Going for the gold

[FM21.105]

I'm just tired of hearing all his supporters, regardless of which conspiracy group they fall under, they all say "Ron Paul votes only by the constitution, and supports the constitution, etc etc." As if all the other candidates vote under some other constitution, or hate the constitution or something like that.

Then again, they all also think all candidates are CFR members and the CFR is obviously the downfall to America or something...

 

[warlexz53]

Again, read the Declaration of Independence. If it was such a big reason behind the Revolution, surely it would have appeared in the Declaration, wouldn't it?

And Benjamin Franklin did NOT say ANYTHING of the sort. I'm betting, though, that you think he did because of a quote that is claimed to have come from his autobiography, am I right?

Franklin not saying that is news to me. Im gonna need a source for that one.

It didnt need to be in the Declaration of Independence. Their philosophies and what they didnt want was woven all through the constitution. The constitution doesnt grant any powers, it limits them. That was kind of a slap to the face for England.

 

[TriskettheKid]

Franklin not saying that is news to me. Im gonna need a source for that one.

Not that it matters, but you would need a source for the quote, correct? As it usually is, the quote, as I've seen it, appears in several ways, of which these are two:

The colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been that England and the Rothschild's Bank took away from the colonies their money which created unemployment, dissatisfaction and debt.

And this one:

The colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been that England took away from the colonies their money, which created unemployment and dissatisfaction. The inability of colonists to get power to issue their own money permanently out of the hands of George the III and the international bankers was the PRIME reason for the Revolutionary War.

Both quotes are attributed to him as he wrote in his autobiography.

The problem? Such quotes are NOT in his autobiography. You can read it for yourself (if you don't own a copy, which I do) at either of these two sites:
http://www.bartleby.com/1/1/
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/148

So, the quote is not in his autobiography, where it is attributed to have come from.

It didnt need to be in the Declaration of Independence. Their philosophies and what they didnt want was woven all through the constitution. The constitution doesnt grant any powers, it limits them. That was kind of a slap to the face for England.

Are you kidding? Did you read the Declaration? How about the Articles of Confederation? The Federalist Papers? James Madison's personal notes?

Are you familiar, at all, with early American history?

 

[WildCat]

Yes there are plenty.

Every one I have seen on this forum fit in one of those categories - HereticHulk is a 9/11 truther, Jerome thinks there's a plot to form a NAU with NAFTA as the starting point and also argues for a gold standard, the racists at stormfront are huge Ron Paul supporters.

Ron Paul has said many times he does not support the 9/11 truthers or white supremecy.

Yet he let racist homophobic newsletters bearing his name (some signed by him) go out for years.

Going back to the gold standard probably isnt going to happen and he knows this.

Wasn't the point - he thinks it should happen, do you? Are you anti-Fed and anti-fiat currency? If so, my point stands.

The North American Union, like RP said, is a bunch of elite butt munchers idea of the future.

Maybe you'll be the first Ron Paul supporter to name one single person in the US government who advocates a NAU?

Mexicos former president has talked openly about the NAU and so has the Prime Minister of Canada.

Evidence? Context?

Most Ron Paul supporters like myself simply belief that the constitution is sacred and it is hanging by a thread right now.

Seeing that Ron Paul thinks the US Constitution is not applicable to states I suggest to you he doesn't know a damn thing about it.

This is why he has so much support. Not because of the 9/11 truthers or any other really small group.

You haven't demonstrated that there's even a single Ron Paul supporter who doesn't fall into one of the groups I mentioned.

 

[warlexz53]

I think a lot of his supporters are people that like to hear something different. You've probably heard the saying "Ron Paul cured my apathy". Wether or not this makes him viable for the presidency can be debated, but its proof that a lot of Americans are ready for a real change.

Heres a quick link to the frm. Mexican president talking about a suped up NAFTA and eventually an Amero. The interview is longer and I cant seem to find the full clip


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYGrn0hZlCQ


Just because people want to do away with the Federal Reserve and the IRS does not make them conspiracy theorists. Stop making it seem like these people are nut jobs.

 

[warlexz53]

Not that it matters, but you would need a source for the quote, correct? As it usually is, the quote, as I've seen it, appears in several ways, of which these are two:

The colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been that England and the Rothschild's Bank took away from the colonies their money which created unemployment, dissatisfaction and debt.

And this one:

The colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been that England took away from the colonies their money, which created unemployment and dissatisfaction. The inability of colonists to get power to issue their own money permanently out of the hands of George the III and the international bankers was the PRIME reason for the Revolutionary War.

Both quotes are attributed to him as he wrote in his autobiography.

The problem? Such quotes are NOT in his autobiography. You can read it for yourself (if you don't own a copy, which I do) at either of these two sites:
http://www.bartleby.com/1/1/
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/148

So, the quote is not in his autobiography, where it is attributed to have come from.



