Is sudoko the ultimate brain exercise?

Here's a mental puzzle for you: I am the only skeptic in this thread. t/f, and why?
 
Ocelot said:
By what measure?

A type I diabetic friend of mine found that designing a complex network architecture was equivalent in terms of the rate his blood sugar levels lowered as moderate physical exercise.

Mental exercise burns calories just as physical exercise does so one measure of the ultimate exercise would be the one the requires the most work to accomplish. Yet it's not guaranteed that that expending more energy correlates with the greatest effect on Alzheimers.
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What?!?!? Has this been tested?
 
In any case, energy burning of thinking aside, exercising the brain builds neural links, which would perforce combat degradation of neurons. New stuff would exist to combat the breaking down of the old stuff.

IIRC, the stylized neural links you see in drawings are very simplified. A typical neuron connects to 10,000 others in humans.
 
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Beerina said:
In any case, energy burning of thinking aside, exercising the brain builds neural links, which would perforce combat degradation of neurons. New stuff would exist to combat the breaking down of the old stuff.

IIRC, the stylized neural links you see in drawings are very simplified. A typical neuron connects to 10,000 others in humans.
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I am not convinced that continually doing a puzzle in which you already know all of the rules would build any new neural connections. Especially with Sudoku, where you are not forced to remember anything about the puzzle. That would be impossible. I atleast write down all of the clues during solving. After completing the puzzle, do you remember any of the positions of the numbers, even short term?

Perhaps I am wrong about the process, but in simple terms, adding small numbers in your head all day would be the same type of process. Does actually just thinking create neural connections?
 
Careyp74 said:
And what was it that convinced you that I am not acting like a proper skeptic?
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Without going back and reading each of your posts, the big assumption in this thread is that exercise prevents degradation. NO STUDY LINKED SHOWS THAT.

Studies do show that there is less mental degradation (MD) in those who do mental exercise (ME). But "COMMONALITY IS NOT CAUSALITY". There was probably a lot of selection bias, in that they studied middle aged folks, grouped by the amount of ME they did. But by that time, those who already suffered the least MD would be the ones doing the most ME. The results said "the smart people stayed smart", but no other causeality. Perhaps the difference was as far back as in the womb, or before.

Nobody has linked to a prospective study, where those in a a low ME group are divided into two groups, one remains usual, the other is sentenced to Sudoku.
 
On a different note, exercise is also good for the circulation. I suspect brain exercise encourages local circulation to the areas doing the mental exercise too.

I have noticed how it takes time to shift my bran usage from different subject. Colors or graphics to and from math, for instance. I wonder of blood flow isn't the controlling factor? Our vessels do have the ability to constrict flow, or dilate for maximum fuel flow. I do "Freecell for Speed", wining about 20 games per hour. (apparently nobody else keep track). But when I'm on a roll, if I lag too long to check my 'games won' statistics, I just can't function as well at the game. Math vs graphics, I think? "Check score" works off of stored energy, but too much statistical thinking shifts blood flow patterns away from 'graphics for speed'?
 
casebro said:
Without going back and reading each of your posts, the big assumption in this thread is that exercise prevents degradation. NO STUDY LINKED SHOWS THAT.

Studies do show that there is less mental degradation (MD) in those who do mental exercise (ME). But "COMMONALITY IS NOT CAUSALITY". There was probably a lot of selection bias, in that they studied middle aged folks, grouped by the amount of ME they did. But by that time, those who already suffered the least MD would be the ones doing the most ME. The results said "the smart people stayed smart", but no other causeality. Perhaps the difference was as far back as in the womb, or before.

Nobody has linked to a prospective study, where those in a a low ME group are divided into two groups, one remains usual, the other is sentenced to Sudoku.
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So you assume that everyone posting in a thread about something that doesn't seem to be true is a believer in that something? And what are you doing here? Very critical of you.

Just a note, the OP wasn't about Alzheimer's, and the effects that puzzles have on it. It was about the ultimate brain exercise puzzle. Not the effects that the puzzle could have.
 
casebro said:
On a different note, exercise is also good for the circulation. I suspect brain exercise encourages local circulation to the areas doing the mental exercise too.

