Holocaust Denial Videos

[Horatius]

I'll probably go see it tomorrow, and then hike on up to the Holocaust Musuem outside Chicago (in Skokie, in fact) and share your holocaust denial stories with the people that against all odds survived the death camps, and the WWII soldiers that liberated some of the camps.

Coolness! If you see any Illinois Nazis along the way, could you please run them off a bridge for me?

In any case, Havarti fun!

 

[headscratcher4]

Craptastick...nothing to add, just wanted to start a post with a C

 

[Dave Rogers]

Couldn't you have ended it with a cheese, like for example Red Leicester?

 

[dudalb]

What is it, lately? Not only have MAgZ and Mondial returned ,but new Holocaust Deniers are popping up here like flies.
Japanese Sage Derby.

 

[Budly]

The reason we're talking about Wiernik is he's the subject of episode 1. It's not me just picking a favorite fraudulent eyewitness. "Physical Evidence" happens to be a later chapter in the video.

 

[Horatius]

The reason we're talking about Wiernik is he's the subject of episode 1. It's not me just picking a favorite fraudulent eyewitness. "Physical Evidence" happens to be a later chapter in the video.

Could you explain who you are responding to with this comment? And please remember to end with a cheese, like gouda.

 

[headscratcher4]

Couldn't you have ended it with a cheese, like for example Red Leicester?

Kraft American Cheese food singles...

 

[The Big Dog]

Coolness! If you see any Illinois Nazis along the way, could you please run them off a bridge for me?

In any case, Havarti fun!

Certainly.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't the leader of the Illinois Nazis recently convicted of child molestation?

Brie, Roquefort, Pont-l'Évêque, Port Salut, Savoyard, Saint-Paulin, Carre-de-L'Est, Bresse-Bleu, Boursin

 

[Gravy]

The reason nobody can refute the video Buchenwald, is because they can't. Notice how Woolf and Nick Terry say they haven't seen it? Notice how no one at holocaustControversies or NIZKOR has ever rebutted anything in it? Notice how no poster here has commented on it?

With 5 pages of posts and 1800 views (though half are mine, LOL) people here have watched the videos. But when you start agreeing with holocaust denial positions, you keep quiet. It's taboo.

You really suck at this. Can't you find a hobby that you're good at, and that isn't an insult to rational, intelligent people?

Also, Cahill's Irish Porter.

 

[JimBenArm]

Core.
I don't know, Gravy. I think he's an excellent Holocaust denier. He just sucks at reality, that's all!
Bleu.

 

[woolfe99]

Christ on a bicycle!

Yankel Wiernik said:
Bodies burn like wood, but women's bodies burn better (due to fat eventhough everyone in the Warsaw ghetto was supposedly starving) and were thus used as kindling.

Wiernik says they added an accelerant to the female corpses (whether benzine or gasoline is irrelevant, both are accelerants). Why did denierbud not tell his viewers this?

Wiernek also says that in spite of the added accelerant, the burning did not work well at all and the procedure had to be abandoned. Does Denierbud tell his viewers this? Why not?

Incidentally, female bodies do have higher proportional fat content than do male bodies. This probably equalizes as you approach maximum emaciation, i.e. near to death by starvation, only.

That a naked woman leaped a 9 and a half foot high fence, grabbed a gun from a Ukrainian guard and shot two guards.

Have you (excuse me, I mean "Denierbud") checked the translation from the original text to make sure that in this case climb has not been mistranslated as leap?

That a Ukrainian guard shot him but the bullet went through his clothes but didn't pierce his skin, it just left a mark.

I'm afraid you have ignored Roberto's responses and simply pressed on with the original claim in the video. The original text actually says that the bullet "reflected" off his shoulder, not stopped at his shoulder. If you disagree, then go and find someone fluent in Polish and refute Roberto's claim.

The fact is, a bullet approaching a target at an oblique angle can reflect off the target. It is also pointed out that Wiernek mentions the gun jamming, which suggests it may have misfired.

