I can't see why they bother with the "Flight 93" conspiracy.

[T.A.M.]

100 tons of Flight 93 and its contents or a few scraps from the nearby scrapyard?

SO your entire theory, that Flight 93 never crashed in Shanksville, is based on a lack of photographic evidence to prove that 95% of the plane was recovered?

TAM

 

[RedIbis]

Red:

You are talking about multiple institutions here, who must be lying for your theory to be true. You have the FBI, the First Responders, The prosecutors in the Moussaoui Trial, Numerous others who all have to be lying.

So you are saying that the FBI, and the dozens of agents who worked at the Flight 93 site are lying? The first responders, lying? Don't answer, as it is rhetorical.

TAM

Evidence is required to prove the claim that Flight 93 crashed into the ditch. Where is the evidence? Where did the 95% end up? Can it be photographed? Was it incinerated? Where is it?

 

[T.A.M.]

1. Have you asked the people who were responsible?
2. If the answer to #1 is yes, then what did they say?
3. Just because you have not been privy to it, just because it is not available with a google search, does not mean it is not available or does not exist.

Starting points for your search... FBI, United Airlines.

TAM

 

[johnny karate]

Evidence is required to prove the claim that Flight 93 crashed into the ditch. Where is the evidence? Where did the 95% end up? Can it be photographed? Was it incinerated? Where is it?

Who cares. The crash and its wreckage are verified by numerous witnesses and first responders. None of these people have expressed the slightest doubt or suspicion that anything other than the crash of United 93 took place there.

Why is that not good enough for you?

 

[T.A.M.]

See here is the problem.

You say you want proof, but,

If the FBI provided you with a statement confirming the 95% figure, that would not be enough, you would want an itemized list.

If the FBi then provided you with a list of the parts they found (given the number of small parts and bits found it is unlikely this exists, but lets say it did), you would require photos.

If the FBi then provided sample photos of a good portion of the plane parts, you would either call them fake (the photos or the parts), and demand to see the actual parts yourself.

TAM

 

[R.Mackey]

So we should just take their word for it. And you call yourself a skeptic?

Yes, unless I have evidence to the contrary. I don't. And everything about the event meets our expectations. Even though without such evidnece I don't have to, I've nonetheless run a number of calculations and looked into ancillary evidence, including the FAA and air maintenance data, Mrs. McClatchey's famous photograph, conversations with the Boeing Commercial Division, etc. It all checks.

That's true skepticism. Denying the facts out of hand isn't. That's knee-jerk contrarianism.

We don't have the benefit of knowing how Flight 93 fit into the conspiracy. Can you say for sure what the terrorists were planning to do with the plane?

I have some pretty good ideas, given what they did with the other three and confessions of conspirators. I've argued with others whether the Capitol or the White House would be a better target, but it doesn't matter. One can be pretty sure they weren't just borrowing it to get to the jamboree.

At least you're honest. So far you have the word of the FBI that 95% of the plane and its contents were recovered. Yet, the available photographs don't even come close to accounting for that figure. In other words, you don't have much.

There are lots of things for which I have, but also require, no photographs.

This is why people bother researching yet another mystery in a whole series of mysteries.

Mysteries, sadly, that are of one's own making...

 

[Corsair 115]

Starting points for your search... FBI, United Airlines.

That's no good, TAM, because obviously those organizations are part of the conspiracy!

 

[DC]

if it makes sence or not if they shot it down or whatever happened to flight 93. it did for sure not crash in a 40° angle into the tiny crater we got presented as imprint.

 

[Corsair 115]

if it makes sence or not if they shot it down or whatever happened to flight 93. it did for sure not crash in a 40° angle into the tiny crater we got presented as imprint.

Let me guess—your "common sense" tells you that? Certainly it can't be your years and years of experience with the NTSB...

 

[Walter Ego]

Red, 95%+ of the aircraft and remains of most if not all passengers were recovered "from that ditch," OK? Just because the FBI doesn't give you a guided tour of the evidence doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Here's where the evidence is kept. I doubt if private citizens can have a look-see at it, though.

 

[DC]

Let me guess—your "common sense" tells you that? Certainly it can't be your years and years of experience with the NTSB...

you dont have to be a rocketscientist to see it.....

but im sure you belive David Copperfield is a real magican, cause you have no experiance as a magican......

