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Let's talk about George

uke2se

Penultimate Amazing
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Messages
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George Soros is behind every evil in the world. That's the idea you get when reading some conservative posters. But why is he being portrayed as such a boogeyman?

As a normal Swede, I don't hear much about George Soros from domestic sources. Last time anyone discussed him in the mainstream over here were in the 90s, when there were lots of complaints against him shorting the Swedish currency, leading to a financial crisis. Of course that wasn't exactly the case; the currency fell because of disastrous policies when it came to privatizing public companies and corporate malfeasance, but Soros was one of several speculators, and he received a lot of the blame back then. Since then, it's been rather quite about him.

Unless you're a Nazi. For the Swedish extreme right, Soros has remained a target of hate, and with the rise of the populist extreme right over the last 20 years, he's become a target for them too. That seems to be the case all over Europe, including his native Hungary - where he's blamed for just about everything by the right wing populist government - and Russia. But what is it he does that's so damn evil to these right wingers?

As far as I've been able to read about him, he's a holocaust survivor, and what he saw during the German dominance of Hungary during World War II made him very distrustful of nationalism. He saw what he perceived as the ultimate form of nationalism in the Nazi purges of Jews and other "undesirables", and that affected him for the rest of his life. The money he made as a broker and speculator have been to a large part funneled into his various projects, especially his Open Society Foundations. These organisations, as well as those he funds but aren't under his direct auspice, all work towards liberal democracy, human and civil rights and the strengthening of democratic institutions. They have worked especially in Eastern Europe after the fall of Communism, in order to help bring the nations who suffered under Communism into a modern democratic Europe.

So what's objectionable about this to a conservative? I understand why extreme right wingers in Europe propagate against him, and why he's such a pariah in Russia, because those people don't want to see increased democracy or civil or human rights. But can an American conservative really say the same?

What has George Soros done that's so bad? Try to answer without resorting to conspiracy theories.
 
George Soros supports causes which are unpopular with US Conservatives*, this alone is reason enough to revile him.

That he's also rich and Jewish is just the cherry on top for a minority of US Conservatives.


* - things like liberal democracy, human and civil rights and the strengthening of democratic institutions which US Conservatives support, but only their version thereof.
 
George Soros is behind every evil in the world. That's the idea you get when reading some conservative posters. But why is he being portrayed as such a boogeyman?
Because any serious conservative candidate has to kiss Sheldon Adelson's ring, and a longtime GOP tactic is to preemptively blame the other party for doing whatever it is they're ashamed of doing themselves.
 
"The left is run by rich Jews" is not a new idea. Soros is only the latest manifestation of it.
 
"The left is run by rich Jews" is not a new idea. Soros is only the latest manifestation of it.

I get that a lot of it (if not all of it) is antisemitism, but I doubt you'll find any of our conservative posters saying so, which is why I would like to hear why they think Soros is a boogeyman. After all, I gather than hatred of the man is fairly spread among right wingers, and I know that at least a few of them aren't antisemites.
 
George Soros is behind every evil in the world. That's the idea you get when reading some conservative posters. But why is he being portrayed as such a boogeyman?

As a normal Swede, I don't hear much about George Soros from domestic sources. Last time anyone discussed him in the mainstream over here were in the 90s, when there were lots of complaints against him shorting the Swedish currency, leading to a financial crisis. Of course that wasn't exactly the case; the currency fell because of disastrous policies when it came to privatizing public companies and corporate malfeasance, but Soros was one of several speculators, and he received a lot of the blame back then. Since then, it's been rather quite about him.

Unless you're a Nazi. For the Swedish extreme right, Soros has remained a target of hate, and with the rise of the populist extreme right over the last 20 years, he's become a target for them too. That seems to be the case all over Europe, including his native Hungary - where he's blamed for just about everything by the right wing populist government - and Russia. But what is it he does that's so damn evil to these right wingers?

As far as I've been able to read about him, he's a holocaust survivor, and what he saw during the German dominance of Hungary during World War II made him very distrustful of nationalism. He saw what he perceived as the ultimate form of nationalism in the Nazi purges of Jews and other "undesirables", and that affected him for the rest of his life. The money he made as a broker and speculator have been to a large part funneled into his various projects, especially his Open Society Foundations. These organisations, as well as those he funds but aren't under his direct auspice, all work towards liberal democracy, human and civil rights and the strengthening of democratic institutions. They have worked especially in Eastern Europe after the fall of Communism, in order to help bring the nations who suffered under Communism into a modern democratic Europe.