It seems that even the nitpicks "Denierbud" has discovered in Wiernik don't carry much weight, even if a witness can be held to absolute accurate event perception and perfect memory or else be deemed entirely non-credible, which is a textbook example of the fallacy of the excluded middle.

I think you need to address the points in that blog directly rather than just repeating the claims in the video.

Cheddar.

- woolfe

 

[ElMondoHummus]

The reason we're talking about Wiernik is he's the subject of episode 1. It's not me just picking a favorite fraudulent eyewitness. "Physical Evidence" happens to be a later chapter in the video.

Criminey. It's not about any one witness being right or wrong, or the subject of a given episode of a video peddling fraudulent alt-history. The whole point is that you can't overturn history by merely picking apart isolated elements. Not when you don't consider the context that has been built over the years from the massive accumulation of evidence. That context provides shape and boundaries to the narrative, and those boundaries cannot be exceeded simply because an isolated issue is in dispute. That's the point Nick Terry was making: You separate out whole reams of accumulated knowledge in your minute focus on individual points. And without allowing those reams of accumulated knowledge to shape your understanding, conclusions drawn from that minute focus fade into irrelevancy. Yes, it's legitimate to begin criticism by discussing isolated issues, but that goes nowhere fast when they stay isolated.

That's the central failure you and other holocaust deniers make. It's the same failure 9/11 truthers and other conspiracy peddlers for other myths make: You all hone in on isolated points as if they overturn the entire narrative, yet you all to a man (or woman) fail to demonstrate how even a legitimate and accurate refutation of any given isolated point shapes context. You all merely state that an isolated refutation equals an overall refutation, and willingly leap to the conclusion that the entire narrative must be junked. That's sloppy reasoning.

Everyone here can see the emphasis on isolated points. But we see absolutely no explanation relating how those points impact the overall narrative, not anything built on more than mere "See, this is wrong, that means it's all wrong" implication.

Even what little you provide goes nowhere and does nothing. Given that, why are we supposed to watch those videos? If all they are are yet continued retailing of isolated facts and contextless points, then there's zero reason to view them. And if you cannot even establish in posts here that there is some legitimate analysis of the impact your claims have on the established narrative, then you fail to sell any of us on the notion that the video is worth watching.

Sell better. You're doing badly.


----

Oh, yeah: Holocaust revisionism is every bit as contrived and ill tasting as government cheese. And spins a narrative every bit as ersatz as "vegan cheese".

 

[Questioninggeller]

Most Holocaust deniers want to avoid that because it gets to the heart ofthe matter.

Himmler's October 4, 1943 Posen speech, another thing they want to avoid.

http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/h/himmler-heinrich/posen/oct-04-43/

 

[headscratcher4]

Custard. You know it is a faked recording don't you? The real trascript proves that Himmler was very worried about the ability of SS doctors to control outbreaks of Typhoid among millions of innocent women, and children, men, pows, etc. who just happened to be residing in SS health spas.

Mt. Tam

 

[Drudgewire]

Himmler's October 4, 1943 Posen speech, another thing they want to avoid.

http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/h/himmler-heinrich/posen/oct-04-43/

Crabapples. Way to break the rules.

 

[Questioninggeller]

Crabapples. Way to break the rules. [qimg]http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/colbert.gif[/qimg]

Well, I tried playing by Budly's "rules," but he never answered my questions, such as this one. He has repeatedly shown he's not interest in playing by his own rules.

 

[Drudgewire]

Well, I tried playing by Budly's "rules," but he never answered my questions, such as this one. He has repeatedly shown he's not interest in playing by his own rules.

Crooklyn. I meant this one.

 

[woolfe99]

Himmler's October 4, 1943 Posen speech, another thing they want to avoid.

Cripes. There are several other less well known, but equally incriminating, Himmler speeches. For example, here is a portion of the incriminating part of his speech of two days later, also in Posen:

I ask you that what I tell you in this circle you will really only hear and never talk about it. The question came up to us: What do to with the women and children? I decided to find a very clear solution also in this respect. This because I didnt consider myself entitled to exterminate the men that is, to kill them or to have them killed and to let the children grow up as avengers against our sons and grandsons. The difficult decision had to be taken to make this people disappear from the earth.

