have they found anything?

[JoeTheJuggler]

ID is a evolution of this fact whose sole purpose is to make the babble relevant for the 21st century.

I agree with you there! Only I wouldn't use the term "evolution" but rather words like "disingenuous subterfuge" or "lie in an attempt to disguise religion as science."

Also, I think they're about to move on to the next deceitful term: Fine-Tuner.

The courts have in turn rejected as religion Creationism, Creation Science, and Intelligent Design when they've tried to use these as terms to get their religious views taught in public school science classes. I predict they'll use F-T next.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Would intelligent aliens be saved by Jesus Christ?

Are there more than 3 persons in the Trinity? (That is, did God make the same mistake with other planets and need to incarnate himself as a savior there too?)

For that matter, did God intervene to deliver the same 10 Commandments elsewhere?

Is eating snagglegefleezers kosher? Even if you gather them during the double full moons?

The big one--that I've already mentioned (whether other beings have souls or however you care to term that question) has lots of ramifications. Are they covered in the "Thou shalt not kill?" commandment? (Apparently most life forms on Earth aren't--so why should intelligent aliens?)

Will a good Terran believer have to share the afterlife with those hideous BEMs?

Is sex with an alien an abomination unto the lord (since it won't result in offspring)?

 

[LarianLeQuella]

Jeebus is at this very moment hanging from a cross saving another civilasation somewhere in the constellation of Pegasus.

I forget which comic it was, but I saw one that made me laugh. An alien and a human are talking, and the human asks if the aliens know Jebus. The alien says, "Yes, he comes over every week for Ice Cream and chocolate. Why, what did you do when he came for a visit?"

 

[Radrook]

I imagine mostly the same way they do with any other advance in science (that is increase in our knowledge of the natural world), but shrinking their claims to fit into the remaining gaps.


I suppose they'll have to invent answers to questions that are largely meaningless to the rest of us. For example, if they believe only humans have souls (not dogs, not other primates, not cetaceans), what do they say about aliens intelligent enough to use a fully-developed language and radio technology?

You are right. If they hold outlandish, unscripturally-supported ideas such as you describe they will have to retract, regroup, and fill the gaps they created via their misunderstandings.

 

[Radrook]

Would intelligent aliens be saved by Jesus Christ?

Assuming they suffer the same fall but in non-human bodies? Nothing scriptural justifies the assumption since the sacrifice Jesus gave was for the descendants of Adam.

BTW

Neither are angels who sinned scripturally described as being covered by that sacrifice.

 

[Richard Masters]

Assuming they suffer the same fall but in non-human bodies? Nothing scriptural justifies the assumption since the sacrifice Jesus gave was for the descendants of Adam.

BTW

Neither are angels who sinned scripturally described as being covered by that sacrifice.

Doesn't the Bible make all extraterrestrial aliens angels?

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

You are right. If they hold outlandish, unscripturally-supported ideas such as you describe they will have to retract, regroup, and fill the gaps they created via their misunderstandings.

Oh right--people who rely strictly on the scriptures have never had to adjust their views to accommodate advances in science.

 

[shadron]

I think silicone based life is the stuff of science fiction. Only carbon based life leads to complex life forms. Silicone may lead to very primitive life, but not animal life as we know it.

Ummmm.... No one, as far as I know, has ever done an in-depth study of the relative chemistries of the elements when the average ambient temperature is, say, 400 degrees fahrenheit. It may be that silicon (no silicone) becomes very active at that temperature and is capable of carbon's complexity.

 

[amb]

The only life found here on Earth at 400f is of the microbial kind in deep sea vents and volcanos.
Doubt you'd find animal life in such extreme conditions.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

The only life found here on Earth at 400f is of the microbial kind in deep sea vents and volcanos.
Doubt you'd find animal life in such extreme conditions.

So you can safely rule out Earth-like carbon-based animal life in environments that are 400°F.

That still doesn't mean it's reasonable to claim that we are unique in the galaxy.

 

[arthwollipot]

Assuming they suffer the same fall but in non-human bodies? Nothing scriptural justifies the assumption since the sacrifice Jesus gave was for the descendants of Adam.

BTW

Neither are angels who sinned scripturally described as being covered by that sacrifice.

Do you know, I have never before received a reasonable answer to that question? Despite asking it in several locations? Thank you for taking the question seriously, Radrook.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Assuming they suffer the same fall but in non-human bodies? Nothing scriptural justifies the assumption since the sacrifice Jesus gave was for the descendants of Adam.

