It's Homeopathy Awareness Week!

Sarah-I said:
He was not emotional before I went there and did not speak, however, when I went and placed a hand there, slowly the area began to soften and he took a deep breath and then started to cry. He then sobbed and was able to let go of all the emotion that he had been holding in this area.

He felt a lot better after this session. I agree that you cannot feel emotions per se, but there is a definite quality to the tissues where things are held. When the releases occur this tissues soften.
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I hope you're speaking figuratively here. Emotions are not "stored" in muscle tissue. In fact, they are not "stored" anywhere. Technically, long-term memories have a strong emotional component because they are routed through areas of the brain that handle emotion, both when they are stored and retrieved.

Also, "feeling better" and a release of muscular tension are well-known side effects of catharsis. The effect is temporary.

If I were to make a wild guess, I would say that this guy was starved for human contact and emotionally vulnerable. This is frequently the type of person who seeks "alternative" therapies, looking for an easy solution to complex psychological issues. (I know -- I've been there!)

PS -- you put your hand on his diaphragm? Seeing as that is inside the chest cavity, I think that would make me cry, too. ;)
 
Perhaps you need to go and read up on cellular memory then!!

The hand on the diaphragm is very light - there is no pressure at all.

A lot of the people who seek help from me are also seeing psychotherapists as well so that they can talk through the things that come up for them. Also, the effects are real and long lasting.
 
Sarah-I said:
Perhaps you need to go and read up on cellular memory then!!

The hand on the diaphragm is very light - there is no pressure at all.

A lot of the people who seek help from me are also seeing psychotherapists as well so that they can talk through the things that come up for them. Also, the effects are real and long lasting.
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I've read extensively on the topic of cellular memory. It appears to be nothing more than a fanciful quack notion touted by such infamous figures as Dr. Gary Schwartz, and Dr. John Upledger. There is not a scrap of scientific evidence to support the theory, and most of the "evidence" supporting it comes in the form of ludicrous anecdotal accounts of donor organ recipients developing the mannerisms and habits of the donors.

Then you've got Dr. Upledger carrying on conversations with people's organs and Dr. Carolyn Myss claiming that one of the functions of the liver is "filtering negative emotions".

It's beyond silly.

Regarding your patient who broke down crying... maybe he just came to the realization that he was going to have to pay for your light diaphpragm touching treatment?

Seriously though... Do you believe you "cured" the man?

Of what specific malady was he cured of?

It seems to me like he was just depressed and you helped him release a little anxiety... from his head, not his diaphragm area.

Treating emotional issues is one thing, if CS therapists would stick to that I wouldn't be as concerned or critical, but we've all seen the host of REAL, and in many cases very extreme, conditions they claim to treat. I need not list them here, I'm sure you are well aware.
 
Well, its not silly at all and its a real shame that people do not realise this.

I didn't just work on his head, I worked on other places on his body too and I helped him greatly with the reasons that he came to see me in the first place.

How would you explain this occurrence that happened to me in my practice then?

A young woman came to see me who had suffered a head injury about a month previously. She slipped and fell and hit her head hard on a wooden bench. This produced a large lump on the head with bruising. Over the course of about a couple of days, her nose swelled and this produced bruising down the side of both eyes. The injury had also given her a whiplash injury to her neck and it was because of these continuing problems that she had come to see me.

I saw her about three times and worked with her with very good results, however on the fourth treatment the following happened:-

She entered the room and we talked before the treatment, which I always do with all patients to see how they have been doing generally and to report on any changes that they have noticed. For the start of this treatment, I asked her to assume a seated position near the table. She did this and I put my hand in between her scapulae very gently. Within seconds of doing this, she had gasped and fallen forward over the table and just shook and shuddered and cried with pulsations that seemed to shudder through her body with great intensity. Once this had settled down, we talked about what had happened and she told me that she had re-experienced her whole accident in slow motion, but had felt the pain this time that she had not felt at the time the accident happened. Her body position over the table was exactly the same angle at which the orginal accident happened.

From this treatment on, her symptoms resolved very quickly.

If Craniosacral therapy does not work, then please explain to me what happened during this treatment, as I would love to know.
 
Sarah-I said:
Well, its not silly at all and its a real shame that people do not realise this.

I didn't just work on his head, I worked on other places on his body too and I helped him greatly with the reasons that he came to see me in the first place.

How would you explain this occurrence that happened to me in my practice then?