 

[Undesired Walrus]

Might have something to do with the fact that Flight 93 never ended up in that ditch.

No.

Bob Blair was completing a routine drive to Shade Creek just after 10 a.m. Tuesday, when he saw a huge silver plane fly past him just above the treetops and crash into the woods along Lambertsville Road.

Blair, of Stoystown, a driver with Jim Barron Trucking of Somerset, was traveling in a coal truck along with Doug Miller of Somerset, when they saw the plane spiraling to the ground and then explode on the outskirts of Lambertsville.

“I saw the plane flying upside down overhead and crash into the nearby trees. My buddy, Doug, and I grabbed our fire extinguishers and ran to the scene,” said Blair.


"It was low enough, I thought you could probably count the rivets. You could see more of the roof of the plane than you could the belly. It was on its side. There was a great explosion and you could see the flames. It was a massive, massive explosion. Flames and then smoke and then a massive, massive mushroom cloud."


Then Peterson said he saw a fireball, heard an explosion and saw a mushroom cloud of smoke rise into the sky.

Peterson rushed to the scene on an all-terrain vehicle and when he arrived he saw bits and pieces of an airliner spread over a large area of an abandoned strip-mine in Stonycreek Township.

"There was a crater in the ground that was really burning," Peterson said. Strewn about were pieces of clothing hanging from trees and parts of the Boeing 757, but nothing bigger than a couple of feet long, he said. Many of the items were burning.

Wallace Miller, the lanky, Civil War-studying county coroner, did see it. He sat at the family funeral home, his father, Wilbur, with him. They watched the second plane sweep in low, from nowhere. They winced when it hit.

"Boy, how'd you like to be the coroner there?" the son said.

He could have been out of town, at a coroners convention in eastern Pennsylvania. His colleagues had gone early, to golf. But his game had slipped, so he stayed back.

His secretary called.

He couldn't believe the scene. He saw the burnt trees, and some debris smoking in the dirt. He saw half a window frame. He saw shreds of that white cloth they put over the headrests.

He saw things in the trees.

Miller said he had identified 12 of the victims through dental records and fingerprints.

Over the weekend, about 300 volunteers combed a half-mile square around the crash site and found enough debris from the Boeing 757 to fill about one-third of a trash container.

 

[Brainster]

They assert Flight 93 was shot down because:

1. It is probably the most commonly believed 9-11 conspiracy theory. I can't tell you how many people who think the Troofers are nuts believe this one, but it's a fair number.

2. Their whole gig is based on creating as much doubt in people's minds as to the "official" story. Why concede anything? Let's remember, these folks won't give up "nine of the hijackers are alive" or "none of the hijackers appeared on any flight manifest".

3. These people operate on the assumption that "If we can prove just one thing wrong, the whole house of cards will come tumbling down." After all, they've seen it week after week on CSI.

 

[DavidJames]

3. These people operate on the assumption that "If we can prove just one thing wrong, the whole house of cards will come tumbling down." After all, they've seen it week after week on CSI.

Related to this is that all the hijackings must be have some CT about them, if one doesn't that could undermines the rest.

 

[John Blonn]

One of my favorite aspects of the truth movement.

On one hand:

OMG NORAD stood down! No planes were sent to intercept! LOL CONSPIRACY!!

And on the other:

OMG the debris field reveals that the Air Force intercepted F93! LOL CONSPIRACY!!!!

 

[John Blonn]

I want to do an experiment here, if RedIbis would oblige.

Red, why do you believe that there were bodies discovered in the rubble of the towers?

 

[DC]

is there any evidence that they found bodys in the crater?

 

[KoihimeNakamura]

That isn't the point of the question.

 

[T.A.M.]

you dont have to be a rocketscientist to see it.....

but im sure you belive David Copperfield is a real magican, cause you have no experiance as a magican......

No, but being a crash investigator would help. And since none of the crash investigators had any issue with it, and no one else of the dozens on the scene had any issue with it, I'll take their word over yours.

TAM

 

[DC]

No, but being a crash investigator would help. And since none of the crash investigators had any issue with it, and no one else of the dozens on the scene had any issue with it, I'll take their word over yours.

TAM

yeah that doesnt involve thinking on your own thats the right way for you.