I'm skeptical of this sort of thinking, and the claims put forward therein.

I don't have to be skeptical about the things i choose not to be doubtful over, do I?

back to the point
The claim of any sort of "afterlife" exists is what i here personally counter.

This isn't because i'm not skeptical that death is death and thats it, its just not the position the claimant is taking.
It is true here I make a counterclaim of no afterlife, which can be treated with some sort of doubt on behalf of the bleever, and i acknowledge that doubt.
I just don't have that particular doubt myself.

That doesn't render the claims the afterlife proponant makes incomplete, or answers the questions posed to them, it just puts the onus back on me, when they have not justified their own view.

Do you see what i'm getting at here?

Its not a game of two halves.

You could claim the moon is made of cheese yes? I'd be sceptical of that claim.

If i suggest its not, you'd have to find some evidence to back your own claim up, not attempt to shift the burden of proof away from your own dilemna, which is , you have no proof for your initial claim.
I'm just responding, not making a seperate claim.

mediums claim a certain type of afterlife, Buddists claim a certain type of afterlife, some claim reincarnation, some _________ (fill in the blank), and some claim there's absolutely nothing. NO ONE is able to proove ANY of these claims, hence, we have no clue.

Good point, but there's more evidence for no afterlife than there is for.

Let me give you another example;

We have a rock (living thing) and a pond (death).

If you claim first that the rock will refloat (survive death) to the surface after I chuck it in, and if am skeptical of your claim all we have to do is chuck the rock in the pond (the living thing dies yes?).

if the rock returns in some recogniseable fashion as to show it lives, then you are correct, if not you are incorrect.

No rocks have however, ever returned though in reality. they stay sunk. you and I know this of course and therefore dead is dead.

Many might claim that the rock has returned, however they produce no evidence.

after that rather long explanation do you see my point?

Find me the afterlife, and get the evidence, and I'll consider it.

No one has yet anywhere ever have they?. No rock surfaces, regardless of such claims.

I've had death run through my life experiences a few times , sometime really close to hand and at my hand, and it would be nice, but useless, to assume that life continues.

nothing has EVER returned from death tho. ever!.

If it has, where's the evidence other than the sanctimonius claptrap these deluded individuals spout?

Nowhere.

 

[biomorph]

<snip>

...seems to me like it's stated as a truth, a done deal, a fact.

It is a fact, and IMO a done deal.
You may disagree with me, and I respect that, however nothing comes back from the dead, and if it did, in what form?
there's no soul or spirit to survive, when your brain is dead its over sunshine...if there is, and CLEAR evidence of such I'd reconsider.

That's simply what I was reacting to. Likely as it may well be, that's all it is for now: likely.

i understand, my sureness of position draws you, show me another way........

 

[Orangem]

i understand, my sureness of position draws you, show me another way........

Hum... This is where I'm starting to think this is the wrong thread to be continuing this discussion on.

I'm really new to this. Is this too far away from the initial subject?

Don't want to be a straw man... although I'm not yet clear on what that means.

 

[biomorph]

Hum... This is where I'm starting to think this is the wrong thread to be continuing this discussion on.

Me too, maybe another day eh? I'm sorta outsa words anyhow at the mo.

I'm really new to this. Is this too far away from the initial subject?

Probably but who's lisa williams anyway lol

Don't want to be a straw man... although I'm not yet clear on what that means.

I think its all a bit of a derail, probably mostly my fault ,

(apologies to the mods and all that).

i just cant stand that wall o' text ram-it-down-your-throat garbage from the likes of KW.

They (and yes there's a few of 'em) rarely are here without some other agenda. just winds me up good and proper.....lol

For "straw man" and other logical fallacies hit this linky

logical fallacies

you have a nice day now .........

regards
BM

 

[Orangem]

Me too, maybe another day eh? I'm sorta outsa words anyhow at the mo.



Probably but who's lisa williams anyway lol

I think its all a bit of a derail, probably mostly my fault ,

(apologies to the mods and all that).

i just cant stand that wall o' text ram-it-down-your-throat garbage from the likes of KW.

They (and yes there's a few of 'em) rarely are here without some other agenda. just winds me up good and proper.....lol

For "straw man" and other logical fallacies hit this linky

logical fallacies

you have a nice day now .........

regards
BM

Hey! Thanks for the link! Very cool! I guess you're right, it's more of a derail than a straw man.

You have a nice day too...

I'm sure we'll have the chance to pick this up again... somehow.

Orangem

 

[Orangem]

Well... I'm going to see a Lisa Williams show on the 18th of March and writing an anthropology paper on my experience...

We'll see!

 

[Orangem]

Oh! My God! What a load of CRAP!!! Incredible what editing will do for this woman!

 

[Kuko 4000]

Today was the first that I've seen or heard of this woman. Her show just started airing here in Finland. What the...and she is so full of herself that it's almost surrealistic to see when people take her for real. Unbelievable.

 

[lucyfanclub]

The conduct of Lisa Williams and other frauds should be prosecuted as fraud. In Australia, the Trade Practices Act prohibits taking money for any action that is deceptive, and this activity is deceptive. The most disgusting behaviour I've seen is her donating the proceeds of her side-show farce to the bush fire relief appeal. Talk about proceed of crime. People like this whale make extraordinary claims so must provide extraordinary proof. She is at best deluded and at worst a shameless fake and charlatan. I think it's a bit of both actually. To anyone who defends her based on the supposed accuracy of her statements - the more accurate she appears, the more suspicious you should be. There are only two possibilities:

1. Information is derived from some paranormal or supernatural source
2. It is derived by some easily explained very earthly (and probably dishonest) means.

Ockham's razor. Think about. Really, think about it, just a bit.