If Gaza is no longer occupied by Israel....

[lionking]

Oh, yeah, like Gaza poses this HUGE and EXISTENTIAL threat to Israel - a nuclear armed state with one of th worlds most efficient militaries

And bombs being lobbed on your village from a state sworn to destroy you is something you would shrug off?

 

[Skeptic]

Let's hope and pray he is OK

When you board a flotilla aimed at sending material to a hostile entity controlled by a genocidal terrorist organization, something like that can happen to you, in the same way that someone who joins the Taliban as a reporter might be killed by a US bomb. What did you friggin' expect?

 

[lionking]

FYI McGeogh is one of THE most respected foreign correspondents in the Australian media. http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/br...nd-kate-geraghty/story-e6frf7jx-1225873686411

Oh give us a break. McGeogh has been a Hamas apologist for a long time. Respected by you perhaps.

 

[MaGZ]

I can't wait to hear from Paul McGeogh, the Australian journalist aboard the flotilla, whose audio feed went silent as Israel attacked. Let's hope and pray he is OK, because Israel has a nasty record of silencing murdering journalists who don't tow the official line

http://www.cpj.org/killed/mideast/israel-and-the-occupied-palestinian-territory/

I look for immediate condemnation from the UN over this attack. Remember just a few days ago they passed a resolution calling for Israel to declare her nuclear weapons.

This reminds me of the "good ole days" at the UN when Zionism equaled racism.

 

[bit_pattern]

And just 'cos I'm a freaking masochist... ^^ Yes, because criticisng Israel automatically makes one a holocaust denier. Wooo!

Now, back in the real world, I'm pleased to report Paul McGeough is alright, I'll be back to report on his eventual account of the whole incident. Follow the link for at least one eyewitness account that completely contradicts the IDF's propaganda (but watch out, she's Turkish and probably Muslim too, and you know how diabolical and conniving those filthy Muslims are!):

Fairfax Journalist Paul McGeough and photographer Kate Geraghty were out of communication for some hours after the clash, sparking concern for their welfare.

"We are pleased to report that Paul McGeough and Kate Geraghty, who are among the most experienced and well-trained Australian foreign correspondents, are safe, and being processed in an Israeli detention centre," Sydney Morning Herald Editor in Chief Peter Fray said.

"We remain hopeful that they will be allowed to do their job, and that they will have a terrific story to tell when they are released."

 

[Skeptic]

Oh, yeah, like Gaza poses this HUGE and EXISTENTIAL threat to Israel

Irrelevant. There is hardly any law that says that you must do nothing and fight no aggression against you unless it reaches "existential threats" level. Hamas is at war with Israel, so maintaining a blockade is legitimate.

Anyway, I, personally, as well as people I know, were in Sderot when it was bombed with missiles from Gaza. That was a bit of a threat to my and their existence. Just FYI.

 

[Skeptic]

Have you checked the death ratio between the two sides lately?

If that is the criteria, the USA was on the wrong side in WWII, because it killed more Germans than the Germans killed Americans. In Pearl Harbor Japan killed only a few thousands Americans; should the USA had stopped the war the moment a similar number of Japanese were killed?

 

[Thunder]

Israel was clearly very jealous of North Korea getting all the international attention, so they decided to get back in the limelight, and attack this aid ship in international waters.

And of course, the people on the ship were supposed to stay quiet and do whatever the IDF says, because it is anti-Semitic to fight back against the IDF when they attack an aid ship in international waters.

Oh, and this was done a day before Barack Obama is to meet with Netanyahu to discuss the peace process.

Israel. Never misses an opportunity to look stupid.

 

[Skeptic]

Israel reacts with overwhelming and disproportionate force at even the slightest provocation.

Does it? What would you do if you were bombed from Gaza daily for the last eight years? Ask them nicely to stop, I suppose.

 

[Thunder]

And Israelis and right-wing extremists still ask: "why do people all over the world hate Israel? its not like we do anything wrong. plus, the world would hate us regardless of what we do, so we might as well just keep on doing the wrong thing".

 

[Nogbad]

One does not need to be pro or anti either side to see that this is a mess. The Turks and Greeks are less than happy and those are two countries that Israel needs on side.

Whatever this is it certainly wasn't on the Road Map. With the Koreas and Pakistan unravelling and the West still committed to Iraq and Afghanistan, we live in interesting times.

 

[bit_pattern]

Finally, some sane people, looks like I can re-involve myself in this thread

Does it? What would you do if you were bombed from Gaza daily for the last eight years? Ask them nicely to stop, I suppose.

