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Papa Funkosophy
No. the wisdom of the designer is used to form the clay, the wisdom is not imparted to the clay.
Intelligent Design
- Thread starter codeblue
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Why don't you ask kmortis to explain it to you? ... Or, perhaps Merc?
No, I think I'll ask you. After all, you were the one that made the claim.
What is "it all part" of? If by this you mean growing, then I'd say "yes", the genetic material contained in a seed can be thought of as "programming" the seed to grow. What's your point?
Only to have you accuse me of giving no thought to the matter? What a waste of time that is!
I did not ask you how you came to the conclusion. I asked you how convinced you are. I had no intention of "accusing you" of any such thing; it was a genuine question.
If you wish to dodge it by calling it a waste of time, fine. But a number between 0 and 100 would have taken many fewer keystrokes than your answer did.
If you wish to dodge it by calling it a waste of time, fine. But a number between 0 and 100 would have taken many fewer keystrokes than your answer did.
No, I was merely reiterating kmortis' claim. Whereas Mercutio seems to be assured that something cannot come from nothing. You ought to know full well that I have made no such claim.
Well, let's just say it's well above 50% then, Okay?
I have never made that claim, Iacchus, and you would know it if you could understand what you have read many times over. Your strawman claim is that we claim that something comes from nothing. Every knowledgeable person here who has addressed your claim has admitted that at a certain level, the earliest moments of the big bang are beyond our ability to gather sufficient evidence to know. "I don't know how it started" is not at all "something came from nothing". The former is honest, the latter is dishonest.
Quit misrepresenting what others say.
kmortis
Biomechanoid, Director of IDIOCY (Region 13)
Well, you do keep responding to him.
Ok, I'm going to continue my role as Will Graham here.
You seem to be saying that all organic processes (organic in the sense of "showing growth" rather than just limiting to organic compounds) follow a "design". This design was set forth by a Creator, who has set forth, will contiune for the forseeable future to set forth and has always set forth these aforementioned "designs". These "designs" are not random in nature, but follow a set, if unrecognizable pattern.
Does that fairly summarize the point you've been trying to make?
Is randomness something that exists within the whole? Or, outside of the whole? If it exists within the whole, it is not random. If it exists outside of the whole, you're saying that something can come from nothing.
So what I'm saying is pure conjecture then? ... Guess again.
Then that which is formed, should show no evidence of design.
I doubt it rises to the level of conjecture.
What you are saying about the views of others is inaccurate and misleading. Your pattern of use suggests that it is deliberately so--a strawman. Your perseverance in doing so after being corrected suggests either incredible ignorance or an intent to deceive. In most cases, I would lean toward "ignorance", because you have not demonstrated appropriate use of individual terms, let alone concepts, from natural selection, abiogenesis, cosmology, logic, and scientific methodology. But in some cases, deliberate deception seems to be the case--when you are corrected on very specific uses of a phrase, then repeat that same exact usage several times
What you are saying about your own views is ill-thought-out, internally inconsistent, lacking both coherent logic and empirical support (indeed, sometimes contradicting observed evidence). But then, what do we expect, when it comes from dreams and numerology?
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Papa Funkosophy
Why on earth is that?
Tricky
Briefly immortal
Hey, don't knock dreams, Merc. Some of the greatest ideas in the world come from dreams. Why, just the other night I woke up from a dream in which I was helping out a composer who had a really tight deadline on a musical he was writing (he had ten minutes to finish it), so I was doing the lyrics for him.
I can't remember all the songs, but I recall the showstopper started like this (sort of to the tune of Gang Bang Lulu).
I like to sing
I like to dance
I like to run around
With a pine cone in my pants.
So don't tell me that the ideas we come up with in dreams aren't brilliant.
No, you tell me, since this is basically what you're saying.
Thank you for demonstrating my first point.
Upchurch
Papa Funkosophy
I've never said anything of the sort. It's your statement, back it up or retract it.
eta: or ignore it in a cowardly way.
Yeah, that happened to me once, except I wasn't dreaming. I was out hiking in the woods and just barely made it to the outhouse when I got to camp. And when I was through I began to set up camp, and the kids from the other camp, who were hanging around the general area, didn't waste any time sneaking in behind me. And you could hear their whoops of delite, resonate throughout the woods ... "Ooooh, pine cones!"
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