It's 2016 and slavery still exists

[SashatheMagnificent]

You tunnel vision is noted. In other news, it appears that a big arms sale is pending with Qatar, dozens of F-15s and F-16s. Heh, they like to buy nice shiny jet planes, but their likelihood of being any good with them is pretty small. PT Barnum has an old adage that I think applies.

I find his vision not at all "tunnel".
Heck, the US is the largest terror-sponsoring country in the world, everybody, except the americans, know that

 

[jimbob]

Now this is interesting. As a Sci Fi author, what would you say are the three most influential Sci Fi books, in terms of social justice?

Me? I like The Time Machine, I, Robot, and Use of Weapons. But none of them were very influential at all. I look forward to your contribution to the otherwise anemic field of socially influential Sci Fi books.

The Time Machine was influential - it put the idea of the Morlocks to prominence and crystallized the ideas of a degenerate underclass. The influence probably wasn't good.

Use of Weapons is about my favourite book, but as you say only influential within a small section of Science Fiction.

 

[LSSBB]

The Time Machine was influential - it put the idea of the Morlocks to prominence and crystallized the ideas of a degenerate underclass. The influence probably wasn't good.

Use of Weapons is about my favourite book, but as you say only influential within a small section of Science Fiction.

H.G Wells was a self-proclaimed Socialist.

 

[jimbob]

H.G Wells was a self-proclaimed Socialist.

Indeed, but at the time Eugenics and Socialism were not mutually exclusive positions.

 

[LSSBB]

Indeed, but at the time Eugenics and Socialism were not mutually exclusive positions.

Wells perceived social stratification as a danger and that motivated him to display it's outcome, when taken to the extreme, as abhorrent.

 

[jimbob]

Wells perceived social stratification as a danger and that motivated him to display it's outcome, when taken to the extreme, as abhorrent.

Yes, but I am not sure the influence was what Wells wanted - except it does fit with an Eugenicist view.

 

[psionl0]

Saudi women file petition to end male guardianship system

"Guardianship". It's a euphemism for ownership and male supremacy.



Of course, I knew about this before, but it still flabbergasts me every time I am reminded.

It is a bad thing for Saudi women - especially those brought up with western values. However, if pales into insignificance compared to the extreme poverty, injustice and brutality experienced by many - especially those who live in third world dictatorships.

 

[LSSBB]

It is a bad thing for Saudi women - especially those brought up with western values. However, if pales into insignificance compared to the extreme poverty, injustice and brutality experienced by many - especially those who live in third world dictatorships.

Isn't a gilded cage still a cage?

 

[psionl0]

Isn't a gilded cage still a cage?

Maybe but a cut finger is not a ruptured artery.

In any case, no matter how "outraged" we might be at these injustices, nothing will be done about any of them. Or do you think that GWB should have invaded Saudi Arabia?

 

[LSSBB]

Maybe but a cut finger is not a ruptured artery.

In any case, no matter how "outraged" we might be at these injustices, nothing will be done about any of them. Or do you think that GWB should have invaded Saudi Arabia?

Not seeing your equivalence.

 

[Beerina]

Sorry, but this strikes me as sophistry and false equivalence. I am not a "slave" because I have to pay taxes and obey laws in a democratic society.

The "guardianship" system treats adult women like children and men as effectively parents (in the West, a "guardian" is either the parent of a child with legal custody of the child, or someone appointed by a court to take on the role of a parent.)

What if that state were arrived at democratically? Say 99% of the men and 10% of the women voted for it?

Is democracy, and more specifically, a 51% bare majority, the highest value in your arsenal? Is this abstraction of might makes right properly used to impose every last idea of law and control based on the words of charismatic demagogues, who delight in the very low bar to massive control, which you look at as a shining light akin to the Throne of God upon a mountain top?

Is democracy the endgame, or is freedom?

 

[Puppycow]

What if that state were arrived at democratically? Say 99% of the men and 10% of the women voted for it?

Is democracy, and more specifically, a 51% bare majority, the highest value in your arsenal? Is this abstraction of might makes right properly used to impose every last idea of law and control based on the words of charismatic demagogues, who delight in the very low bar to massive control, which you look at as a shining light akin to the Throne of God upon a mountain top?

Is democracy the endgame, or is freedom?

That would still be unjust and no, democracy is not my highest value.

However, I will note that no true democracy that I am aware of has anything similar, once women are allowed to vote. I say true democracy because even dictatorships often give themselves a democratic fig leaf. There are supposedly elections in North Korea (that's the "Democratic People's Republic of Korea") in which 100% of the voters vote for the Dear leader. I don't count those or other Potemkin democracies. Saudi Arabia however doesn't even pretend to be a democracy.

The old adage is that democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others. I would happily embrace a better system, if such existed. Rule by wise benevolent robots maybe? You tell me what a better one would be.

 

[SashatheMagnificent]

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-saudi-defense-idUSKCN10K1JR
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/u-s-to-sell-up-to-60-billion-of-arms-to-saudi-arabia-1.313619