Wow
Thanks guys, lots of helpful comments. I'm engaged in an ongoing sort of cold war with this person (who's very evangelical and deeply disapproving of "my type"). Personally, I'd be happy enough to just leave the whole subject alone (since we have to sit beside each other every day and sooner or later we're going to have a row) but she will keep saying these things . . .
Anyhoo:
Cleopatra
( REMINDER: Ortodox in Greek is the one who hold the unique truth!!! So, pay double attention to what I am going to say for I am the one who knows the truth )
to you too.
Answer me these though, if you don't mind - is the Greek Orthodox church descended from the Byzantine tradition or is it just a coincidence of names? What is the connection/relationship (or is there any) between Greek Orthodox and Russian Orthodox?
Greek Orthodox thinking is descended from Paul's too - correct?
Beleth
I wasn't referring to the Ten Commandments specifically, in fact I was more interested in the various, wacky little instructions scattered around the rest of the OT.
And then He died so that people that believed in His message could stop sacrificing all those animals.
He should be like the patron saint of PETA then! Seriously though, did Jesus's reputed self-sacrifice supposedly wipe out all sin
before and after that date or just
before?
Seems to me it's the latter (since, presumably, no Christian would argue that we're free to sin as much as we like now since it's all, in a sense, pre-paid for) but if that's the case sure;y we should have started animal sacrificing and doing all the other stuff again as soon after the crucifixion as someone sinned?
quote:
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Originally said by Jesus
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children,and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
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- Can you give chapter and verse for this quote for future reference please?
Walter Wayne
Many of the statements of Jesus in the NT refer back to the OT.
As for sacrifices, at least 1, and I believe all 4, of the gospels state something along the lines he was the one full, perfect and sufficient sacrifice which appears to suggests sacrifice is no longer required.
See my comment to Beleth above - does this mean that any sin since the crucifixion is already sacrificed for and thus that we need not worry about any future cost?
I've never really understood the concept of "Jesus died for our sins" - unless the above is correct, it seems to me that the more time that passes since his death, the less meaningful that sacrifice is, no?
thaiboxerken
I find it strange that the christians want to post the 10 commandments in schools because it's "god's word" and yet they don't want to place "god's" proscribed punishments along with it. Hmmmm.
I think Beleth's comments cover this from the Christian perspective - i.e. outdated but still worthwhile and Yahzi covered the other angle with -
most Xians just make the Bible say whatever they want it to.
It does make a farce of the regular Christian claim that their detractors "take things out of context" though, IMO.
neutrino_cannon
Instructions for removing mildew - that amazes me too, I wan't aware that the Bible said anything half that sensible
Did Jesus's sacrifice remove the need to combat mildew, do you think? I'll think twice before accepting a dinner invitation from a Christian then
corplinx
Sadly, the pinheads who put the Bible together left out the "Gospel of Thomas" which might have A. more authoritatively distanced Xian doctrine from the laws of moses and B. made Xianity more tolerable in general
I'm not familiar with Thomas. I think I'll have to google for it. Offhand though, do you know
why they left it out?
Yes, a good example of ignorance. To join one branch of the Masons (the Knights Templar).you have to affirm a belief in Jesus. Most of your jewish masons join the Scottish Rite
I was under the impression that to be a mason you just had to acknowledge a belief in a higher power of any sort - or is that the US government? (
).
The person I'm discussing this with is engaged to a chap whose father, brother and uncle are apparently big Masons (in the important sense, not the fat sense!). Her fiance, however, is a fundy baptist evangelical like her and has apparently been studying the Masons not-entirely-approvingly for some time as part of a course he's taking in college. She has promised to show me his final essay on the subject, which I'll be interested to read.
Most of my knowledge of Masons is derived from "The Hiram Key" and the other book that went with it.I found their conlcusions a bit of a stretch but the writers
were Masons so presumably they got the basics right.
Yahzi
This seems pretty straight forward to me. But Paul said it was ok to eat pork cracklins and hang out with goyim. I guess Paul was more important than JC.
This seems to me to reflect the most basic paradox at the basis of Christianity - it's a Jewish religion, based on Jewish tradition, for Jewish people. If the apocalypse ever actually comes, the twelve tribes of Israel will be saved and everyone else will persih (or suffer eternal hellfire or whatever).
If you want to follow the teachings of Christ - go ahead, knock yourself out, but don't fool yourself into thinking that makes you one of the chosen people
Cleopatra says Paul had a great mind, and so he probably did but doesn't it bother the Christians of the world that it's his message they're following and not Christs? Do they think that Paul will save them from the wrath of God and the Second Coming?
<sigh>
Graham
