Lessons to be learned from the Kavanaugh Hearing

[River]

...you don't think that the fact that slavery and segregation led to a baseline poverty for black people in America has anything to do with race?

Did you quote that from me? Nope. I also agree with you, baseline poverty is an ongoing issue for many black people in America. My statement is 100% true.

 

[Cabbage]

Someones (anyones, regardless of ethnicity, or sex) available economic resources, and social resources are the determining factor. It has nothing to do with race.

Then why is it correlated with race? Answer my question.

 

[River]

Then why is it correlated with race? Answer my question.

If I knew the answer (or anyone else did) they would be changing that. Also, those same things (baseline poverty, and the issues associated with it) effect all races in that position. It is not race specific. It is however economically and socially specific. We can find examples of any ethnicity or both sexes that fit into both extremes.

We do have laws that protect against discrimination, and in some cases affirmative action that gives more availability of opportunity to some special interest groups or ethnic groups.

 

[Belz...]

Did you quote that from me? Nope. I also agree with you, baseline poverty is an ongoing issue for many black people in America. My statement is 100% true.

No, it isn't. Their poverty is directly caused by the racist history of America. How is that not related to race?

 

[Dr. Keith]

Was Kavenaugh racist, too?

Man, this thread has wandered . . .

 

[Cabbage]

If I knew the answer (or anyone else did) they would be changing that.

So you at least acknowledge that racism (and therefore race) may play a part? Why then are you playing so coy about it?

Also, those same things (baseline poverty, and the issues associated with it) effect all races in that position.

What part of "correlation" are you not understanding? I never claimed no whites are born in poverty, I continue to claim that blacks are born at a disproportionately higher rate into poverty.

And you continue to make excuses and attempt to hand wave that fact away.

Fascinating.

We do have laws that protect against discrimination, and in some cases affirmative action that gives more availability of opportunity to some special interest groups or ethnic groups.

And we have laws against murder, too. Guess what: Murder still happens.

And so does discrimination based on race. Do you disagree?

 

[River]

So you at least acknowledge that racism (and therefore race) may play a part? Why then are you playing so coy about it?



What part of "correlation" are you not understanding? I never claimed no whites are born in poverty, I continue to claim that blacks are born at a disproportionately higher rate into poverty.

And you continue to make excuses and attempt to hand wave that fact away.

Fascinating.



And we have laws against murder, too. Guess what: Murder still happens.

And so does discrimination based on race. Do you disagree?

No coyness. I agreed with you. We had a war in this country because Americans felt so strongly on the issue. It was our bloodiest war, and one of the most important ones. We cannot change the past, but we can change the future. "The best way to predict your future is to create it" ~ Abraham Lincoln

There is much to be learned from the past.

Do you feel there is something that should be done today, to address those perceived inequalities? What would those things be and how would you go about implementing them? Lets talk about solutions.

 

[Silly Green Monkey]

No coyness. I agreed with you. We had a war in this country because Americans felt so strongly on the issue. It was our bloodiest war, and one of the most important ones. We cannot change the past, but we can change the future. "The best way to predict your future is to create it" ~ Abraham Lincoln

There is much to be learned from the past.

Do you feel there is something that should be done today, to address those perceived inequalities? What would those things be and how would you go about implementing them? Lets talk about solutions.

Affirmative Action is a good place to start, but that's so unfair and unmeritous to install a systematic assist into a system designed to keep poor people poor.

 

[River]

Facebook is not evaluating posts that you compose and share for their political views. Facebook is evaluating your interaction with already distributed political adverts (again, because this is specifically targeted to advertisers). Facebook appears to have determined that you are most likely to interact with a moderate political advertisement. It's possible that you could have shared that sort of post on your own page, or commented positively on that advertisement, or even clicked a positive emoticon. Based on your posts here, I don't think that's very likely, though.

You're mistaken on several points. This article and list may help.

