HAMAS wins big.

[Tricky]

Speaking of which, Democracy must now be seen as a double-edged sword - it has been the Bush administration's claim that they want to foster the growth of Democracy in the middle-east, yet when a political party they don't approve of has been democratically elected into power they balk at the idea that it's democracy that put them into place.

Well, the democracy thing always was a bit of a smokescreen by the Bush administration, given their support of dictatorships in Saudi Arabia and Kuwait. Not that the Democrats haven't supported them to, but then the dems didn't use "fostering democracy" as an excuse for invasions. Realistically, we look for regimes that are friendly to us. Human rights may be back-burner issues, but that is not the thing that drives international policy. Should it be? Probably a topic for another thread.

 

[CapelDodger]

Not really. A lot of the money is in the form of militery aid.

So they could conquer an island with infrastructure, drive out the occupants and take over their homes, factories and farms. It's worked in the past.

 

[Mycroft]

I'm just asking for a clarification. I don't believe 1% of the US Federal budget goes to Israel, in any form, direct or otherwise.

Perhaps of all foreign aid?

Israel and Egypt together get a huge chunk of US foreign aid and have ever since Carter helped them iron out that peace treaty back in 1979.

Off the top of my head, the US foreign aid budget is about 25 billion per year, of which Israel gets about 2.5 billion, most of which is in military aid, Egypt gets about 2 billion, and the rest is for the rest of the world.

IIRC, foreign aid is about 1% of the total US budget, so in round numbers Israel's share would be about 10% of the foreign aid budget, or 1/10 of 1% of the total US budget.

 

[Manny]

I'm just asking for a clarification. I don't believe 1% of the US Federal budget goes to Israel, in any form, direct or otherwise.

Perhaps of all foreign aid?

The federal budget is approximately $2.6 trillion. Aid to Israel is about $2.6 billion. So it's about 1/10 of one percent.

 

[Kopji]

I know this is a hot button topic. With most of the world expressing shock and total surprise on the Hamas victory - I'm pretty sure we discussed this possibility a few weeks ago on the forums - thanks for the diverse and well informed perspectives.

Watching mostly with curiosity today. CNN covered a large protest live this morning.

If some clear and strong leadership does not emerge soon, the risk of a limited civil war between Fatah and Hamas elements seems a possibility. An outcome of internal conflict may allow Hamas to evolve a more moderate stance. Their current stance sounds tough, but also divisive. I don't think they will be able to govern without modifying it.

 

[zenith-nadir]

If some clear and strong leadership does not emerge soon, the risk of a limited civil war between Fatah and Hamas elements seems a possibility.

Saturday Jan. 28th, 2006

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip - Hamas gunmen ambushed a Palestinian police patrol in the Gaza Strip early Saturday, police said, amid mounting tensions following the group's resounding victory over the ruling Fatah Party in parliamentary elections.

So not even 48 hrs after the big Hamas win and Hamas gunmen are already shooting Palestinian policemen. Will they be arrested? I think not.

Saturday Jan. 28th, 2006 - (continued)

On Friday, thousands of Fatah supporters burned cars and shot in the air across the Gaza Strip, demanding the resignation of corrupt party officials and insisting their party refrain from a coalition with Hamas.

Personally I cannot think of a better way to demand the resignation of corrupt party officials than to burn innocent people's cars and shoot wildly into the air.

Saturday January 28, 10:10 AM

Nine people, five of them security officers, were wounded in shootouts between Fatah and Hamas gunmen in the volatile southern Gaza Strip on Friday, the day after the official election results were published.

But what about the illegal Israeli settlements in Gaza which is the number one useful idiots' rationalization for Palestinian militancy? ...oh ya I forgot they've been gone since last August.

But wait there's more...

Jan 27, 3:47 PM (ET)

The militant al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, part of Fatah, issued a statement threatening to "liquidate" the faction's leaders if they changed their minds and joined a Hamas-led administration.

So if Fatah leaders join a Hamas-led administration then the other terrorists belonging to Fatah - who have never been disarmed or arrested by the PA - will murder them. Gosh...feel the love.

But wait there is even more.

Saturday Jan. 28th, 2006

NABLUS, West Bank (Reuters) - A faction of Fatah's al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades said on Saturday it would not observe a truce with Israel after Fatah lost to the militant Islamic group Hamas in a Palestinian parliamentary election.

"The truce is not binding for us after the election. The bullets of the brigades will be directed toward Israel and the corrupt people (in Fatah). This position has been coordinated with all groups in the West Bank," an al-Aqsa Brigades leader in the northern West Bank city of Nablus told Reuters.

Ok lemme see if I got this straignt. The terrorists from Hamas won the election and no less than 48 hrs later Hamas terrorists shot Palestinian policemen...at the same time other terrorists from Fatah threatened to murder Fatah leaders if they joined a Hamas-led administration....while other terrorists from Fatah and Hamas shot at each other wounding 9 people.....while other terrorists burned people's cars and shoot blindly into the air in Gaza demanding the resignation of corrupt Fatah officials...while even different terrorists from the al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades - part of Fatah - promised not to observe a truce with Israel.

Whew...and it's only day two of Hamastan.

 

[zenith-nadir]

And while all that is going on....

08:50 Jan 27, '06

Mortar shells fired from Palestinian Authority (PA) controlled Gaza landed near the northern Gaza border fence earlier on Friday morning. No injuries were reported.

 

[zenith-nadir]

And while all that "militantcy-against-Israeli-settlements" is going on the Palestinian economy is threatened.

Jan. 27, 2006 2:34

The Palestinian business community reacted with concern following the Hamas victory in the Palestinian parliamentary elections that a Hamas led government would bring an end to economic aid and foreign investment as the Palestinian Securities Exchange had its worst day in four years on news of the Palestinian election result.

Saturday, 28 January 2006, 11:29 GMT

President George Bush has warned US aid to the Palestinian Authority may be cut after Hamas' surprise election win. He said the US would stop $400m (£225m) of aid unless the Islamic militant group renounced violence and stopped calling for Israel's destruction.

However, the EU, the Palestinian Authority's largest donor with $606m (£341m) a year, has so far not threatened direct aid cuts. But a French diplomat quoted by news agency Reuters said a refusal by Hamas to give up violence would have consequences.

Ya...the EU might send a tersly-worded letter....or even worse, the EU might express dismay at the Hamas terrorists killing the Fatah terrorists then demand Israel release terrorists from jail or give up more land in "good faith".