Herman Cain leads by 20 points!

[12AX7]

The Taliban wing of the GOP is simply running down the list of people they can turn to instead of Romney.

In the beginning, they turned to Bachmann. At first, it was difficult to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron. As she got more press coverage, it became impossible to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron.

So they turned to Perry. He managed to lose the "old, cranky, & white" vote in a masterful 1-2 punch of calling Social Security a "Ponzi Scheme" and only supporting mildly draconian policies with regard to undocumented immigrants.

With Palin, Huckabee, and Christie (again) out of the race, they're turning to Cain. Once the lunatic fringe clues into the fact that Cain makes Bachmann seem almost electable, they'll run to Santorum. At that point I think they'll figure out that it's all over.

Exactly.

Though, it is fun to watch the "anybody but Obama" crowd carry the water of the latest GOP whacko.

Good times.

 

[Dancing David]

Nor DeGaulle. Nor Patton.
Can you imagine a staff meeting with Monty, CDG, and Patton? You'd have to hold it on a football pitch to fit all their egos.

And meanwhile the war ground on led by some great tacticians who did not grandstand, this guy Mark_W._Clark^WP got stuck with the politically driven but difficult Italy campaign, and he also made the decision to take rome, which allowed a german army to get away, but was great political asset.

 

[Dancing David]

If I were a Republican, I would not be proud of Herman Cain leading any poll by 20 points, in fact, I wouldn't be proud of any of the candidates the GOP has in the race right now.

Perhaps that's why they keep wanting the new and improved GOP candidate to join in?

Huntsman is not that bad, not someone I would pick myself. But i also voted for Jim Edgar as gubernor of illinois over that pig Neil Hartigan

 

[Dancing David]

BO now has a proven failed track record of leadership.

I disagree, much has been done, much has gotten blocked or sidetracked (some by his own party), what definition of leadership are you using?

I am curious in what ways you think he has failed, I never expected the Dems to match step with him, being the party leader is not what I think of as crucial for the POTUS. I think he has done about as well as you would expect with a HoR that opposes him.

So where are you thinking he has failed?

 

[Dancing David]

True but it's up to the president to fix the system. He's failed.

Um really? The POTUS needs to work with the HoR and the Senate, do they not, within the constraints of the SCOTUS and the COTUS.

So what are you talking about, Imperial Presidency? When did the system became a unitary executive with no legislature?

 

[Drachasor]

Appeal to emotion noted. They buy stuff, they have to pay the tax. They have income, they have to pay the tax.

It's an appeal to reality. I am not appealing to your emotions. I am asking if you want to live in a society like that. They can't afford to pay for the government programs they get. That's a fact. If they could, there wouldn't need to be assistance programs to begin with, since they could pay their own way.

Now, perhaps you are fine with those people suffering and in some cases dying. If so, then I can certainly see why the 999 plan wouldn't bother you.

So says the communists and liberals. It's totally fair. Those that consume more and earn more, pay more. Everyone pays the same percentage.

As income varies, what money is spent on varies a great deal and how much money in particular is spent on survival varies a great deal. There's a tremendous difference between how someone with 20,000 dollars a year spends their money and how someone with 1,00,000 dollars a year spends theirs. There's also a tremendous difference between the percentage of taxes they can afford.

True but it's up to the president to fix the system. He's failed.

Straw Man. The President can't fix anything by himself. No President can. Congress has to do most of the work.

 

[leftysergeant]

But of course, after you've been proven wrong, just shift the goalposts! Now the important criteria for being the president is having "insight on how people feel". What every happened to leading people and understanding economics, both which Cain has and BO doesn't?

The duty of the POTUS is to make life as secure and bearable as possible for EVERYBODY.

It is NOT to make sure that some meaner-than-a-pit-bull CEO makes 500X what the peons in the kitchen make.

Did you notice that part about government existing to "ensure domestic tranquility?" Do we need a greedy old putz so abusing the working classes that they feel they must rise up and kill and eat the rich to keep from starving?

 

[Corsair 115]

Not that it'd matter to you, like lots of those on this forum, you don't live in the USA.

And it is that point which gives us a position from which to more objectively analyze American politics. You're trapped in the middle of it, we're standing outside of it, looking in.