Here is a portion of another, delivered in Sonthafen to Wehrmacht generals on June 21, 1944. There is also a recording of this one available online. I cannot link anything here yet so anyone interested will have to google it.

It was necessary to resolve another big question. It was the most horrible task and the most awful assignment that any organization could receive: the solution of the Jewish question. I want to say a few words on the matter to this group with complete candor. It's good that we had the hardness to exterminate the Jews in our territory. Don't ask yourselves how difficult it would have been to carry out such an order, even though, as soldiers, I might say you would understand. But thinking critically as German soldiers, you can see that the order was essential. Because we wouldn't have been able to withstand the aerial bombing if we had had the Jews in our cities. I am also convinced we would not have been able to hold the Lemberg front of the Generalgouvernement if the big ghettos in Lemberg, Krakau, Lublin, and Warsaw had still been there. We cleaned out the last one, the big ghetto in Warsaw, in summer 1943. In Warsaw there were 500,000 Jews. I tell you this number confidentially. It took us five weeks of street fighting. Just the same, I want to answer a little question that surely you must have. The question is, of course you had to kill the adult Jews, I understand that, but how could you do the same to the women and children? So I have to tell you something: The children will be grown one day. Do we want to be so improper that we say, no, no, we're too weak to kill children. Our children can deal with them. Our children will fight that one out. But the Jewish hate, small today, will be big tomorrow, and the grown avengers will attack our children and grandchildren, who will then have to deal with them. I am convinced that this will be the case even if Adolf Hitler does not survive. No, we cannot shirk our responsibility. That would have been cowardly and therefore we adopted a clear solution to the problem as it was.

Here is Goebbels 10/9/43 diary entry, commenting on Himmler's speech at Posen:

As far as the Jewish question is concerned, he [Himmler] gives a very unvarnished and frank presentation. He is convinced that we can solve the Jewish question throughout Europe by the end of this year. He proposes the harshest and most radical solution: to exterminate the Jews root and branch [Kind und Kegel]. It is certainly a logical solution, even if it is a brutal one. We have to take the responsibility of completely solving this issue in our time. Later generations will certainly not handle this problem with the courage and the ardor that are ours.

- woolfe

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Christ on a pogo stick! Are we forgetting the cheese rule??

Fat Free Singles.

 

[headscratcher4]

Cry me a river.

Seriously, Woolfe, you know the denires answer for these is that they are faked. I'm not trying to be contentious, it is just that any "evidence" they don't like is faked.

9/11Investigator went on and on about how the Posnan speech was faked...it wasn't Himmler's voice on the recordings, why would Himmlar (secretive bugger that he was) allow a recording, a transcript, etc.

It is all so freakin' sad.

To me, the thing that I never understand is what the denires think was going on in those "transit" camps? Where were they transiting to? Why were innocent women and children involved? Why did populations have to transit it in first place.

I say this because they don't deny the camps...they exist. Too many people have seen them. So, they have to start by nibbling away at what happened in the camps. Somehow if they can get to "the deaths were really typhus and the fault of the allies and the german retreat" they can get away from the intense intentional evil of the matter.

But, I keep coming back to why the camps in the first place? If they didn't have the camps than people wouldn't have been dying in droves...regardless of whether gassed or just allowed to be worked to death or made sick through unsanitary conditions.

The holocaust is the camps. The evil of Nazism was the existence of camps for massive populations in the first place. Once you get to the fact that the camps existed and that people died -- lots of them even if you go by the denires figure of a couple of hundred thousand to a million (still a lot of people) -- it seems to me that you pretty well establish the evil of the German state, and the rest is a detail of history as Le Pen would have it.

I guess what I am saying if that if we allow the arguent to be fought over the parsing of witness statements, we lose the bigger picture of the evil...the camps themselves and their use to deny rights and humanity to the millions they put in the camps...regardless of whether they were gassed, shot, starved, worked to death, experiemented upon, etc.

And I've yet to see a denirer deny the existence of the camps.

I don't know, does this make any sense?

Feta with herbs.