Targeting options for Facebook advertisers*
1. Location
2. Age
3. Generation
4. Gender
5. Language
6. Education level
7. Field of study
8. School
9. Ethnic affinity
10. Income and net worth
11. Home ownership and type
12. Home value
13. Property size
14. Square footage of home
15. Year home was built
16. Household composition
17. Users who have an anniversary within 30 days
18. Users who are away from family or hometown
19. Users who are friends with someone who has an anniversary, is newly married or engaged, recently moved, or has an upcoming birthday
20. Users in long-distance relationships
21. Users in new relationships
22. Users who have new jobs
23. Users who are newly engaged
24. Users who are newly married
25. Users who have recently moved
26. Users who have birthdays soon
27. Parents
28. Expectant parents
29. Mothers, divided by “type” (soccer, trendy, etc.)
30. Users who are likely to engage in politics
31. Conservatives and liberals
32. Relationship status
33. Employer
34. Industry
35. Job title
36. Office type
37. Interests
38. Users who own motorcycles
39. Users who plan to buy a car (and what kind/brand of car, and how soon)
40. Users who bought auto parts or accessories recently
41. Users who are likely to need auto parts or services
42. Style and brand of car you drive
43. Year car was bought
44. Age of car
45. How much money user is likely to spend on next car
46. Where user is likely to buy next car
47. How many employees your company has
48. Users who own small businesses
49. Users who work in management or are executives
50. Users who have donated to charity (divided by type)
51. Operating system
52. Users who play canvas games
53. Users who own a gaming console
54. Users who have created a Facebook event
55. Users who have used Facebook Payments
56. Users who have spent more than average on Facebook Payments
57. Users who administer a Facebook page
58. Users who have recently uploaded photos to Facebook
59. Internet browser
60. Email service
61. Early/late adopters of technology
62. Expats (divided by what country they are from originally)
63. Users who belong to a credit union, national bank or regional bank
64. Users who investor (divided by investment type)
65. Number of credit lines
66. Users who are active credit card users
67. Credit card type
68. Users who have a debit card
69. Users who carry a balance on their credit card
70. Users who listen to the radio
71. Preference in TV shows
72. Users who use a mobile device (divided by what brand they use)
73. Internet connection type
74. Users who recently acquired a smartphone or tablet
75. Users who access the Internet through a smartphone or tablet
76. Users who use coupons
77. Types of clothing user’s household buys
78. Time of year user’s household shops most
79. Users who are “heavy” buyers of beer, wine or spirits
80. Users who buy groceries (and what kinds)
81. Users who buy beauty products
82. Users who buy allergy medications, cough/cold medications, pain relief products, and over-the-counter meds
83. Users who spend money on household products
84. Users who spend money on products for kids or pets, and what kinds of pets
85. Users whose household makes more purchases than is average
86. Users who tend to shop online (or off)
87. Types of restaurants user eats at
88. Kinds of stores user shops at
89. Users who are “receptive” to offers from companies offering online auto insurance, higher education or mortgages, and prepaid debit cards/satellite TV
90. Length of time user has lived in house
91. Users who are likely to move soon
92. Users who are interested in the Olympics, fall football, cricket or Ramadan
93. Users who travel frequently, for work or pleasure
94. Users who commute to work
95. Types of vacations user tends to go on
96. Users who recently returned from a trip
97. Users who recently used a travel app
98. Users who participate in a timeshare

 

[Segnosaur]

Re: Racism cures...

Do you feel there is something that should be done today, to address those perceived inequalities? What would those things be and how would you go about implementing them? Lets talk about solutions.

How about getting rid of gerrymandering and voter ID laws designed to minimize the input of minority (black) voters, with the goal of giving them an equal footing in U.S. politics? Oh, but wait! The republicans don't want to do that because it would mean they would no longer have an unfair advantage at the polls.

Well, how about taking steps that would minimize instances where police treat minorities differently (typically poorly) compared to white people? Oh, but wait, Trump (who is, as you know, a republican) actually wants to bring in things like stop-and-frisk, which are typically used to target minorities. (Not to mention the continued "War on Drugs" that the republicans are pushing, which means a disproportionate number of minorities in jail.)

How about providing improved educational opportunities (including better funding for elementary and high schools, as well as more chances for post-secondary education) for poor people/minorities so that future generations will have roughly equal skill sets when they enter the work force, regardless of race? Oh wait, the Republican head of the Department of Education is pushing for vouchers (which some evidence has shown don't work), and the idea of "free tuition" at schools would be seen as "socialism" and thus must be shunned.

What do all these have in common? They are relatively straight forward things that might have an impact in addressing racism in the country, but the Republicans are standing in the way. Want to fix the problem? Vote the republicans out of office.

 

[wareyin]

You're mistaken on several points. This article and list may help.

That article does not in any way dispute what I claimed. Nor does it in any way support your claim that because it tells advertisers you will respond to moderate political posts Facebook has judged you as a moderate.

In fact, after you began posting this particular claim I checked my advertising page. Politically conservative. I do not share conservative posts, I do not frequent conservative news sources, whether in or outside of Facebook. The only way in which I interact with conservative posts is by disputing them. But, I am not trying to pretend to be more conservative than I am, so I do not need to use such a non-applicable metric.

 

[River]

That article does not in any way dispute what I claimed. Nor does it in any way support your claim that because it tells advertisers you will respond to moderate political posts Facebook has judged you as a moderate.

In fact, after you began posting this particular claim I checked my advertising page. Politically conservative. I do not share conservative posts, I do not frequent conservative news sources, whether in or outside of Facebook. The only way in which I interact with conservative posts is by disputing them. But, I am not trying to pretend to be more conservative than I am, so I do not need to use such a non-applicable metric.

Two things are important here. The link did actually have information that supports the claims saying for example:

While you’re logged onto Facebook, for instance, the network can see virtually every other website you visit. Even when you’re logged off

The list is self explanatory. (status changes or updates with relationship etc, purchases etc) I never made the claim of being moderate. I said social media lists me as one from my interactions. In fact, I've been quite up front about my personal views in those ways. (mostly conservative, some libertarian and even some center left) We're drifting pretty far off topic here.