 

[Ladewig]

Looking up Cain's 9-9-9 plan, I see that it is a flat 9% personal income tax, a 9% flat corporate tax and a 9% national sales tax; in all of these, no exceptions, no deductions.

That's just Phase I. Cain's website http://www.hermancain.com/999plan explains that 999 is temporary and eventually the individual and corporate taxes will be eliminated leaving only the sales tax (Phase II).

 

[leftysergeant]

That's just Phase I. Cain's website http://www.hermancain.com/999plan explains that 999 is temporary and eventually the individual and corporate taxes will be eliminated leaving only the sales tax (Phase II).

Which, in effect, means "tax the poor." The poor spend nearly everything they earn to stay alive and sheltered in less-than-utterly-squalid conditions. The upper investor class spends a lot of it buying congress critters and gobbling up competition.

I like the income tax. It goes away when your job does. The sales tax doesn't.

This is what I mean about that blithering twit's inability to emphathize with actual people, thuis to actually lead people, rather than to be a dictator in the way that a CEO is.

 

[Drachasor]

Which, in effect, means "tax the poor." The poor spend nearly everything they earn to stay alive and sheltered in less-than-utterly-squalid conditions. The upper investor class spends a lot of it buying congress critters and gobbling up competition.

I like the income tax. It goes away when your job does. The sales tax doesn't.

This is what I mean about that blithering twit's inability to emphathize with actual people, thuis to actually lead people, rather than to be a dictator in the way that a CEO is.

Just so, and he has the audacity to call it a "Fair Tax". If anything, we should be working on eliminating all sales tax at all levels (local, state, etc). That's an economy booster and it helps out people that need it most.

I almost wish he could win the nomination. There's no way his plans would win over the majority of Americans, especially when someone asks him what programs are going to get cut (because of course he doesn't talk about the fact he'd have to axe most of the federal government).

Like I've said before, he's another "don't tax, do spend" Republican.

Edit: Oh, I guess he actually wants to eliminate Social Security, Medicare, and other things. He believes charity will cover people...you know, just like it did before when they were dying in the streets.

 

[Regnad Kcin]

...True but it's up to the president to fix the system. He's failed.

"Up to the president to fix the system."

Comedy gold.

 

[MattusMaximus]

He's the latest "Anyone but Romney." In the end, it will be Romney.

Boy, I certainly hope so. I want Obama to win re-election, but if he doesn't, I'd rather have Romney than any of the other morons on the Republican side.

I give Cain about a month before he also starts to fade in the polls. Just give it some time for people to start digging into his past...

 

[MattusMaximus]

The Taliban wing of the GOP is simply running down the list of people they can turn to instead of Romney.

In the beginning, they turned to Bachmann. At first, it was difficult to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron. As she got more press coverage, it became impossible to ignore the fact that she was a raving moron.

So they turned to Perry. He managed to lose the "old, cranky, & white" vote in a masterful 1-2 punch of calling Social Security a "Ponzi Scheme" and only supporting mildly draconian policies with regard to undocumented immigrants.

With Palin, Huckabee, and Christie (again) out of the race, they're turning to Cain. Once the lunatic fringe clues into the fact that Cain makes Bachmann seem almost electable, they'll run to Santorum. At that point I think they'll figure out that it's all over.

No, no... there's still Gingrich and - dare I say it? - Ron Paul

 

[Neally]

I disagree, much has been done, much has gotten blocked or sidetracked (some by his own party), what definition of leadership are you using?

The one from Wikipedia works for me: “process of social influence in which one person can enlist the aid and support of others in the accomplishment of a common task".

Unlike other presidents of both parties that have been successful in getting their and the opposing party to come together to achieve the goals, BO has been a miserable leadership failure.

I am curious in what ways you think he has failed, I never expected the Dems to match step with him, being the party leader is not what I think of as crucial for the POTUS. I think he has done about as well as you would expect with a HoR that opposes him.

He started out with failing to put together any kind of significant health care reform, just let the entire process degrade into a bureaucratic mess, then used up all his political capital to get Obamacare passed.

So where are you thinking he has failed?

See the above, and his approval rating shows that plenty of others feel the same.

