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Split Thread ICE arrests mayor

Asked and answered.
You have stated several times that the Mayor's purpose there was to inspect.

He has no such authority. He hires people to do this for the taxpayers. He is not an expert in permit law or requirements.
 

One person let him in. They keyword is "let". This is clearly not trespassing. You lost the argument, take the loss so you don't look stupid.
Why was he let in? What interaction actually took place?
 
Why was he let in? What interaction actually took place?
It doesn't matter. He was let in. Also, he left after talking to the other occupants. No trespassing occured and the courts will agree, I'm sure. Would you like to bet your avatar pic? If I win, I can pic yours and if you win, you can pick mine?
 
"I shot the guy for trespassing.. sure, I let him in by mistake, and he left after I told him to leave.. but I'm well within my rights to defend my property after he left the premesis...."

The absurd position above is very similar to what you are arguing, Herc.
 
And the Mayor of Newark, running for Governor, is NOT political?
I have no comment on that. I was merely responding to your claim that the arrest was at the discretion of the ICE officers present. It was not. It was directed by people who were not there and who did not witness the events.

He passed through the gates, putting him on ICE property.
If the gate was opened to allow him to enter the perimeter, he was invited according to occupancy law.

It appears one ICE person let him in, perhaps by mistake.
Irrelevant. If the ICE officer discovers later than he invited the mayor into the perimeter by mistake, he has the right to revoke the mayor's right to remain, ask him to leave, and warn him that he is liable to a charge of trespassing if he does not. That does not transform the prior presence into a trespass.

Did the Mayor announce who he actually was? Did the person let him in by error?
Irrelevant. If the ICE officer opens the gate to allow anyone into the perimeter, that person is an invitee and not a trespasser.

You have stated several times that the Mayor's purpose there was to inspect.
You wrongly assumed I meant that he was there to do a hard-hat construction inspection. I specifically repudiated that claim.

He has no such authority.
I cited to the statute giving him authority as chief executive officer of the state and explaining his duties.

He hires people to do this for the taxpayers.
The mayor may hire anyone he pleases and delegate his authority to them to carry out various duties under his supervision. Their authority comes from him, not the other way around.

He is not an expert in permit law or requirements.
Irrelevant.
 
Also at one point, at about 1:10 on the tape, an officer in fatigues in the middle of the scuffle lifts a weapon with a long black barrel that he holds with both hands and points it at various people in the crowd.

That particular officer should face consequences for public endangerment of pointing a loaded weapon into a crowd.
 
Actually, it really does matter. What did he say to this person? What was the response?

Did he say "Im the Mayor of Newark, let me in!!" and the guy said "ok boss, you're the boss"?

Facts matter.
They do, but what facts matter do or don't aren't what you think they are.
 
Actually, it really does matter.
No. Literally all that that matters is that the ICE officer opened the gate and allowed him to enter the perimeter. Once he does that—for any reason—the entrant is an invitee and not a trespasser. You're simply trying to invent law that doesn't exist.
 
I have no comment on that. I was merely responding to your claim that the arrest was at the discretion of the ICE officers present. It was not. It was directed by people who were not there and who did not witness the events.


If the gate was opened to allow him to enter the perimeter, he was invited according to occupancy law.


Irrelevant. If the ICE officer discovers later than he invited the mayor into the perimeter by mistake, he has the right to revoke the mayor's right to remain, ask him to leave, and warn him that he is liable to a charge of trespassing if he does not. That does not transform the prior presence into a trespass.


Irrelevant. If the ICE officer opens the gate to allow anyone into the perimeter, that person is an invitee and not a trespasser.


You wrongly assumed I meant that he was there to do a hard-hat construction inspection. I specifically repudiated that claim.


I cited to the statute giving him authority as chief executive officer of the state and explaining his duties.


The mayor may hire anyone he pleases and delegate his authority to them to carry out various duties under his supervision. Their authority comes from him, not the other way around.


Irrelevant.

By your logic, the Mayor of Newark has the authority to personally engage in fire safety inspections, police wellness checks, ANY inspection that he has delegated to lower level personnel.

And we know that to be absurd. Mayor of Newark has no authority to engage in permit inspections and do so without prior notice.

And yes, if the Mayor gave false witness when trying to enter the facility and gained entry based on that false witness, then he was immediately trespassing as soon as he stepped foot on the property.

We dont know what words were exchanged, we need to know.
 
No. Literally all that that matters is that the ICE officer opened the gate and allowed him to enter the perimeter. Once he does that—for any reason—the entrant is an invitee and not a trespasser. You're simply trying to invent law that doesn't exist.
Agreed, unless there is evidence of coercion. I didn't see the mayor point any weapon at that officer that let him in, though.
 
No. Literally all that that matters is that the ICE officer opened the gate and allowed him to enter the perimeter. Once he does that—for any reason—the entrant is an invitee and not a trespasser. You're simply trying to invent law that doesn't exist.
NOT if the mayor lied about his identity or his purpose for being there.

We need to know what words were exchanged.
 
how do you know so much about what authority the mayor of newark has in newark?
 
By your logic, the Mayor of Newark has the authority to personally engage in fire safety inspections, police wellness checks, ANY inspection that he has delegated to lower level personnel.

And we know that to be absurd. Mayor of Newark has no authority to engage in permit inspections and do so without prior notice.

And yes, if the Mayor gave false witness when trying to enter the facility and gained entry based on that false witness, then he was immediately trespassing as soon as he stepped foot on the property.

We dont know what words were exchanged, we need to know.
Can you cite the law about trespassing that you are referring to?
 
how do you know so much about what authority the mayor of newark has in newark?
I know he doesn't have the authority to walk around doing permit inspections.

He has delegated that authority to people who are trained to do it. Same with fire safety inspections, wellness checks, etc.
 
By your logic, the Mayor of Newark has the authority to personally engage in fire safety inspections...
Straw man. I have made no such claim.

And yes, if the Mayor gave false witness when trying to enter the facility and gained entry based on that false witness, then he was immediately trespassing as soon as he stepped foot on the property.
No, that's not how trespassing works.

We dont know what words were exchanged, we need to know.
Irrelevant. If the ICE officer opens the gate and admits a person, that person is an invitee. If the ICE officer doubts the representations made by someone seeking entry, the lawful procedure is to deny entry until the claim is perfected. If the ICE officer opens the door to allow entry for the purpose of ascertaining whether the entrant has a further right to remain, the officer may later revoke the license of the entrant, ask him to leave, and warn him that he is liable to a charge of trespassing if he remains. That does not transform the prior presence into a trespass.
 
I know he doesn't have the authority to walk around doing permit inspections.

He has delegated that authority to people who are trained to do it. Same with fire safety inspections, wellness checks, etc.

how do you know that?
 
I know he doesn't have the authority to walk around doing permit inspections.

He has delegated that authority to people who are trained to do it. Same with fire safety inspections, wellness checks, etc.
Delegated implies authority to do so. I am a manager and I delegate plenty to my direct reports, but that doesn't preclude me from being able to do those tasks myself.
 
I know he doesn't have the authority to walk around doing permit inspections.
Then you don't understand what the mayor of Newark's authority is. I cited the relevant statute, which you did not address.

He has delegated that authority to people who are trained to do it.
By doing so he does not abrogate his own authority.

Same with fire safety inspections, wellness checks, etc.
Straw man.
 

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