Hillary Clinton is Done: part 2

[Belz...]

I'm going to have to agree with Ginger here, to an extent. Calling someone a screeching harpy (which I know you didn't do outright, but you sure made the comparison) is, IMO, rightfully seen as a sexist comment. I'm sure you didn't mean it as such, but that doesn't change it.

This is without doubt. Admit the sexism Argumemnon and move on.

You must be joking.

If I say that Donald Trump's pictures paint him as a mop-haired buffoon, does that make me sexist against men?

There is absolutely no justification for this accusation. I made a comment about how pictures represent a single individual. That this individual happens to be a woman doesn't make the comment sexist. Sexism is about how one sees one gender as inferior. It says a lot about Ginger and both of you, not me, that you would conclude that my comment amounts to sexism.

And this is the level of "reasoning" this forum has come to.

 

[lionking]

You must be joking.

If I say that Donald Trump's pictures paint him as a mop-haired buffoon, does that make me sexist against men?

There is absolutely no justification for this accusation. I made a comment about how pictures represent a single individual. That this individual happens to be a woman doesn't make the comment sexist. Sexism is about how one sees one gender as inferior. It says a lot about Ginger and both of you, not me, that you would conclude that my comment amounts to sexism.

And this is the level of "reasoning" this forum has come to.

Laughable. "Screeching harpy" is not a depiction of a woman's inferiority?

Own up, and move on. And don't use sexist terminology if you don't want to be judged by it.

 

[Belz...]

"Screeching harpy" is not a depiction of a woman's inferiority?

You guys are pulling my leg, right?

No, it has nothing to do with inferiority. Or women, in fact. It was about a single woman, and about her pictures at that. Every picture I've seen of her during the campaign has her with this big evil grin. I don't understand why no one seems to be able to find a picture of her that doesn't make her look crazy, as I'm sure those pictures are lying around. Hell, I don't even dislike her.

And again, when I call men dicks or idiots or fat blobs or whatever, is that sexist? Or is it only sexist if women do it? How does that work? You don't even seem to know what sexism is.

You must be joking; taking a stab at the social justice buffoons who see sexism everywhere, to the point where no one can criticise a woman. Right?

I mean, people keep calling her a liar and dishonest and the worst thing since polio, and no one called them sexists. Assuming you're serious, which you're not, explain how it's sexist.

don't use sexist terminology if you don't want to be judged by it.

Oh, there's a sexist terminology, now?

 

[lionking]

You guys are pulling my leg, right?

No, it has nothing to do with inferiority. Or women, in fact. It was about a single woman, and about her pictures at that. Every picture I've seen of her during the campaign has her with this big evil grin. I don't understand why no one seems to be able to find a picture of her that doesn't make her look crazy, as I'm sure those pictures are lying around. Hell, I don't even dislike her.

And again, when I call men dicks or idiots or fat blobs or whatever, is that sexist? Or is it only sexist if women do it? How does that work? You don't even seem to know what sexism is.

You must be joking; taking a stab at the social justice buffoons who see sexism everywhere, to the point where no one can criticise a woman. Right?



Oh, there's a sexist terminology, now?

Precious. I'm now a social justice buffoon.

You are judged by your words. "Screeching harpy" is sexist. Deal with it.

 

[Belz...]

You are judged by your words. "Screeching harpy" is sexist. Deal with it.

I will not. Demonstrate that it's sexist. The claim is ridiculous on its face.

For those of you who are impaired, here's my original comment:

It's really hard to find a picture of her in which she doesn't look like a screeching harpy, isn't it?

Emphasis added. I made a similar comment on the BBC twitter feed because I was under the impression that they were deliberately posting the worst possible pictures of her, presumably because they found her unpalatable as a candidate. The point of my comment here is the same, but fine, I can see why someone could misconstrue it as being about her, specifically.