Um really? The POTUS needs to work with the HoR and the Senate, do they not, within the constraints of the SCOTUS and the COTUS.

Sure, and some presidents actually had the leadership skills to make that happen. BO does not.

It is NOT to make sure that some meaner-than-a-pit-bull CEO makes 500X what the peons in the kitchen make.

Right, that's what Cains career totally consisted of...

Did you notice that part about government existing to "ensure domestic tranquility?" Do we need a greedy old putz so abusing the working classes that they feel they must rise up and kill and eat the rich to keep from starving?

 

[Drachasor]

He started out with failing to put together any kind of significant health care reform, just let the entire process degrade into a bureaucratic mess, then used up all his political capital to get Obamacare passed.

The changes ARE significant, but they are certainly inadequate as well. What would you have liked to see? Medicare for all with medicare reforms (such as negotiated drug pricing)? The public option? Both of those had majority support by the populace.

What exactly is your problem with "Obamacare?" The measure Republicans proposed or something else?

Ideally we'd have a national health care system like all other first world countries, but that was perhaps impossible.

 

[SKEPTICALSHAM]

Can the Republican Party be saved from itself?

 

[bikerdruid]

Can the Republican Party be saved from itself?

hopefully not.

 

[mhaze]

That's kind of the point. He proposes a tax system that won't raise enough revenue ....

Wrong. Took about 30 seconds to think that out.

Want to try again?

By the way, here's the actual details of his "999" scheme from their website.


Phase 1 - 9-9-9

• Current circumstances call for bolder action.
• The Phase 1 Enhanced Plan incorporates the features of Phase One and gets us a step closer to Phase two.
• I call on the Super Committee to pass the Phase 1 Enhanced Plan along with their spending cut package.
• The Phase 1 Enhanced Plan unites Flat Tax supporters with Fair tax supporters.
• Achieves the broadest possible tax base along with the lowest possible rate of 9%.
• It ends the Payroll Tax completely – a permanent holiday!
• Zero capital gains tax
• Ends the Death Tax.
• Eliminates double taxation of dividends
• Business Flat Tax – 9%
  • Gross income less all investments, all purchases from other businesses and all dividends paid to shareholders.
  • Empowerment Zones will offer additional deductions for payroll employed in the zone.
• Individual Flat Tax – 9%.
  • Gross income less charitable deductions.
  • Empowerment Zones will offer additional deductions for those living and/or working in the zone.
• National Sales Tax – 9%.
  • This gets the Fair Tax off the sidelines and into the game.

Phase 2 – The Fair Tax

• Amidst a backdrop of the economic boom created by the Phase 1 Enhanced Plan, I will begin the process of educating the American people on the benefits of continuing the next step to the Fair Tax.
• The Fair Tax would ultimately replace individual and corporate income taxes.
• It would make it possible to end the IRS as we know it.
• The Fair Tax makes our exported goods and services the most competitively internationally than any other tax system.

Phase 1 Enhanced Plan – Summary

• Unites all tax payers so we all pay income taxes and no one pays payroll taxes
• Provides the least incentive to evade taxes and the fewest opportunities to do so
• Lifts a $430 billion dead-weight burden on the economy due to compliance, enforcement, collection, etc.
• Is fair, neutral, transparent, and efficient
• Ends nearly all deductions and special interest favors
• Ends all payroll taxes
• Ends the Death Tax
• Features zero tax on capital gains and repatriated profits
• Lowest marginal rates on production
• Allows immediate expensing of business investments
• Eliminates double taxation of dividends
• Increases capital formation. Capital per worker drives productivity and wage growth
• Capital formation will aid capital availability for small businesses
• Features a platform to launch properly structured Empowerment Zones to revitalize our inner cities
• We all know the Fed has tripled the money supply since 2008. They have been printing money out of thin air to finance the Obama spending machine. While true Fed reform that restores sound money may have to wait for my election, the best thing we can do now is to pursue policies that increase the DEMAND for dollars to help mitigate the risks associated with the increase in the supply.
• Pro-growth economic policies equal a strong dollar policy

 

[mhaze]

when the beaver sleeps beside the elephant, every movement of the elephant is important.

I find it difficult to argue with that one.