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Jared Diamond: World's Worst Mistake?

Now that's a damn good and insightful point, if I ever saw one.

Though as a minor nitpick, the first weapon that seems to have triggered warfare was the bow and arrow. They were actually weapons that were actually used for hunting and only incidentally could also be used against another human too. I don't think whoever first built one was really thinking "now we can kill some of those pesky people from the nearby tribe." Though as you've only said "mistake", I can see how in the long term it could be argued to qualify as such.



As a point of personal interest, I would love to see your source for this.
I have an interest in swords and sword development.

I know swords (or their ancestors) arrived on the scene fairly early, in the form of pointed sticks. There are also examples of swords which are little more than bits of sharp stone embedded in a wooden shaft.
Reference: Richard Burton's First Book of the Sword, 1883; Figure 31, pp 26-27. pdf available at the link (it works in Canada, at any rate)

But I have not looked into the earliest history of weapons in general, and thus do not know what came first. Slings, clubs, pointy sticks, bows and arrows, etc.

I re-iterate that would be greatly interested to see your source.
 
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From the article:
One Bushman, when asked why he hadn't emulated neighboring tribes by adopting agriculture, replied, "Why should we, when there are so many mongongo nuts in the world?
Well that convinced me and I never even had a mongongo nut.
 
Another point worth considering is what would be the purpose of home sapiens remaining hunter/gatherers? Shouldn’t we take advantage of our highly developed brains? We have, as a species, done some incredible things. We may eventually reach an evolutionary dead end, but I think it would be worth it to be able to look back and say, “this is what homo sapiens were able to accomplish.”
 
From the article:

Well that convinced me and I never even had a mongongo nut.

Except there are some funny things about the Khoisan (Bushmen) when you actually look at it.

The most important here being that actually recently they've become increasingly sedentary and based on agriculture and herding. In fact there have always been a large number of them doing that.

The funnier point is that at least the Khoi group -- though as they're racially and linguistically indistinguishable, it could mean the whole race actually -- only actually reverted very recently to hunter-gatherers. And even then, again, only some of them. Their ancestors seem to have been agricultors actually.

I know what it looks like. "Ah-ha! So being a hunter-gatherer is better after all. These people just abandoned agriculture and went back to hunting, right?"

But not because they had any choice. The climate change that turned Kalahari into a desert basically made any kind of agriculture impossible. These guys couldn't do that any more, _and_ had nowhere to go either, as the Bantu expansion was just beginning to actually displace them from any place that wasn't too uninhabitable for the Bantu to bother with.

There was no "so, do we stay agricultors or do we go hunter-gatherer?" choice there. They simply had no other choice at all. Any land suitable for growing crops on, either turned into a dry dustbowl or was taken from them by the Bantu, and later the European colonists.

The even more perverse implication there, though, is that basically you can't really find some hunter-gatherer wisdom going back all the way to caveman days there. There is no continuous culture there going all the way back. It's a newly reinvented hunter-gatherer culture, that is no more representative or proof of the paleolithic way of living than a hippie commune is.
 
As a point of personal interest, I would love to see your source for this.

The earliest dated cave paintings of human against human violence depict rows of archers firing at each other, apparently led by some shaman or such. They're also around the point where bows and arrows appeared.

A text mentioning such depictions, dated 30,000 to 20,000 years ago, including some of people apparently dying from arrow wounds is for example here: http://history.eserver.org/neolithic-war.txt

The earliest mass grave dated is Cemetery 117, and almost half the skeletons seem to have been buried with arrow points in them. Four skeletons even have the tips embedded in bones.

I have an interest in swords and sword development.

Well, swords are cool, so I can't fault you there.

But swords are the Johnny Come Late of the warfare scene, sadly. Even the first daggers only appeared in the Neolithic, anyhwere between 12,000 and 8,000 years ago.

As practical implements of war, something that could properly be called a sword didn't even exist until the Bronze Age, in the form of those early bronze rapiers. (Named so because of the way the blade was fixed, making them ok for a strictly stabbing thrust, but which would break if you tried to swing them. So basically they were mostly thrusting weapons, like the later rapier, geddit? ;))

At any rate, clubs, axes and spears were already dominating the scene long before swords.

I know swords (or their ancestors) arrived on the scene fairly early, in the form of pointed sticks. There are also examples of swords which are little more than bits of sharp stone embedded in a wooden shaft.
Reference: Richard Burton's First Book of the Sword, 1883; Figure 31, pp 26-27. pdf available at the link (it works in Canada, at any rate)

More like "their ancestors" _IMHO_.

Most people would call those very early flint and wood implement "axes", "spears" or "javelins", rather than a proper sword.

And the shaft with rows of stone shards, as made famous by the Aztecs, are IMHO closer to what would later be called a morning star in both concept and usage, than the proper blade-as-THE-weapon design that was a real sword. Those shards were more like sharp points to be driven into an opponent by impact, like in a morning star, than something really forming a fast and deadly cutting edge. Plus, at least some seem to have had more than two rows of those.

It may seem like nitpicking, but basically that's what trying to classify stuff is. If we're generous enough to call anything designed with murderous intent a sword, well, we're IMHO not going to be arriving at something particularly insightful.

But I have not looked into the earliest history of weapons in general, and thus do not know what came first. Slings, clubs, pointy sticks, bows and arrows, etc.

Technically, the pointy stick came first, even long before Homo Sapiens or even Ergaster. Followed by stone-tipped spears and axes and much later some sort of darts or javelins, likely used for huntng. Also sometimes thought to have been a reason for the expansion out of Africa, as apparently humans still didn't want to end up on the receiving end of 150 people throwing javelins.

The bow is itself a Johnny Come Lately at the scale of human existence. I wasn't referring to it as the first (thing that could technically be used as a) weapon, but rather as the thing which may have been a catalyst for human warfare. Humans had clubs, axes, spears, etc, before and seem to have mostly given other tribes a wide berth. Then suddenly they get bows and start painting a cave full of images of using it on other people.

I know that correlation does not mean causation, and, really, nobody can prove causation there. But it's a very compelling hypothesis, you have to admit.
 
Also, just to drive one point home about the mass grave that is Cemetery 117. There are skeletons of women and children there, for crying out loud. At least one side there wasn't mucking around with rules of chivalry or of formalized endemic warfare. (And likely neither was invented yet.)

Just the number of skeletons we found there represent slightly over a third of the size of a primitive tribe.
 


Very cool. And thank you!
I won't spend much time on this, as it is off-topic.
Maybe I'll make another thread on it.

But first, I am going to have to read the article you linked to.

Which might take me a couple days to get around to, sadly.

I will say this: What I classify as a sword varies depending on the era I'm referring to. It is a flexible definition. Flexible enough that I have heard of pointy sticks being referred to as rapiers. There's a lot of grey area. Obviously, the absolute best sword of all is the foil. Not that I'm biased, being a foilist. Not at all...
 
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