So what's objectionable about this to a conservative? I understand why extreme right wingers in Europe propagate against him, and why he's such a pariah in Russia, because those people don't want to see increased democracy or civil or human rights. But can an American conservative really say the same?

What has George Soros done that's so bad? Try to answer without resorting to conspiracy theories.

Meh, probably just the opposite side of the coin to the koch brothers. (I.e. wealthy guy who funds unpopular* causes ). Not seeing a big mystery.


*to some
 
Because any serious conservative candidate has to kiss Sheldon Adelson's ring, and a longtime GOP tactic is to preemptively blame the other party for doing whatever it is they're ashamed of doing themselves.

Both sides are guilty.

bono usui temporis
 
Meh, probably just the opposite side of the coin to the koch brothers. (I.e. wealthy guy who funds unpopular* causes ). Not seeing a big mystery.


*to some

The criticism of the Koch brothers is that they fund causes such as pollution, deregulation of workers' rights, climate change denial etc. I just don't see that as in the same league as supporting civil rights and democratic institutions.
 
The criticism of the Koch brothers is that they fund causes such as pollution, deregulation of workers' rights, climate change denial etc. I just don't see that as in the same league as supporting civil rights and democratic institutions.

Yes, I get it: you are on Soros side, not the koch's. But take a step back, they both got to be unpopular for the same activities (but different causes).
 
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The criticism of the Koch brothers is that they fund causes such as pollution, deregulation of workers' rights, climate change denial etc. I just don't see that as in the same league as supporting civil rights and democratic institutions.

Another way of spinning it is that the Kochs are seeking to make US industry more cost competitive and are pushing back against the current mania for global warming (when 40 years ago we were frightened that the next ice age was just around the corner). A lot of people support that.

Those same people may not be as supportive of certain civil rights, especially if those civil rights are seen to dilute the power and influence that those people enjoy and indeed seek to curtail, or at least criticise some of their choices.

Before Giz brought it up, I was thinking "like the Kochs". From my perspective they are using their wealth to subvert democracy for their own malign reasons whereas Soros is investing his money to support some great causes. That's likely exactly the opposite of the way that a Koch supporter feels. That's not to say we are equally right but it goes to explain the antipathy towards Soros.
 
Yes, I get it: you are on Soros side, not the koch's. But take a step back, they both got to be unpopular for the same activities (but different causes).

But that's the point. I want to know why supporting civil rights and democratic institutions is considered a bad thing. Do I have to tell you why I consider supporting climate change denialism etc a bad thing?
 
Before Giz brought it up, I was thinking "like the Kochs". From my perspective they are using their wealth to subvert democracy for their own malign reasons whereas Soros is investing his money to support some great causes. That's likely exactly the opposite of the way that a Koch supporter feels. That's not to say we are equally right but it goes to explain the antipathy towards Soros.

I knew before I posted the thread that we would get false equivalencies about the Koch brothers. That's why I'm asking conservatives to pin-point what is objectionable about what George Soros stands for.

Basically, I want to hear a conservative say "supporting democratic institutions is bad because..."
 
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I knew before I posted the thread that we would get false equivalencies about the Koch brothers. That's why I'm asking conservatives to pin-point what is objectionable about what George Soros stands for.

Basically, I want to hear a conservative say "supporting democratic institutions is bad because..."

They've sensed your trap and won't respond.
 
Based on Wiki he sounds like a decent guy, liberal, gives a lot of money to causes.

Certainly doesn't come across as any sort of monster. (Although he probably only turns into a lizard person when no one is looking)

I'm sure he's pretty ruthless in business, but there doesn't seem to be any real dirt on him except for a slightly shaky insider trading deal.

So I guess it's down to Jewish/rich/supports liberal causes. Delete as appropriate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Soros
 
Here in the U.S. it is very common for right-wingers to accuse Soros of being a Nazi, or collaborating with them.

Snopes has a write up on the issue:

Was George Soros an SS Officer or Nazi Collaborator During World War II?

Sum of Snopes article: Don't be stupid, of course Soros was not a Nazi.

At any rate, I think they stopped accusing him of that once Nazis became cool again. The current right wing would probably see Nazi affiliation as a positive.
 
From a conservative stand point, the answer is simple. Soros has used his wealth to oppose conservative endorsed candidates like George Bush and to support conservative opponents like Hillary Clinton, and has used Super Pacs and propaganda mills like Media Matters to do it.

Bit baffled one even has to ask the question why the right does not like Soros
 

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