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Hydrogen Atom

Dancing David

Penultimate Amazing
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I am rereading Quantum Generations by Helge Kragh but I missed something in the history of particle physics.
What keeps an electron from touching the proton in a hydogen atom? I know there are reasons that they play medicine ball with the photons but I can't remember why they don't join together.

Pardon my ignorance.

Peace
 
In QM, particles are only allowed to have certain quantized energies. For the hydrogen atom, the lowest electron energy corresponds to a Bohr 'orbit' at some radius away from the proton/nucleus. So they can't interact.

Of course, the electron is not really a little planet going around in an orbit, because QM shows that it is really the wave function that shows the probability of finding an electron in a particular place. The ground-state wavefunction is not zero at the center of the atom so the electron and proton wavefunctions could 'overlap' [although I think the probability function is zero since the center has vanishingly small volume]

But the main problem is that there is no way for the electron and proton to interact. They can't just sit there 'stuck together' because that's not a possible solution to the QM equations -- the electron has to stay in orbit.

An interaction via the weak force is possible, but a bound electron in a hydrogen atom would not have enough energy for anything to happen. If you fire an electron at a proton with lots of energy, then the weak force can do something. The electron will interact with an up quark in the proton to produce a neutrino and a down quark. Hypothetically that would turn the proton into a neutron, but generally I think you have to use so much energy that it blows the nucleus apart and you get a shower of other particles, like in this experiment, where the knocked-out quark leads to a jet of particles.

Now that I think about it, with elements other than hydrogen, this sort of thing does happen. It's called electron capture. An unstable nucleus with 'too many protons' will capture one of its electrons, converting a proton into a neutron and releasing a neutrino. This is an effect of the weak nuclear force and not electromagnetic attraction.
 
May as well paste it here.......

Stimpson J. Cat said:
In the lowest energy state there is a nonvanishing probability of the electron being found arbitrarily close to the nucleus. But what does this mean?

We all have an intuitive idea of particles being little solid balls of matter, but this is not correct. The electron does not have any "size" as such. It is not meaningful to talk about it actually "striking" the nucleus. In fact, you could find it arbitrarily close to the nucleus, but then a short time later, back far away from it.

Your question seems to imply that you think that the electron should somehow be captured by the nucleus. The thing is that in order for this to happen, some sort of reaction between the electron and the nucleus must be possible. The simplest such reaction is for the electron and proton to combine to form a neutron, and omit a neutrino. The thing is that for stable nuclei, this reaction will not occur, because the total energy after the reaction is considerably more than before the reaction. It is possible for unstable nuclei, though. This is known as K capture.

Remember that in QM, it is not sufficient, or even necessary, for two particles to "touch" for a reaction to occur. In fact, it is not even really meaningful to talk about them touching. What is necessary is that a reaction be possible, and then the probability of such a reaction depends on the relative energy before and after the reaction, and the proximity of the wave-functions of the particles. This is why in QM, scientists refer to the "cross-section" of an interaction, rather than talking about "probabilities of hitting". The cross-section is in effect a direct measure of the likelihood of the reaction occurring.
 
From Azathoth's response:-
"Of course, the electron is not really a little planet going around in an orbit, because QM shows that it is really the wave function that shows the probability of finding an electron in a particular place."


Yes, but what does the word "really" mean here, really? I think the problem (and fascination) with comprehending QM is its total apparent mismatch with "reality", where "reality" is what we all deal with everyday: QM plays havoc with language, which is not built to handle the required functions.

I find Stimpy's comments to questions like this are very clear in their meaning. He manages to somehow avoid the vagueness and ambiguity that plagues non-mathematical descriptions of QM.
This is a rare and enviable ability.
 
I also already knew that the lectron would not touch the proton. I just like to use simple language.
Collapsing the wave function really stinks.

Peace
 

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