 

[River]

Affirmative Action is a good place to start, but that's so unfair and unmeritous to install a systematic assist into a system designed to keep poor people poor.

What are your views on the current system and how would you change it?

How about getting rid of gerrymandering and voter ID laws designed to minimize the input of minority (black) voters, with the goal of giving them an equal footing in U.S. politics? Oh, but wait! The republicans don't want to do that because it would mean they would no longer have an unfair advantage at the polls.

Well, how about taking steps that would minimize instances where police treat minorities differently (typically poorly) compared to white people? Oh, but wait, Trump (who is, as you know, a republican) actually wants to bring in things like stop-and-frisk, which are typically used to target minorities. (Not to mention the continued "War on Drugs" that the republicans are pushing, which means a disproportionate number of minorities in jail.)

How about providing improved educational opportunities (including better funding for elementary and high schools, as well as more chances for post-secondary education) for poor people/minorities so that future generations will have roughly equal skill sets when they enter the work force, regardless of race? Oh wait, the Republican head of the Department of Education is pushing for vouchers (which some evidence has shown don't work), and the idea of "free tuition" at schools would be seen as "socialism" and thus must be shunned.

What do all these have in common? They are relatively straight forward things that might have an impact in addressing racism in the country, but the Republicans are standing in the way. Want to fix the problem? Vote the republicans out of office.

Gerrymandering is a problem for both parties. I think there should be stricter regulations on where the districts are located, and requirements about living in them in order to represent it. Public school does not send away people for race or ethnicity reasons, neither do voting facilities.

How does voter ID laws impact black voters any differently than other ethnic groups?

I'm not sure how these suggestions might make things different. However, I do appreciate you sharing your views on a topic a lot of people won't touch.

 

[TomB]

How does voter ID laws impact black voters any differently than other ethnic groups?

Voter ID laws affect voters differently not because of race directly, but because of economic status. When there is a monetary charge for an ID, it can be a hardship for those in poverty to obtain an ID that they would not otherwise need (no car, no need for driver's license). Not only is the cost an issue, but also transportation to the correct facility to obtain the license.

Because, as mentioned earlier in this thread, there is a correlation between ethnicity and poverty (regardless of causation), if one wishes to decrease the number of black voters he can try to make it harder for poor people to vote.

I'm sympathetic to both sides of this issue and wish the sides would actually talk about it instead of point fingers. I think some who advocate for voter ID do so in good faith out of legitimate concerns. So requiring voter ID should be paired with an effort to make ID easier and more affordable to obtain by those living in poverty. But I don't really have a solution to that.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Was Kavenaugh racist, too?

He is a Republican, so "was" is not the correct tense.

 

[phiwum]

"The best way to predict your future is to create it" ~ Abraham Lincoln

Does that really sound like Abraham Lincoln to you?

The author of the Gettysburg Address moonlighted as an inspirational poster writer?

 

[The Norseman]

Does that really sound like Abraham Lincoln to you?

The author of the Gettysburg Address moonlighted as an inspirational poster writer?

BWWAAHAHAHA!

Didn't Lincoln also coin that well-known phrase, "Don't believe everything you read on the internet"? Or was that Gandhi...?

 

[Thermal]

BWWAAHAHAHA!

Didn't Lincoln also coin that well-known phrase, "Don't believe everything you read on the internet"? Or was that Gandhi...?

Gahndi did 'Hang in there Baby...Nirvana's Coming'

 

[River]

Voter ID laws affect voters differently not because of race directly, but because of economic status. When there is a monetary charge for an ID, it can be a hardship for those in poverty to obtain an ID that they would not otherwise need (no car, no need for driver's license). Not only is the cost an issue, but also transportation to the correct facility to obtain the license.

Because, as mentioned earlier in this thread, there is a correlation between ethnicity and poverty (regardless of causation), if one wishes to decrease the number of black voters he can try to make it harder for poor people to vote.

I'm sympathetic to both sides of this issue and wish the sides would actually talk about it instead of point fingers. I think some who advocate for voter ID do so in good faith out of legitimate concerns. So requiring voter ID should be paired with an effort to make ID easier and more affordable to obtain by those living in poverty. But I don't really have a solution to that.

The whole concept is to verify your voters live in the area they are voting in. Also this video made me lol because.. I've found the same to be true in my experience. I've yet to meet anyone that was not homeless that did not have some type of ID. (regardless of race) But hey, thats just my experience. I seem to not be alone on this one.

https://twitter.com/madriannorman/status/1051490214407954432

There needs to be reform on those fronts. Those that do not have ID (imho) should be able to get a state or federal type of ID that is free. (for instance people on welfare or disability) Those that are able to pay for ID should. None of this effects someone specifically by race.

 

[River]

Does that really sound like Abraham Lincoln to you?

The author of the Gettysburg Address moonlighted as an inspirational poster writer?

I've seen it also attributed to two other authors. I've not seen any publications of it or transcribed speeches that date to Lincoln. Kind of irrelevant to the point however.