But even if it were, it's not as if I said "Huh, just another screeching harpy, like all women" which, sure, could been seen as sexist even if, somehow, it wasn't intended as such. But saying that a woman is a harpy or a witch or that a man is a dick or an ogre has nothing to do with the inferiority of their gender or even about their gender at all. So you'll forgive me if I ask you to demonstrate your claim.

Otherwise, I'll assume that you are, in fact, joking, because no one could possibly say something this stupid and be serious about it.

 

[uke2se]

You must be joking.

If I say that Donald Trump's pictures paint him as a mop-haired buffoon, does that make me sexist against men?

No. It's not just about the gender of the person you insulted. It's about the language you used.

There is absolutely no justification for this accusation. I made a comment about how pictures represent a single individual. That this individual happens to be a woman doesn't make the comment sexist. Sexism is about how one sees one gender as inferior. It says a lot about Ginger and both of you, not me, that you would conclude that my comment amounts to sexism.

And this is the level of "reasoning" this forum has come to.

I think you need to think a bit more about what makes something sexist.

 

[uke2se]

Every picture I've seen of her during the campaign has her with this big evil grin. I don't understand why no one seems to be able to find a picture of her that doesn't make her look crazy, as I'm sure those pictures are lying around. Hell, I don't even dislike her.

Rest snipped for clarity

If you had said this instead of "screeching harpy", nobody could reasonably call your statement sexist. However, you didn't.

 

[Belz...]

No. It's not just about the gender of the person you insulted. It's about the language you used.



I think you need to think a bit more about what makes something sexist.

How about you make the case for it, because I don't see it. Please contrast it with calling Trump a "filthy pig".

 

[lionking]

I will not. Demonstrate that it's sexist. The claim is ridiculous on its face.

For those of you who are impaired, here's my original comment:



Emphasis added. I made a similar comment on the BBC twitter feed because I was under the impression that they were deliberately posting the worst possible pictures of her, presumably because they found her unpalatable as a candidate. The point of my comment here is the same, but fine, I can see why someone could misconstrue it as being about her, specifically.

But even if it were, it's not as if I said "Huh, just another screeching harpy, like all women" which, sure, could been seen as sexist even if, somehow, it wasn't intended as such. But saying that a woman is a harpy or a witch or that a man is a dick or an ogre has nothing to do with the inferiority of their gender or even about their gender at all. So you'll forgive me if I ask you to demonstrate your claim.

Otherwise, I'll assume that you are, in fact, joking, because no one could possibly say something this stupid and be serious about it.

Attempted, and unconvincing, evasion noted.

There is a barely undisguised undercurrent of sexism in much of the criticism of Clinton. Some camouflaged, some, like your "screeching harpy" post, not so much.

Admit the sexist description and move on. Or not.

I should add that you are not the worst user of sexist descriptors in this thread, but I would have expected you to acknowledge it.

 

[uke2se]

How about you make the case for it, because I don't see it. Please contrast it with calling Trump a "filthy pig".

Harpy is historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against women. Pig is not historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against men.

 

[lionking]

Harpy is historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against women. Pig is not historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against men.

Exactly.

I can hardly think of a more sexist description of a woman than "screeching harpy". Argumemnon, acknowledge your slight and move on.

 

[Belz...]

There is a barely undisguised undercurrent of sexism in much of the criticism of Clinton.

I'm sure you think so, given that you immediately jumped to that conclusion.

Much of the criticism of Clinton I've seen, right or wrong, has to do with her track record and her honesty. I'm sure there are some sexists in there, but frankly I haven't seen much of it.

Exactly.

I can hardly think of a more sexist description of a woman than "screeching harpy". Argumemnon, acknowledge your slight and move on.

Bow down to the one true god and ask for forgiveness. Admit your sin.

No.

 

[Belz...]

Harpy is historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against women. Pig is not historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against men.

That's it?

A harpy is a female mythological creature. It's hard to imagine calling a man one unless they were visibly effeminate.

And second, yes, "pig" is historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against men. Ever heard of "all men are pigs"?

Come on.

 

[uke2se]

That's it?