I have noticed how it takes time to shift my bran usage from different subject. Colors or graphics to and from math, for instance. I wonder of blood flow isn't the controlling factor? Our vessels do have the ability to constrict flow, or dilate for maximum fuel flow. I do "Freecell for Speed", wining about 20 games per hour. (apparently nobody else keep track). But when I'm on a roll, if I lag too long to check my 'games won' statistics, I just can't function as well at the game. Math vs graphics, I think? "Check score" works off of stored energy, but too much statistical thinking shifts blood flow patterns away from 'graphics for speed'?
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I think the warm up needed to be at optimum efficiency for things is the needed remembrance of all of the skills that you use to do that thing. The first attempts that you make that are not as good allow you to think about what you weren't doing to get the best results. There is muscle memory in your hand controlling the mouse, rules of where to click in different circumstances, etc.

You might drag a few cards before you remember "oh yeah, I can just double click them" or you might forget the order of the face cards, or at least have to think about it again before having it solid in your mind without thinking.
 
It's not a first game problem, I do as good there as anywhere. It's a 'shifting gears' problem. Another example is once while doing taxes, a co-worker asked me my opinion of a color scheme. I almost drooled, I went so inept. Like the Three Stooges, I was "trying to think, but nothing happened".
 
Careyp74 said:
So you assume that everyone posting in a thread about something that doesn't seem to be true is a believer in that something? And what are you doing here? Very critical of you.

Just a note, the OP wasn't about Alzheimer's, and the effects that puzzles have on it. It was about the ultimate brain exercise puzzle. Not the effects that the puzzle could have.
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I that why the OP starts "Altheimers disease runs in my family and in my efforts to stave off this disorder I do puzzles... "

So, where's the proof of benefit, puzzles vs brain degeneration?
 
casebro said:
I that why the OP starts "Altheimers disease runs in my family and in my efforts to stave off this disorder I do puzzles... "

So, where's the proof of benefit, puzzles vs brain degeneration?
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Oh ok. Sure, the OP wasn't asking about it, but no one was challenging it, so we are all uncritical. Everyone should have jumped on that as soon as we saw it. How uncritical of us.

Just like this guy:

casebro said:
No. Surfing the JREF fora is the Ultimate Brain Exercise. :)

But re: brain exercise, I've been thinking about neurological endurance. I can't find much by googling. My thought is that just like muscles, nerves run out of energy after a while. They need a rest period to re-charge SOMEHTING. But What? Maybe they run purely on glucose, but I wouldn't think so- there must be some other trace needed. Not just for thinking, but also for sending signals to the muscles. So, what trace element would I need to enhance neuro-endurance?

I do note that when playing Freecell, the taking a break to check my stats helps, if just a moment. It probably uses a differnet part of the brain, math instead of visual, or something, and lets the 'playing' side recharge. But take too long, and ummm, maybe the blood flow changes over to the math part instead of the 'playing' part?

I'm not a believer in the left side/ right side for creativity, but I do believe the brain can control blood flow to various parts that are used for particular tasks. Brain anatomy is proven by studying stroke victms, language center, math center, etc. So, next step to stave off ALZ would be to 'exercise' the ummm _______ center? But isn't ALZ eventually a total brain degeneration? When it gets to the brain stem, you die?
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So to answer the other question, false, you were not the only critical thinker, because you didn't harp on it from the start either.
 
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Careyp74 said:
I am not convinced that continually doing a puzzle in which you already know all of the rules would build any new neural connections. Especially with Sudoku, where you are not forced to remember anything about the puzzle. That would be impossible. I atleast write down all of the clues during solving. After completing the puzzle, do you remember any of the positions of the numbers, even short term?

Perhaps I am wrong about the process, but in simple terms, adding small numbers in your head all day would be the same type of process. Does actually just thinking create neural connections?
Click to expand...

Every time you are concentrating on something, your brain is slowly (or quickly, depending) memorizing things, even the details of that particular puzzle.

I do wonder though if it's building a facility to solve those kinds of puzzles, and honing it. "I need to remember this and this and this kind of data in that format", and you get better at it, this is building of support neural connections.
 
My sister and I each play Freecell. I play for speed, winning about 20 games per hour.(looks like I am unique there, nobody else every mentions speed) It's 74% these days. I asked my sister how many she wins. She answered "All of them." Seems she plays each game over and over until she wins it. I suspect she sees this scoring as a way to foster memory? Or some kind of judgement? Otherwise, she carries a Sudoku book everywhere.

But as I said up-thread, correlation is not causation. Just because the old folks with sharp minds do puzzles doesn't mean that doing puzzles will make you live longer, or make an other wise dull mind sharper in old age than it would have been.

Hey, Reagan died of Alzheimer's. It started creeping in while he was President. If that job is not mentally challenging enough to keep the old actor sharp, Sudoku won't help either.

So I hope we all enjoy our puzzles. As games. Any other benefit is unproven.
 
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