But what about the question I posed. If God made human nature and did the whole forbidden fruit thing (knowing human nature and knowing the future), then wouldn't you think he'd make the same mistake (or devious plan) with his other creations? Then wouldn't those beings need a savior too? Not Jesus, but another incarnation of God--or another "person" to add to the trinity.

I know some Christians believe in the felix lapsus (the "happy fall"). That is, without the fall we could never be redeemed, so it was all part of God's plan from the start.

I see no reason why speculating whether God's plan for aliens would be the same or different is any less serious than any other topic in theology.

Sorry. . I guess this is drifting pretty far off topic. . .

 

[amb]

So you can safely rule out Earth-like carbon-based animal life in environments that are 400°F.

That still doesn't mean it's reasonable to claim that we are unique in the galaxy.

Well it certainly wont exist at such extreme temperatures.
For a start that enviroment will have no H20, essential for animal life.
Not on it's surface anyway. Perhaps deep underground. But if it did, it would be very primitive indeed.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Well it certainly wont exist at such extreme temperatures.
For a start that enviroment will have no H20, essential for animal life.
Not on it's surface anyway. Perhaps deep underground. But if it did, it would be very primitive indeed.

How do you know that?

Even if that's true, it still doesn't make it reasonable to claim that we are unique in the galaxy.

There's simply no reason to think that the physical processes that led to us can't happen elsewhere.

On another thread someone said that that assertion implies belief in a supernatural designer or deity or something. I wouldn't go that far, but I'm curious to know what the assertion is based on if not on something like us being a special act of creation.

 

[amb]

Far from it. there is no creator, Id's, fine tuner or whatever you wish to call it.
Either the cosmos is life friendly or we are a stupendous act of sheer luck.
One in a trillion trillion chance. If microbial life is found elsewhere it means the universe is friendly to the development of life. But that's light years away from animal life, let alone intelligent animal life. I repeat what I said a few post ago. We may well be the first or one of the first life in the next step in the evolution of the universe. An evolution of observers to look back at itself, and populate the whole cosmos with intelligent beings, eventually.

 

[amb]

We could explore and settle and use all the resources of the whole galaxy in less than a million years, a blink of an eye in the scheme of things. We could populate the whole expanding cosmos in well under a billion years. Awesome speculation, but I bet 100.000 years ago some homo erectus looked up at the sky and wondered what all those lights in the sky were and let his imagination run wild as well.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Either the cosmos is life friendly or we are a stupendous act of sheer luck.

You've said this before, and I don't understand what you mean really.

The physical processes and events that led to complex life on Earth--do you think they can't happen elsewhere?

If not, why not?

We may well be the first or one of the first life in the next step in the evolution of the universe. An evolution of observers to look back at itself, and populate the whole cosmos with intelligent beings, eventually.

And this sounds like you believe in something like destiny. Like there is a certain path that the universe is fated to follow (which again sounds very much like a supernatural belief).

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

We could explore and settle and use all the resources of the whole galaxy in less than a million years, a blink of an eye in the scheme of things. We could populate the whole expanding cosmos in well under a billion years.

Assuming we find FTL travel, which is impossible under the standard model.

Yes, I understand that we could be wrong and that technology that might seem magical to us may be possible. But it also might not. You certainly can't base an argument for us being unique in the galaxy on the assumption of technology that is currently deemed to be impossible.

Primitive humans could imagine that humans could be in two places at once or levitate and fly by will power alone, yet that hasn't happened (and probably never will). That we can imagine traveling to the stars doesn't mean it will ever be possible.

Again, the fact that other beings haven't filled up the galaxy, doesn't prove that other intelligences similar to ours don't exist.

We wouldn't be able to detect a civilization just like our own on the nearest stars unless we happened to be focusing our radio telescopes in just the right spot at the right moment to receive a narrow beam radio broadcast (assuming they sent such a signal at all and that they sent it at the right time long ago to arrive at the correct time and place).

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

As mentioned previously, it could also be that FTL is possible, but for one reason or another civilizations never endure long enough to develop it. Or that it's possible but absurdly expensive (and thus impractical).

If we get near lightspeed transportation, we'd have time dilation effects to deal with, which could also make such transportation not feasible (or at best, a one-way proposition).

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

As mentioned previously, it could also be that FTL is possible, but for one reason or another civilizations never endure long enough to develop it. Or that it's possible but absurdly expensive (and thus impractical).

If we get near lightspeed transportation, we'd have time dilation effects to deal with, which could also make such transportation not feasible (or at best, a one-way proposition).