A harpy is a female mythological creature. It's hard to imagine calling a man one unless they were visibly effeminate.

Precisely.

And second, yes, "pig" is historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against men. Ever heard of "all men are pigs"?

Come on.

I've heard the expression. However, the fact that the expression "all men are pigs" exists doesn't mean 'pig' is an insult almost exclusively against men.

That said, I believe you are just playing games right now. I don't believe for a second you don't realize all this yourself.

 

[lionking]

That's it?

A harpy is a female mythological creature. It's hard to imagine calling a man one unless they were visibly effeminate.

And second, yes, "pig" is historically a pejorative used almost exclusively against men. Ever heard of "all men are pigs"?

Come on.

That's it?

I note you ignored the use of "screeching". Why was that I wonder?

I'm not saying you are sexist, simply that you used a sexist sledge. It's a lot easier to admit it than tie yourself in knots trying to defend the indefensible.

And, closer to the topic, Clinton to win the presidency in a landslide.

 

[Belz...]

I've heard the expression. However, the fact that the expression "all men are pigs" exists doesn't mean 'pig' is an insult almost exclusively against men.

It doesn't mean it, but it IS an insult almost exclusively against men.

That said, I believe you are just playing games right now. I don't believe for a second you don't realize all this yourself.

Oh, so now I'm a sexist AND a liar. This keeps getting better and better. What is it with this forum and us immediately accusing people of dishonesty when they don't immediately see our point of view? Was it always like this and I didn't notice? Or is it a recent development?

No, I honestly disagree with you, and find your point of view laughable. You're just going to have to deal with that, I guess.

I note you ignored the use of "screeching". Why was that I wonder?

Because it goes well with "harpy", which, I gather, screeched.

Clinton to win the presidency in a landslide.

Probably.

 

[uke2se]

It doesn't mean it, but it IS an insult almost exclusively against men.

I disagree completely, and I don't think you are serious when proposing this.

Oh, so now I'm a sexist AND a liar. This keeps getting better and better. What is it with this forum and us immediately accusing people of dishonesty when they don't immediately see our point of view? Was it always like this and I didn't notice? Or is it a recent development?

No, I honestly disagree with you, and find your point of view laughable. You're just going to have to deal with that, I guess.

I don't believe you, as this is so obvious. I don't think you are a liar. I think you're having a laugh. Trolling, as it were.

That said, if I were to assume that you are completely serious in that you cannot understand how the word 'harpy' when used to insult a woman can be considered sexist, would you at least acknowledge that it isn't unreasonable to consider the word 'harpy' sexist when used to insult a woman, given what you have had explained to you?

 

[lionking]

I

Because it goes well with "harpy", which, I gather, screeched.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harpy

No You guess wrong.

The word "screeching" is a sexist prefix. Originated by Shakespeare, no stranger to sexist descriptions.

 

[Belz...]

I disagree completely, and I don't think you are serious when proposing this.

Dead serious. I can't believe you're not aware of this. And, ironically, you seem to be ignoring male-specific insults and only focusing on female-specific ones. That is, in my book, actual sexism.

I don't believe you, as this is so obvious.

As you should have learned by now on this forum, just because you believe something doesn't make it true or obvious for everyone else.

I don't think you are a liar. I think you're having a laugh. Trolling, as it were.

You are wrong.

That said, if I were to assume that you are completely serious in that you cannot understand how the word 'harpy' when used to insult a woman can be considered sexist, would you at least acknowledge that it isn't unreasonable to consider the word 'harpy' sexist when used to insult a woman, given what you have had explained to you?

Only if one twists the definition of the word "sexist" to mean something entirely different. Using a gender-specfiic insult towards a person of that gender isn't what sexism is.

The word "screeching" is a sexist prefix.

Yeah because no male could ever have a screechy voice, and saying it demeans all women.

 

[Mike!]

It's good to know two full pages can be devoted to debating whether or not Hillary Clinton can be accurately described as a "Screeching Harpy", or not.
Personally, I'm on the pro side, but I may be among the minority on that subject.