A young woman came to see me who had suffered a head injury about a month previously. She slipped and fell and hit her head hard on a wooden bench. This produced a large lump on the head with bruising. Over the course of about a couple of days, her nose swelled and this produced bruising down the side of both eyes. The injury had also given her a whiplash injury to her neck and it was because of these continuing problems that she had come to see me.

I saw her about three times and worked with her with very good results, however on the fourth treatment the following happened:-

She entered the room and we talked before the treatment, which I always do with all patients to see how they have been doing generally and to report on any changes that they have noticed. For the start of this treatment, I asked her to assume a seated position near the table. She did this and I put my hand in between her scapulae very gently. Within seconds of doing this, she had gasped and fallen forward over the table and just shook and shuddered and cried with pulsations that seemed to shudder through her body with great intensity. Once this had settled down, we talked about what had happened and she told me that she had re-experienced her whole accident in slow motion, but had felt the pain this time that she had not felt at the time the accident happened. Her body position over the table was exactly the same angle at which the orginal accident happened.

From this treatment on, her symptoms resolved very quickly.

If Craniosacral therapy does not work, then please explain to me what happened during this treatment, as I would love to know.
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It's painfully obvious what was transpiring during the two instances you mentioned. These people were expressing normal emotions, and you misinterpreted them as a result of your CS treatment. A case of confimation bias plain and simple. Mind you, I'm not saying you didn't help these people, but it's pretty apparent that it was garden variety TLC and not "cellular memory" or cranio-sacral restriction removal that was responsible for these people's reactions to your "treatment". The mere touch of a healing hand is a powerful tool, but you don't need to invent magical energy rays shooting out of one's fingers to explain it's utility. Basic human emotion is perfectly adequate.
 
Sarah-I said:
Well, its not silly at all and its a real shame that people do not realise this.

If Craniosacral therapy does not work, then please explain to me what happened during this treatment, as I would love to know.
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You just don't get this do you? Let me put it simply:

1. Anecdotal evidence is worthless. Do you have any scientific background at all? Do you know what evidence is?
2. It's not for us to explain what you claim. It's for you to substantiate it with objective evidence.

On this forum we are happy to debate with anyone prepared to do so rationally. We can't have any meaningful dialogue with you if all you can offer are emotional, subjective, anecdotal arguments. Has it occurred to you that you are practising medicine without a licence? Several posters on this thread have asked you for proper evidence and you have ignored all these questions, preferring to post verbose and worthless stories which we have no way of verifying. Please don't abuse this public facility for rational debate.
 
I think you are the one 'who just does not get it'.

Yes, there is scientific evidence about craniosacral therapy that has already been done and there is more research that is currently being conducted at the Fountain Clinic for craniosacral therapy.

www.fountain-clinic.co.uk

My practice is as a craniosacral therapist for which I have a postgraduate qualification. I am also a member of the registering body. I am also a fully qualified and registered nurse so who said anything about practicing anything without a licence?

There is research that has been done that shows the CST is effective for tinitis. This can be found in Fulcrum, which is a CST journal.
 
Do you have any evidence that it is effective? I couldn't find any on that link.
After all, it's been around since the 1930s when "Dr." Sutherland, an osteopath, concocted it.
 
Remember; for every anecdote, there is an equal an opposite story.

This was the reason behind the origins of scientific thinking. People got to wondering how to negotiate truth from a plethora of opposing stories. Imagine a court case where two people swear they saw events in a way that is completely mutually exclusive. Their interpretations are 'truth' in their own heads...but which is really the objective reality.

Several hundred years later, that system which has slowly developed has stood the test of time. Evidence might not give absolutes, but it's far better than what the human senses alone can offer when used with pure speculation.

For hundreds of years, we bled, starved, froze and purged people to cure them, believing in the balance of the humours. We shaved skulls, isolated 'lunatics', slapped tar on the soles of feet, gave tonics of mercury and arsenic... many things that made sense when given at the face value of anecdotes. Witches were hung on anecdotes, lynchings of innocent people have happened on anecdotes.

We sort truth not because of what we believe we see. We sort truth when we have become humble enough to say 'I am fallible', and honest enough to have beaten our ideas into the ground, only to have them still stand the test of predictability.

I know I could be wrong. I always know that.

Athon
 
Sarah-I said:
I think you are the one 'who just does not get it'.

Yes, there is scientific evidence about craniosacral therapy that has already been done and there is more research that is currently being conducted at the Fountain Clinic for craniosacral therapy.

www.fountain-clinic.co.uk

My practice is as a craniosacral therapist for which I have a postgraduate qualification. I am also a member of the registering body. I am also a fully qualified and registered nurse so who said anything about practicing anything without a licence?

