Just who in the hell is Satan anyway?

[mactonite]

I was always taught that Satan(or the devil) was this evil mastermind roaming the earth, sticking anybody that gets in his path with his pitchfork. He is usually portrayed as the opposite of G-d, the ultimate adversary. However, in my studies of Judaism, Satan is generally looked at as a servant of G-d. For instance:

In Job chapter 1, we see Satan as a servant answering to G-d: And the LORD said to Satan, “From where do you come?”
So Satan answered the LORD and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking back and forth on it.”

And then using Satan to test Job: Then the LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered My servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, one who fears G-d and shuns evil?”

We also see G-d confirming that evil is allowed in Deuteronomy 30 verse 15:
“See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil".

Even Jesus referred to Peter as Satan in Mark 8:33 with the famous phrase "get behind me, Satan". Was this idea of Satan perhaps changed to a more evil entity when the Jews mingled with other popular religions of those times? Please keep in mind that this is strictly from a secular observation of the bible.

 

[Cainkane1]

I was always taught that Satan(or the devil) was this evil mastermind roaming the earth, sticking anybody that gets in his path with his pitchfork. He is usually portrayed as the opposite of G-d, the ultimate adversary. However, in my studies of Judaism, Satan is generally looked at as a servant of G-d. For instance:

In Job chapter 1, we see Satan as a servant answering to G-d: And the LORD said to Satan, “From where do you come?”
So Satan answered the LORD and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking back and forth on it.”

And then using Satan to test Job: Then the LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered My servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, one who fears G-d and shuns evil?”

We also see G-d confirming that evil is allowed in Deuteronomy 30 verse 15:
“See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil".

Even Jesus referred to Peter as Satan in Mark 8:33 with the famous phrase "get behind me, Satan". Was this idea of Satan perhaps changed to a more evil entity when the Jews mingled with other popular religions of those times? Please keep in mind that this is strictly from a secular observation of the bible.

In this story no only is evil allowed its G-d doing the evil.

 

[TimCallahan]

In the Hebrew scriptures the being we call Satan is referred to as ha satan, Hebrew for "the adversary" or "the accuser." It's important to remember that this being is almost always referred to in this fashion, with satan preceded by the Hebrew definite article ha ("the").

"Satan" didn't become a name until it was used in the Christian scriptures, which were written in Greek. He also was not the focus of evil until they were written (ca. CE 70 - 90). For example, the Book of Enoch, a popular apocalyptic work written ca. 160 BCE, the pre-flood patriarch Enoch tells of an angelic revolt. The "watcher" angels, so called because they were to watch over the human race, instead have sex with human women, begetting the Nephilim, teach men how to make weapons and wage war, as well as teaching them magic, and, of course raise a revolt against God. Their leader is called Semihazi in some parts of Enoch and Azazel in others. The Book of Enoch seems to have been a composite work. The important thing here is that the leader of the angelic revolt in this fairly late work is not called "Satan."

I don't know where Satan, as opposed to ha satan, fits in modern Judaism.

 

[Dunstan]

In the Hebrew scriptures the being we call Satan is referred to as ha satan, Hebrew for "the adversary" or "the accuser." It's important to remember that this being is almost always referred to in this fashion, with satan preceded by the Hebrew definite article ha ("the").

"Satan" didn't become a name until it was used in the Christian scriptures, which were written in Greek. He also was not the focus of evil until they were written (ca. CE 70 - 90). For example, the Book of Enoch, a popular apocalyptic work written ca. 160 BCE, the pre-flood patriarch Enoch tells of an angelic revolt. The "watcher" angels, so called because they were to watch over the human race, instead have sex with human women, begetting the Nephilim, teach men how to make weapons and wage war, as well as teaching them magic, and, of course raise a revolt against God. Their leader is called Semihazi in some parts of Enoch and Azazel in others. The Book of Enoch seems to have been a composite work. The important thing here is that the leader of the angelic revolt in this fairly late work is not called "Satan."

I don't know where Satan, as opposed to ha satan, fits in modern Judaism.

Interesting. When does the name "Lucifer" come into the picture?

 

[mactonite]

Hmmm... I will have to check out Enoch.

Not to get too far off of the subject but I wonder why Revelations was canonized. It seems that the whole book is out the window if Satan is not the same as the Jewish bible. My first question is who wrote the prologue? It seems like someone added it, perhaps a scribe?

