Green Guru supports nuclear power

DaveW said:


Just read that story. Very interesting. A 500 second containment is miles beyond the current experimental fusion reactors, if it works.
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I did read it and it is very interesting, it just isn't a usefull energy source yet.
 
Tmy said:


A co worker of mine has one of those hybrid Honda Civics. It looks like a regular car and she gets 50miles per gallon. Ifwe werent so hooked on big V8's we could really get our moneys worth in gas.


Now if only we could harness the power of Shemps ego! Enegy problems solved!!:p
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Hybrids still use gas. A hybrid car is like a heroin addict who only shoots half as much as he used to. It's still an addict.
 
When you look at nuclear power, you can't just look at the accidents that happen at running reactors, you also have to take into account the entire fuel extraction, purification, and disposal cycle.

I used to be 100% pro-nuclear power, until I read "Normal Accidents " by Charled Perrow. I won't say I'm really "anti" nuke now, but I'm certainly more guarded about being for it. I'd like to read some more of the "Normal Accident Theory" literature, specifically that addressing nuclear power.
 
Tmy said:


A co worker of mine has one of those hybrid Honda Civics. It looks like a regular car and she gets 50miles per gallon. Ifwe werent so hooked on big V8's we could really get our moneys worth in gas.
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Sounds impressive until you realize that VW has had a diesel Rabbit that didn't look (as) sissy since the late 70's or early 80's that gets 40+ mpg. I hear the newer diesels get over 50mpg pretty easily, and actually have some power!
 
JSFolk said:
When you look at nuclear power, you can't just look at the accidents that happen at running reactors, you also have to take into account the entire fuel extraction, purification, and disposal cycle.

I used to be 100% pro-nuclear power, until I read "Normal Accidents " by Charled Perrow. I won't say I'm really "anti" nuke now, but I'm certainly more guarded about being for it. I'd like to read some more of the "Normal Accident Theory" literature, specifically that addressing nuclear power.
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I haven't read the book, but read a couple of quick overviews of it. His two star accidents are telling, though.

TMI, while a serious accident in terms of the plant, was a much overblown media circus when it came to actual danger to the public.

Chernobyl was a reactor design that (even before the accident) was recognized as inherently risky and unstable No reactors in the US (or anywhere outside the old Soviet bloc, I believe) have this design, or the major shortcoming it had of a positive void coefficient of reactivity.

Luckily, we can learn from past accidents. There is, of course, no guarantee that accidents will not happen again, but ones similar to these two are quite likely to never happen again.
 
Kerberos said:

I did read it and it is very interesting, it just isn't a usefull energy source yet.
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Very true, but such a long containment would be a major step.
 
DaveW said:


Sounds impressive until you realize that VW has had a diesel Rabbit that didn't look (as) sissy since the late 70's or early 80's that gets 40+ mpg. I hear the newer diesels get over 50mpg pretty easily, and actually have some power!
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My motorcycle (1999 BMW) gets 50+ mpg, and it has way more power than any hybrid or stock compact car (performance cars excluded).
 
Nuclear is a stop-gap. There just isn't enough Uranium.




Biodiesel is the answer.

We need to grow our own fuel, and burn it cleanly.
 
Cleon said:


My motorcycle (1999 BMW) gets 50+ mpg, and it has way more power than any hybrid or stock compact car (performance cars excluded).
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Bet you can't get four people and the shopping in it mind you!


I certainly expect to see a return to nuclear power plants within 10 years at the most as oil demand seems to be getting worryingly close to the maximum realistic output and there doesn't seem to be an alternative.

I live 10 miles from one at the moment so I'm not losing any sleep over the prospect.
 
Cleon said:


My motorcycle (1999 BMW) gets 50+ mpg, and it has way more power than any hybrid or stock compact car (performance cars excluded).
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My Segway travels for less than a penny a mile.
 
Nikk said:


Bet you can't get four people and the shopping in it mind you!
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Over 50% of car trips are under 5 miles, carry only one person and no cargo.

People need to stop bringing 2 tons of steel to the post office and back. Use the big car when you need it, but leave it when you don't!
 
Silicon said:
Nuclear is a stop-gap. There just isn't enough Uranium.




Biodiesel is the answer.

We need to grow our own fuel, and burn it cleanly.
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Actually, at the current rates, it is estimated that uranium will outlast oil.

http://www.magma.ca/~jalrober/Chapter14c.htm

I am not sure about biofuels. I would like to see someone show an overall impact analysis on this, since it would require ALOT more farming. This just doesn't pass the intuitively better test for me.

--Edited to add link.
 
Silicon said:
Nuclear is a stop-gap. There just isn't enough Uranium.
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You are not only mistaken, your are seriously mistaken on several levels. Uranium is a fairly abundant element. It's everywhere. Oops! You just inhaled a couple thousand atoms of the stuff.

Reprocessessing U238 into P239 extends that resource by at a single order of magnitude.

Using thorium technology extends that another three orders.

10,000 years as a conservative estimate given the production needs and considering the existing extraction/mining technologies.

Now if we could only get it in an eight cylinder.
 
I like Nuke power too.

It's just that sticky problem that the inevitable incompetence and corner-cutting in using it will lead to a whole mess of Chernobyls. And that's not your father's oil spill.

Oh, and that waste-disposal problem. I favor the offloading it from the planet (escape velocity, please). The universe is plenty bigger than Nevada. Oh but then there's that risk during the launch problem.
 
Nasarius said:
Not so ironic. It's a "lesser of two evils" thing. There comes a point where you have to ask what's worse - nuclear waste or the pollution caused by the combustion of fossil fuels?
There's a sad number of "woo-woo" environmentalists who will oppose it just because it's nuclear power, but the more pragmatic ones will support whatever's best for the world.
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I know...

I have had quite an unfortunate time talking to these types of people.

I honestly think that we should go for Nuclear Power.

However, when it comes to Nuclear Power, Nuclear Fusion is best whenever somebody discovers how to do it at least.
 
DaveW said:


Actually, at the current rates, it is estimated that uranium will outlast oil.

http://www.magma.ca/~jalrober/Chapter14c.htm

I am not sure about biofuels. I would like to see someone show an overall impact analysis on this, since it would require ALOT more farming. This just doesn't pass the intuitively better test for me.

--Edited to add link.
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Ah yes... Ethanol from Corn Fields.

I honestly think that biofuels would be excelent in our future, but I think that Nuclear Fusion Power needs to created first.
 
DaveW said:


I am not sure about biofuels. I would like to see someone show an overall impact analysis on this, since it would require ALOT more farming. This just doesn't pass the intuitively better test for me.
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Take your pick:

a lot more farming....or

a lot more railroad containers with dirty-bomb fuel(call em al-queida magnets) rolling past your backyard on the way to nevada.
 
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