There is research that has been done that shows the CST is effective for tinitis. This can be found in Fulcrum, which is a CST journal.
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Go to PubMed and enter `craniosacral therapy'. There are 22 citations. Now tell me how many of these report randomised controlled clinical trials showing a positive outcome in favour of CST. Then tell me how many report that therapists are unable to detect what they claim to detect, when they are tested under controlled conditions. So there is evidence in a CST journal (not indexed on PubMed)? Surprise, surprise.

I am not getting into arguments about professional bodies. There may well be one for writers of fairy tales but that doesn't make the stories true.
 
Don't be so stupid if you can help it!!

I have given you the information that you need. The journal is called Fulcrum.

The professional association is called CSTA - Craniosacral Therapy Association to which practitioners belong.

Upledger and Karni did research into CST together, with Karni producing a machine to measure what Upledger was feeling. By looking at his machine, Karni could tell Upledger what he was feeling and what was happening in the patient's body just by looking at his machine. Upledger could see Karni and vice versa.

If you can find a stand during CST awareness week, please go and visit it and talk to the therapists there. You might just learn a thing or to and if you are lucky you might get a free treatment!! Get a free treatment and feel it for yourself and then come back and tell me that it does not work!!
 
Dr William Garner Sutherland did not 'concoct' CST as you say. He carried out experiments on himself and developed it from his experimentations. He was a scientist after all. He was a DO in the States, which is equal in status to an MD remember that.

I am thankful that at least one person on this forum is able to post something sensible with being rude.
 
Sarah-I said:
Dr William Garner Sutherland did not 'concoct' CST as you say. He carried out experiments on himself and developed it from his experimentations. He was a scientist after all. He was a DO in the States, which is equal in status to an MD remember that.

I am thankful that at least one person on this forum is able to post something sensible with being rude.
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The `Dr' status of osteopaths in the US is a celebrated contention between them and real physicians - many of whom object to it. I'm sorry, but I find your insistence on forcing anecdotes down our necks rather offensive. Why can't you answer the points made by myself and others regarding proper controlled trials? Proof is not coming to a trade stand and receiving `treatment'. It's running an experiment under controlled conditions. How many times do we have to say this? If your Sutherland didn't do that, then he was not a scientist at all.
 
Sarah-I said:

How would you explain this occurrence that happened to me in my practice then?

A young woman came to see me who had suffered a head injury about a month previously.....
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Wow, you have actual anecdotal evidence? Why didn't you say so!?!
 
Sarah-I said:
Once this had settled down, we talked about what had happened and she told me that she had re-experienced her whole accident in slow motion, but had felt the pain this time that she had not felt at the time the accident happened.
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This is interesting. Do you think re-experiencing the accident helped this woman? If so, then how?
 
Yes, I do think that re-experiencing her accident helped this woman.

She told me that when the accident happened originally, that she tripped from the tube train and then hit her head on the bench. As she hit her head, she let out an 'ouch'. She was quite dazed, but when she came to she looked at her watch and thought that she was going to be late for her appointment, so carried on walking.

When this re-experiencing happened during the consultation her body shook too, as well as letting go of her emotions. This helped her because she told me afterwards that during this, she was able to feel the pain then that she should have felt during the actual accident itself. She never allowed herself to feel this at the time and it also enabled her to let go of her feelings of fear that the same thing would happen again.

This helped her because it allowed her to let go and move on. Her symptoms very quickly resolved following this session.
 
Sarah-I said:
When this re-experiencing happened during the consultation her body shook too, as well as letting go of her emotions. This helped her because she told me afterwards that during this, she was able to feel the pain then that she should have felt during the actual accident itself. She never allowed herself to feel this at the time and it also enabled her to let go of her feelings of fear that the same thing would happen again.

This helped her because it allowed her to let go and move on. Her symptoms very quickly resolved following this session.
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So basically you think you were treating a psychological problem rather than a physical one?
 
No, I was treating both. The original reason that she came to see me was because of continuing symptoms from the whiplash injury that occurred with the head injury.

Afterwards, she said that she could physically feel things shifting down her body in great waves and this produced the shaking and physical release. She also let her emotions out with regard to the incident, such as sadness, anger and fear that the same kind of thing might happen again, which is why she was holding on so much.

Her physical symptoms resolved very quickly following this session.
 
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