Heeeeeeere's Obamacare!

[Fudbucker]

Some of the things that Gruber was talking about, like the free money that Massachusetts received, could be excised from the bill without destroying the rest of it...

Sure, you can excise the parts that were added to be deliberately confusing (I don't know if the ACA survives that, but I haven't read the whole thing.).

But I am very troubled over an administration that thinks they have to fool a "stupid" public into supporting something. The whole WMD in Iraq business left a really sour taste in my mouth, and I'm not even sure that was a deliberate lie or just incompetency.

Listening to Gruber, it sounds like they made the ACA deliberately confusing to mislead people. THAT is not Kosher. Which is why I want an investigation into the drafting of the law.

 

[Kestrel]

It's time for a classic line from John Godfrey Saxe:

Laws, like sausages, cease to inspire respect in proportion as we know how they are made.

 

[maxpower1227]

I wondered how long it would take before someone would actually try to justify Gruber embarrassing quote by agreeing with it. You win! Now please elaborate on how and why the public was so stupid to elect all those new GOP candidates in this last election and compare and contrast this with how the public was so stupid to elect BO twice.

If Romney hadn't been caught on video openly disparaging half the population of the country, he might well have been elected. The same goes for troglodytes like Todd Akin and Richard Murdock. The fact that the electorate can correctly identify a raving lunatic when given a sound byte is no real indication of intelligence.

But yeah, re-electing a president with a fairly decent record and a horrible opponent is JUST as stupid as electing the exorcist guy in Colorado.

 

[Kestrel]

The right wingers are chanting Gruber like they used to chant Benghazi. As if people were not aware that the individual insurance mandate would impose a cost on some Americans.

The mandate was debated extensively while the PPACA was still under consideration. The mandate and the penalties for noncompliance survived a Supreme Court challenge. It has been in effect since the beginning of this year. The mandate in Massachusetts has been around even longer.

 

[DDWW]

Trick them HOW? Can you answer this simple question? What part of the law was made confusing to you, especially the part that would involve the CBO? Also, Gruber wasn't involved in the writing of the law, at all. So really, this is silly.

Plus I only saw this story about Gruber on Fox. The major other networks had nothing on this story when it broke. So only one of two conclusions can be made.

1. It is not true as Fox lies.

2. It is just another made up Republican scandal.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

As if people were not aware that the individual insurance mandate would impose a cost on some Americans.

Way to totally miss the point.

The part that galls is the elitist condescension regarding the stupidity of the American populace.

But you're on record as saying "Gruber is right".

Stupid, stupid Americans.

You must be proud to rank so high above them.

 

[Kestrel]

Way to totally miss the point.

The part that galls is the elitist condescension regarding the stupidity of the American populace.

But you're on record as saying "Gruber is right".

Stupid, stupid Anericans.

You must be proud to rank so high above them.

Technical experts sometimes say things that are politically incorrect. This isn't a big *********** deal to anyone outside of the right wing echo chamber.

 

[Unabogie]

Plus I only saw this story about Gruber on Fox. The major other networks had nothing on this story when it broke. So only one of two conclusions can be made.

1. It is not true as Fox lies.

2. It is just another made up Republican scandal.

It's not only on Fox, but of course Fox is hyping it up with wall to wall coverage of something some economist said about a law he didn't write. He was a consultant on it who came with expertise from when the ACA was the Republican plan. That he said some course things has nothing to do with the actual staffers who wrote the law's language. He's not a lawyer, remember, he's an economist. His expertise is in crunching numbers and explaining policy. So yes, it's a made up scandal, since there's no actual news here. The pieces of the law were always public and there are no surprises being unearthed. In fact, the law is working well. Check out this bit of news.

http://www.reuters.com/video/2014/09/26/swartz-aca-health-premiums-look-stable-h?videoId=344653716

The rates for 2015 will on average remain stable across the country. That's actually amazing when you consider that insurance rates have been climbing like crazy up to now. So of course the GOP will be looking for a fake scandal to shout down good news like this. Me? I'm looking forward to my family's continued coverage since prior to the ACA my wife could not get coverage at any price from an insurance company.

 

[DDWW]

It's not only on Fox, but of course Fox is hyping it up with wall to wall coverage of something some economist said about a law he didn't write. He was a consultant on it who came with expertise from when the ACA was the Republican plan. That he said some course things has nothing to do with the actual staffers who wrote the law's language. He's not a lawyer, remember, he's an economist. His expertise is in crunching numbers and explaining policy. So yes, it's a made up scandal, since there's no actual news here. The pieces of the law were always public and there are no surprises being unearthed. In fact, the law is working well. Check out this bit of news.

http://www.reuters.com/video/2014/09/26/swartz-aca-health-premiums-look-stable-h?videoId=344653716

The rates for 2015 will on average remain stable across the country. That's actually amazing when you consider that insurance rates have been climbing like crazy up to now. So of course the GOP will be looking for a fake scandal to shout down good news like this. Me? I'm looking forward to my family's continued coverage since prior to the ACA my wife could not get coverage at any price from an insurance company.

Nice spin. Never said anything about the law not working. Me, I'm glad there is a alternative network that will report on things like this that the other networks will run from and not offend their liberal friends.

 

[ehcks]

Way to totally miss the point.