Ooh, ooh, I can play that game too!

It does. What would you do if if you had been under perpetual occupation for the last forty three years? Ask them nicely to stop, I suppose

See what I did there?!

 

[Captain.Sassy]

Does it? What would you do if you were bombed from Gaza daily for the last eight years? Ask them nicely to stop, I suppose.

I saw an interesting map in The Economist last week. It showed the West Bank, including Israeli settlements, areas under Israeli military control, etc. The 'Palestinian' state, i.e. the area actually controlled by the Palestinian authority, looked like a bunch of disconnected and encircled little enclaves. It was an interesting map to look at.

Hopefully someone has a video of the incident from start to finish.

 

[bit_pattern]

landed in the wrong thread, didnt want to really paticipate in this thread.

to much antisemites here.

Oh, ****, didn't know about other thread. Didn't men to affiliate myself with the anti-semite flogs. Was only just brought o my attention

 

[Mycroft]

Incidentally, are handguns permitted for crews of merchant ships on high seas?
With all the problems this causes among pirates in Somalia, special security crews need to be on board and so on, I think the answer may be no, but I don't know enough to say.

McHrozni

In the state I live I'm permitted to open carry a handgun (I don't), but if I use it against the police, I still get shot.

The issue isn't if you're permitted to have guns on the high seas, the issue is if you use them to ambush navy personnel boarding your ship.

 

[Mycroft]

Israel has done nothing wrong. Israel CAN do nothing wrong. All suggestions of Israel doing something wrong, are anti-Semitism.

I can think of a lot of things Israel does wrong, but that's probably true of most nations. I do know that straw-man arguments like this don't do anything to advance any discussion.

 

[Mycroft]

Oh, how very condescending. I'm sure you feel very smug and superior with your semantic quibbles. The siege of Gaza doesn't have any modern day equivalence, it was occupied for forty years, the occupation "ended", ie. Israel pulled their troops out of immediate physical danger, and the control of the territory has been maintained by this siege, of which the blockade is part of. But keep up with the semantic arguments, it does a good job of detracting from the fact that Israel just murdered anywhere from 10 to 20 humanitarian activists on the high seas

I don't think it's a "quibble" at all.

It's apparent to me there is a real effort to manipulate language as part of an overall propaganda campaign against Israel. If you truly believe it's just a "quibble", then maybe you should be the one to take the moral high-ground and resolve to use only accurate terms in discussing the topic and refrain from inaccurate terms.

I've seen an Isreali journalist being interviewed on Australian TV tonight and he was calling it a huge debacle and are saying in disbelieving tone that Israel had better come up with definitive proof of gunfire by the time they reach port or this is oing o backfire hugely for Israel

Then that journalist is not objective, is he?

 

[McHrozni]

In the state I live I'm permitted to open carry a handgun (I don't), but if I use it against the police, I still get shot.

The issue isn't if you're permitted to have guns on the high seas, the issue is if you use them to ambush navy personnel boarding your ship.

Well, it becomes an issue if it is claimed Israel violated the law of the high seas by boarding the ships. If the men on board were illegally armed, that case becomes a whole lot weaker.

I find it rather unexpected that aid workers to be armed. It's slightly suspicious, though not proving anything by itself.

McHrozni

 

[webfusion]

I saw an interesting map in The Economist last week. It showed the West Bank, including Israeli settlements, areas under Israeli military control, etc. The 'Palestinian' state, i.e. the area actually controlled by the Palestinian authority, looked like a bunch of disconnected and encircled little enclaves. It was an interesting map to look at.

This is a link to the map you are referring to -- it's called "East Palestine Archipelago" by Juliean Bousac. (for some reason, it excludes Gaza, which is an "island" unto itself)

http://strangemaps.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/palestina.jpg

At a glance, it's possible to see that there's little "contiguous territory" for forming a Palestinian State. Their best option would be a Confederation entity with Israel and Jordan, with close ties to trade and tourism.

Hopefully someone has a video of the incident from start to finish.

From what I have seen, the Mavi Marmara ship was the scene of the ambush "lynch" that the IDF commando force was exposed to, with axes, machetes, iron bars and the snatching of personal weapons from the soldiers and turning them back onto the IDF and opening fire.

While the resulting loss of lives from this onboard violence is really tragic, and regrettable, I am quite glad that this armada was stopped and the blockade wasn't broken.

 

[McHrozni]

It does. What would you do if if you had been under perpetual occupation for the last forty three years? Ask them nicely to stop, I suppose

See what I did there?!

I believe it's called a red herring.

McHrozni