Hamas & Israel Cease-Fire. Hamas Violates cease-fire.

[FireGarden]

Really? Even though Israel does nothing to stop them?

We've been through this before, haven't we?
Hamas arrested an al-Aqsa rocket squad in July 2008:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1000881.html

I imagine the practical difficulties of doing the same are harder today.

 

[Skeptic]

Incident 2:

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3657857,00.html

ddt, still waiting for your promised thread...

Foghettaboutit. The moral-outrage crowd will surely find some excuse to magically not care about, let alone mention, Hamas' rocket attacks.

They always do.

 

[FireGarden]

In this case you could type: "Hamas cease-fire rockets Israel".
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090118/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_palestinians

The quote you gave reads: "Militant rockets peppered southern Israel ahead of the Palestinian truce offer, ..." Which I take to mean rockets before the offer.

Your source goes on to say: "The Palestinian cease-fire was announced by military leaders in Gaza and in Damascus, Syria, the base of Gaza's exiled Hamas leaders. They did not set a time, but it appeared to be effective immediately."

 

[ddt]

And then, a rocket is fired to Israel hitting near the town of Netivot.

Evidence? The linked article doesn't say so.

easily. google is your friend. You just type www.google.com and at the blank field you type in keywords to whatever you are looking for. In this case you could type: "Hamas cease-fire rockets Israel".

You're the one making the claim; the onus is on you to provide the evidence. And neither of the articles you linked to refers to Netivot, so you're still doing a piss-poor job of providing evidence.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090118/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_palestinians

Militant rockets peppered southern Israel ahead of the Palestinian truce offer, threatening to re-ignite three weeks of violence that killed more than 1,200 Palestinians — more than half of them civilians, Gaza officials said — and turned the streets of Hamas-ruled Gaza into battlegrounds.

(bolding mine). See the problem with the quote? We've already gone over this. Now you're lying again.

 

[WildCat]

We've been through this before, haven't we?
Hamas arrested an al-Aqsa rocket squad in July 2008:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1000881.html

I imagine the practical difficulties of doing the same are harder today.

And no evidence was presented that anything came of that other than an arrest. The Palestinians have a rich history of arresting people who are then immediately let go witout any sort of punishment, the arrest is for show only.

And the current situation seems not to have deterred Hamas from arresting and summarily executing Fatah members merely for appearing to celebrate the Israeli war on Hamas.

Hamas clearly has the means to stop other factions from firing rockets, what they lack is the will.

 

[Allen773]

And no evidence was presented that anything came of that other than an arrest. The Palestinians have a rich history of arresting people who are then immediately let go witout any sort of punishment, the arrest is for show only.

And the current situation seems not to have deterred Hamas from arresting and summarily executing Fatah members merely for appearing to celebrate the Israeli war on Hamas.

Hamas clearly has the means to stop other factions from firing rockets, what they lack is the will.

And conversely, Israel has the means to end the occupations and blockades, what they lack is the will.

 

[WildCat]

And conversely, Israel has the means to end the occupations and blockades, what they lack is the will.

The ocupation ended in 2005, perhaps you missed the news? Gaza is now Jew-free.

The "blockade" is a response to Hamas attacking Israel and an internationally recognized terrorist group as the government of Gaza. US persons, for example, are prohibited from doing business with Hamas no matter what Israel does.

 

[yairhol]

Now you're lying again.

So are you saying there was no rocket fire at Israel after Hamas declared cease-fire?

And neither of the articles you linked to refers to Netivot

In the Israeli newspaper it said the rockets hit near Netivot. I have a feeling you don't read Hebrew so I didn't link to that article.
On the other hand the link I did provide said :

two rockets exploded in two kibbutzim near the Gaza border

Are you now arguing if it was near Netivot but not in the kibbutzim, or maybe not in the kibbutzim but in Netivot or some other location?
Suddenly you're not saying anything bad about the break of cease-fire by Hamas but arguing if the rockt hit in this or that GPS location in Israel.

pathetic.

 

[Skeptic]

Yes, pathetic -- but what did you expect, Yairhol?

 

[Slayhamlet]

So are you saying there was no rocket fire at Israel after Hamas declared cease-fire?