The part that galls is the elitist condescension regarding the stupidity of the American populace.

But you're on record as saying "Gruber is right".

Stupid, stupid Americans.

You must be proud to rank so high above them.

The individual mandate had to be called a mandate because if it was called a tax, people would vote against it. Taxes are evil. Taxes are theft. NO NEW TAXES! RABBLE RABBLE WHARRGARBLE!

Yes, American voters are stupid.

 

[sunmaster14]

Wait a minute. You are saying the law was available online for a year before it was passed?

Yep.

Amazing, given that the Senate bill didn't even come out of committee until 5 months before the PPACA passed, and significant changes were made to it in the runup to the cloture vote in the Senate three months before it was eventually passed, and there was a significant amendment bill passed through the reconcilation process which was hashed out in the same month that it passed. Does Nancy Pelosi have a Tardis? I guess that would explain why she perpetually has a look of surprise on her face.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

Yes, American voters are stupid.

Present company excepted, I would hope!

To paraphrase Shakespeare...

"All the world is stupid, 'cept me and thee.
And sometimes I think thou art a little dumb!"

 

[ehcks]

Present company excepted, I would hope!

To paraphrase Shakespeare...

"All the world is stupid, 'cept me and thee.
And sometimes I think thou art a little dumb!"

I'm not sure who you're referring to. I am most certainly stupid. I hope you're not that arrogant.

 

[DavidJames]

Plus I only saw this story about Gruber on Fox. The major other networks had nothing on this story when it broke. So only one of two conclusions can be made.

1. It is not true as Fox lies.

Sometimes, other times they exaggerate.

2. It is just another made up Republican scandal.

Yup, just as the facts have proven out their hyping of Benghazi was utter crap. The problem is the faithful don't care about crap, the lap up the Fox drivel like kittens to milk.

 

[twinstead]

For the sake of argument, if ever "Obamacare" were to be repealed, what would happen to everybody who signed up for it?

 

[Unabogie]

Amazing, given that the Senate bill didn't even come out of committee until 5 months before the PPACA passed, and significant changes were made to it in the runup to the cloture vote in the Senate three months before it was eventually passed, and there was a significant amendment bill passed through the reconcilation process which was hashed out in the same month that it passed. Does Nancy Pelosi have a Tardis? I guess that would explain why she perpetually has a look of surprise on her face.

"Significant changes"? Like what?

 

[Fast Eddie B]

I hope you're not that arrogant.

Nope - just trying to inject a touch of humor!

 

[DDWW]

Sometimes, other times they exaggerate.
Yup, just as the facts have proven out their hyping of Benghazi was utter crap. The problem is the faithful don't care about crap, the lap up the Fox drivel like kittens to milk.

I don't think the deaths of 4 Americans is "utter crap" . If you don't care why it happen then watch MSNBC. They will not follow up on any miscues by this administration , plus they could use the ratings.

 

[Bogative]

It's not only on Fox, but of course Fox is hyping it up with wall to wall coverage of something some economist said about a law he didn't write.

Some economist? Jonathan Gruber, MIT, is not just "some economist." He's the man the White House hired for $400,000 to consult on the ACA, he's the man the White House loaned to Congress to help write the bill, he's the man Harry Reid called "the most respected economist of our time" and he's the man Nancy Pelosi whose name she was willing to drop as some type of guru whenever she wanted to tout the ACA.

I see you're back to saying he didn't write the bill. I've already provided the link where he says he helped write the bill.

He was a consultant on it who came with expertise from when the ACA was the Republican plan.

More evidence that he was an expert on healthcare and not just "some economist."

That he said some course things has nothing to do with the actual staffers who wrote the law's language.

You may consider him saying that the bill was written to deceive Congress, the CBO and the American people course, but I don't. I would consider it damning.

He's not a lawyer, remember, he's an economist. His expertise is in crunching numbers and explaining policy.

Yes, he's one of "the most respected economists of our time" and he understands the healthcare plan better than anyone else (so he tells us). When he tells 6 different audiences that the healthcare bill was written to deceive people, I'm going to listen.

Your attempt to downplay the significance of Jonathan Gruber, MIT, and the role he played with this bill is laughable.

 

[Fudbucker]

Some economist? Jonathan Gruber, MIT, is not just "some economist." He's the man the White House hired for $400,000 to consult on the ACA, he's the man the White House loaned to Congress to help write the bill, he's the man Harry Reid called "the most respected economist of our time" and he's the man Nancy Pelosi whose name she was willing to drop as some type of guru whenever she wanted to tout the ACA.

I see you're back to saying he didn't write the bill. I've already provided the link where he says he helped write the bill.


More evidence that he was an expert on healthcare and not just "some economist."


You may consider him saying that the bill was written to deceive Congress, the CBO and the American people course, but I don't. I would consider it damning.


Yes, he's one of "the most respected economists of our time" and he understands the healthcare plan better than anyone else (so he tells us). When he tells 6 different audiences that the healthcare bill was written to deceive people, I'm going to listen.

Your attempt to downplay the significance of Jonathan Gruber, MIT, and the role he played with this bill is laughable.

I think this is going to become a major headache for Obama. Most GOP "outrage" is laughably ginned up nonsense (Benghazi, Fast and Furious), but this one bugs me, and I'm sure I'm not alone.