Krugman: Obama Clueless. We're Doomed.

[skeptical]

Well, Krugman has a loyal following among liberals, but in the end, he's still just a pundit. My dad said something I thought was interesting.

"If Obama is losing people like

, he's in serious trouble". I think this is true. Not that I'll vote against Obama in 2012, but I doubt I'll be anywhere near as fired up as I was in 2008. Perhaps the economy will stage a sudden turn around and it will be "morning again" by then. I doubt it though.

I have to make a couple of points here. First, the bailout was a necessary evil, and although I think Obama should have gotten more concessions for floating the money, in the end it diverted the global financial system from the cliff it was about to go over.

The truth is, due to the extensive private contracts insuring bad debts between all the biggest banks in the world, if AIG had fallen it would have taken nearly every large bank in the world down with it. It is no exaggeration to say it would have been another great depression, except perhaps even worse for the US since so much of our economy is services based now. It was distasteful, but the alternative was unthinkable.

Second, these guys took their bonuses in stock, not cash, which at least is performance based. And yes, its a crapload of money but that's what capitalism produces, a few people that make a crapload of money.

Third, both of these institutions paid back the money they got.

So, I'm not sure what Krugman's beef is other than that he wants Obama to be less business friendly and rail against greedy capitalists.

The thing about all of this is, those toward the left are disappointed with Obama because he's not more liberal (he's mostly a centrist) while those on the right claim he's the next Karl Marx. The right-wing echo chamber keeps ranting how he's a socialist/communist and the left-wing wonders who the hell they're talking about.

 

[Travis]

The thing about all of this is, those toward the left are disappointed with Obama because he's not more liberal (he's mostly a centrist) while those on the right claim he's the next Karl Marx. The right-wing echo chamber keeps ranting how he's a socialist/communist and the left-wing wonders who the hell they're talking about.

This is why I'm finding the Obama presidency so fascinating. It's like the two sides live on different planets because they certainly can't both be correct in their criticisms.

 

[Peephole]

Krugman is spot on, but he should never have supported Obama so much in the first place.

Read the thread, he never did.

 

[skeptical]

This is why I'm finding the Obama presidency so fascinating. It's like the two sides live on different planets because they certainly can't both be correct in their criticisms.

The thing about it is this. The left seems to at least understand what is actually happening, because they see that Obama is not making far left decisions and in fact is much more moderate/centrist than is to their liking.

On the other hand, the right seems completely divorced from reality. They make ridiculous claims that are obviously wrong about how liberal/socialistic/communistic Obama is, no matter how little this reflects what is actually happening. Its some of the worst cognitive dissonance I have ever seen.

So one side is pissed because they see the reality, and the other side is pissed because they don't. (and in fact seem completely uninterested in reality in the first place)

 

[Travis]

The thing about it is this. The left seems to at least understand what is actually happening, because they see that Obama is not making far left decisions and in fact is much more moderate/centrist than is to their liking.

On the other hand, the right seems completely divorced from reality. They make ridiculous claims that are obviously wrong about how liberal/socialistic/communistic Obama is, no matter how little this reflects what is actually happening. Its some of the worst cognitive dissonance I have ever seen.

So one side is pissed because they see the reality, and the other side is pissed because they don't. (and in fact seem completely uninterested in reality in the first place)

I tend to agree. I think the far right got worked up over a "mythical Uber Communist Obama" back during the campaign and have never come back down to Earth since.

 

[MaGZ]

I'm very emo on this. **** these bankers and their bonuses. I'm the head of a small teachers union, and we lost 20% of our teachers last year! These were good people, some of whom had been with us for five years. Class size went from 20 kids in a class (kindergarden through third) to 30 kids per class. My superintendent is retiring this year and admitted to me the stress of the layoffs just about killed him. Where was my district's bailout? Peoples' lives were devastated over this. And Goldman Sachs is doing God's work? We should have let the whole lot of them fail, and I hope the found money those rat bastard executives are getting brings a lot of trouble.

My wife just got her teaching credential. It might as well be a placemat. All she can do is sub and take the occasional job that comes around. I get a little emotional on this.

You should have lost a 100% of your "teachers" union. You should all be fired and purged from the educational system forever.

 

[geni]

Who you should really be mad at is whoever was overseeing the stewardship of AIG in our government. Their idea of breaking off units of AIG to sell during a economic crisis, to repay their TARP allocation, was comically tragic. There appeared to have been zero long term planning and only an immediate desire to get the funds back, which probably created a negative feedback loop.

This means the funds AIG had to pay out for swaps it issued to places like Goldman Sachs, may not be able to be reclaimed from AIG at all.

What was the alturnative though? Hang onto AIG untill you could get your money back? Having one of the world's largest insures owned long term by the US goverment is a great way to make a complete mess of the market.

 

[corplinx]

What was the alturnative though? Hang onto AIG untill you could get your money back? Having one of the world's largest insures owned long term by the US goverment is a great way to make a complete mess of the market.

Preferred shares.

Doing a firesale of AIG units during "the great recession" was just tactically bad.