In the Israeli newspaper it said the rockets hit near Netivot. I have a feeling you don't read Hebrew so I didn't link to that article.
On the other hand the link I did provide said :


Are you now arguing if it was near Netivot but not in the kibbutzim, or maybe not in the kibbutzim but in Netivot or some other location?
Suddenly you're not saying anything bad about the break of cease-fire by Hamas but arguing if the rockt hit in this or that GPS location in Israel.

pathetic.

So the only report that the rockets were fired after the Hamas cease-fire is from the notoriously unreliable Debka? That's it?

Hamas has declared a one-week cease-fire. Let us know if/when they actually break it. Okay? So far you've got nothing.

Pathetic indeed.

 

[Slayhamlet]

Yes, pathetic -- but what did you expect, Yairhol?

How about some sources that are from actual, respectable media outlets? It shouldn't be so hard to find them, if what you and Yairhol claim is true.

As for Debka.com, by its own admission only about 80 percent of its reports turn out to be true. Most others, including Israeli intelligence officials, consider the site's content far less reliable than that.

 

[lionking]

No, because the UN is a antisemitic dictators' debating club.

Exactly. Over 300 resolutions condemning Israel. How many condemning arab countries? Zero.

 

[yairhol]

So the only report that the rockets were fired after the Hamas cease-fire is from the notoriously unreliable Debka? That's it?

Nope. I already said that it appeard in the Israeli ynet news site in Hebrew.

 

[Fiona]

No, because the UN is a antisemitic dictators' debating club.

Well in that case Israel quite simply has no right to exist at all and any and all forms of resistance to the invader are quite legitimate. All countries should take strong steps to dismantle the illegal occupation of the land of palestine and should not rest until Israel is defeated

I do not believe that, but if I accept your statement that is the obvious conclusion

 

[quixotecoyote]

Well in that case Israel quite simply has no right to exist at all and any and all forms of resistance to the invader are quite legitimate. All countries should take strong steps to dismantle the illegal occupation of the land of palestine and should not rest until Israel is defeated

I do not believe that, but if I accept your statement that is the obvious conclusion

Really? So if the anti-semitic faction in the UN managed to get control of the security council, you'd gleefully skip down the road to the next holocaust, since whatever the UN says is legitimate?

I do not believe that, but if I accept your statement that is the obvious conclusion.

 

[lupus_in_fabula]

Everyone can play this game:

B'tselem is investigating the shooting of a Palestinian farmer on Sunday.

A farmer from the Huza'ah village, Maher Abd al-Athim Yusuf Abu-Rajileh, age 24, was killed this morning by Israeli gunfire while working his land, some 400 meters from the Israeli border. His brother, Dr. Wissam Abu-Rijleh, told B'Tselem that in spite of the ceasefire, the soldiers opened fire without warning at dozens of farmers, killed Abu-Rajileh.

Even if it turns out to be true, I see little purpose in constantly trying to find breaches by either side. I prefer looking at the how the underpinning structural situation evolves. When people have tried to kill each other for an intense period of time (3 weeks now), there's always going to be some continued individual momentum despite cease-fire announcements.

 

[Fiona]

Nope. Israel's right to exist rests on a decision of the UN. That is quite simple. If the UN has no legitimacy neither does the state of Israel.

The persistent conflation of anti-semitism with anti-zionism is understandable at many levels: but it does not reflect the real world and no amount of repetition will make it do so. There are people who are anti-semitic: and there are those who oppose Israel for those reasons, I imagine. But opposition to Israel does not imply anti-semitism and repeated assertions that it does only seems to be an attempt to change the subject.

I have seen no UN resolution in favour of a holocaust: not even a failed resolution. Have you?

 

[quixotecoyote]

Nope. Israel's right to exist rests on a decision of the UN. That is quite simple. If the UN has no legitimacy neither does the state of Israel.

It's interesting to note how little regard you have towards right of Israel to exist. If the UN decides your country shouldn't exist, would you accept that your country has no right to exist?

I have seen no UN resolution in favour of a holocaust: not even a failed resolution. Have you?

Of course not. Merely the desire to see Israel cease to exist and the population put under the control of one of several regimes who promise their death and destruction.

But you know, surely they are merely anti-Zionist and once Israel is destroyed they'll treat the jews under their control with the maximum of respect and decency.

 

[Fiona]

It's interesting to note how little regard you have towards right of Israel to exist. If the UN decides your country shouldn't exist, would you accept that your country has no right to exist?

I suggest you ask a palestinian

 

[quixotecoyote]

I suggest you ask a palestinian

The terrorists, or the ones who elected terrorists?