 

[kedo1981]

Simple IT'S ALL MADE UP B.S.

 

[Weak Kitten]

Simple IT'S ALL MADE UP B.S.

Yeah. But sometimes it's fun to track where the B.S. comes from. I really enjoy a good historical analysis of mythology.

I remember hearing somewhere, can't recall the source, that most of the depictions of the Lord and his angels in Jewish mythology are based on the Babylonian court. It's not uncommon for depictions of deities to reflect the ruling class in the culture they originate from or other powerful cultures in the area.

Does anyone know much about Babylonian court structure? Was there an "adversary" position?

 

[Bikewer]

As I recall, the story of Lucifer and the "war in heaven" which resulted in him being cast out was not added to scripture till much later.
The Lucifer figure was sort of melded with the earlier descriptions of "the accuser" and also with Pagan god-figures like Pan to make up the Medieval "Devil" or "Satan".
A sort of evolutionary process....

 

[TragicMonkey]

Satan is God's ex.

 

[Dunstan]

Satan is God's ex.

And she's rather sexy.

 

[mactonite]

And she's rather sexy.

Nice. I didn't even know Mr. Deity existed. I will definitely need to explore this further.

 

[mactonite]

Yeah. But sometimes it's fun to track where the B.S. comes from. I really enjoy a good historical analysis of mythology.

I agree it is enjoyable. Also, since it is so ingrained into our society, it's fun to know what all of these people believe.

 

[Ron_Tomkins]

Just who in the hell is Satan anyway?

Someone I assist

 

[autumn1971]

Interesting. When does the name "Lucifer" come into the picture?

I've got a Revised Standard Version that doesn't even use the name "Lucifer", only referring to "The Day Star", which I believe is the literal translation. It is referring explicitly to a king of Babylon, and describing his defeat. The passage is in Isaiah chapter 14, and is very clear about this being a human leader.
Satan is only associated with the "ancient serpent, the devil" in Revelation 20, even though most Christians assume that Satan is the incarnation of evil throughout the Bible. Other verses reference the "devil", but Satan is not associated with anyone but God, as far as I can tell, for nearly the whole Bible. He is, as was mentioned above, considered "the adversary," one whose job is to challenge Gods subjects, but always with God's permission.

Oh, and as to the OP's title, Hell isn't mentioned until the New Testament, the ancient Hebrews used a general abode of all the dead called Sheol.

 

[The Fallen Serpent]

Interesting. When does the name "Lucifer" come into the picture?

Lucifer is Latin for "Light Bringer" another variation on Morning Star or Day Star. Morning Star (Venus, which is also the Evening Star) is used as a title to reference one who ascends to glory quickly and usually falls from glory even quicker. If I recall correctly it is used in a few different ways as well. In the old testament variations of this are used in reference to the King of Babylon. The Fall of Satan in the Christian sense is taken from this. A few instances in the bible use lucifer in the Latin translations that are not references to a person. In Revelations the Morning Star is referenced in poetic ways, and this is translated the same in the Latin. Fortunate for Christians who believe in a Lucifer character since one reference is Jesus refering to himself and that would be really confusing.

The story of Satan in Christian mythology is a patchwork of stories that have been bound into being about a single entity. This happened partially through contextual misunderstandings.

 

[bozman]

However, in my studies of Judaism, Satan is generally looked at as a servant of G-d. For instance:

Wait, you mean Gad? Or Gud? Or maybe Gyd?

 

[FreshHat]

Someone I assist

...assuming you play on the same line:

 

[mactonite]

Wait, you mean Gad? Or Gud? Or maybe Gyd?

Ha, I knew this would come up and I should have addressed it in the beginning(no pun intended). I have been studying Judaism too much. They try to avoid writing the name of God and usually substitute a dash for the o.

 

[Bill Thompson]

he is Elohem's son and Jesus' brother, actually. Consult your LDS scripture. There is a youtube video showing what mormonism is really about somewhere.

 

[bozman]

Consult your LDS scripture.

You mean the Book of Mormon? The same book which says Mesoamerican people possessed steel and iron technology before Europeans arrived? And that they had animals which didn't exist on the continent at the time, like goats, horses and elephants? And that Native Americans are actually the descends from people who came to the Americas by boat from the Middle East?

Could just be me, but I'm starting to think that the Book of Mormon may have some serious credibility issues...