Are you kidding? Did you read the Declaration? How about the Articles of Confederation? The Federalist Papers? James Madison's personal notes?

Are you familiar, at all, with early American history?

Thanks for the links. I'll look into this stuff a bit more when I have time.

 

[WildCat]

I think a lot of his supporters are people that like to hear something different. You've probably heard the saying "Ron Paul cured my apathy". Wether or not this makes him viable for the presidency can be debated, but its proof that a lot of Americans are ready for a real change.

I still haven't seen any Ron Paul supporters who don't fit one of the categories I mentioned. Just because a kook got inspired by Ron Paul because they share the same kooky ideas does not mean America will vote for Ron Paul.

Heres a quick link to the frm. Mexican president talking about a suped up NAFTA and eventually an Amero. The interview is longer and I cant seem to find the full clip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYGrn0hZlCQ

Nope, nothing about a NAU and nothing about an Amero in that clip. And unless you think that the US is part of Latin America nothing about a common currency of any sort. So we still have Ron Paul railing against a NAU that no politician in the US, Canada, or Mexico is even contemplating. The word for that is "paranoia".

Just because people want to do away with the Federal Reserve and the IRS does not make them conspiracy theorists. Stop making it seem like these people are nut jobs.

No, raising concerns about a NAU no one is advocating makes him a conspiracy theorist. Wanting to get rid of fiat currency in favor of a gold standard makes him an ignorant kook. Claiming the Constitution does not apply to the states makes him an idiot. Allowing racist and homophobic material to go out under his name for many years makes him way too irresponsible to ever get my vote for anything higher than dogcatcher. Accepting money from racist groups enticed by the racial newsletters going out in his name makes him a panderer. Railing against government spending while allowing earmarks for his district makes him a hypocrite.

 

[warlexz53]

I still haven't seen any Ron Paul supporters who don't fit one of the categories I mentioned. Just because a kook got inspired by Ron Paul because they share the same kooky ideas does not mean America will vote for Ron Paul.


Nope, nothing about a NAU and nothing about an Amero in that clip. And unless you think that the US is part of Latin America nothing about a common currency of any sort. So we still have Ron Paul railing against a NAU that no politician in the US, Canada, or Mexico is even contemplating. The word for that is "paranoia".


No, raising concerns about a NAU no one is advocating makes him a conspiracy theorist. Wanting to get rid of fiat currency in favor of a gold standard makes him an ignorant kook. Claiming the Constitution does not apply to the states makes him an idiot. Allowing racist and homophobic material to go out under his name for many years makes him way too irresponsible to ever get my vote for anything higher than dogcatcher. Accepting money from racist groups enticed by the racial newsletters going out in his name makes him a panderer. Railing against government spending while allowing earmarks for his district makes him a hypocrite.

Keep in mind the Membership Agreement and do not use personal attacks or insults to argue your point.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Lisa Simpson

Edited by Lisa Simpson: 

Edited to remove inappropriate remark.

 

[Thorn]

Anyone who thinks Ron Paul is still a serious contender needs to simply think if it had been "Hillary Clinton Political Report". Imagine the media coverage. Thanks.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Warlexz53,

Since you're just making up your U.S. history as you go along, could you please define a few things before the thread goes all JEROME on us?

Just what is a "sacred" document? You referred to the Constitution as "sacred". Was it blessed by a rabbi? An imam? A priest? How about a shaman? Where I come from, we learned that it was written by men (well-to-do white men, to be precise), but it sounds to me like you're confusing Birth of a Nation with The Ten Commandments. The Constitution of the United States was not etched by the hand of Ed.

Please also explain how the "Pilgrims" were fleeing the interest they were being charged by the BoE. Particularly address the two following issues:
a) The Pilgrims sailed to Plymouth in 1620.
b) The BoE was not even founded until 1694.
(And item c), if you wish.... the BoE didn't charge interest to individuals.)

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

There were many reasons the pilgrams came to America. To escape religious persecution was a big one. Being taxed by the Bank of England was another big one, and yes Franklin did say that was the prime reason for the war. The founding father had other ideas for how an economy should be set up and centralized power was not part of their ideas.

Okay, the Pilgrims didn't start America. It is such a silly thing we create for Kindergarteners.

Taxation without Representation was the issue, not a centralized bank.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Dude you are one arrogant mother ****er. Watch the clip again. People like you piss me off. You can get away with being an ass over the internet, but in real life you just get people to hate you.

Oh, this is endearing you to everyone here, Potty Mouth! I take it you make your second statement from personal experience, eh? You arrive here with no facts, just regurgitated drivel, and make up crap like you're talking to a bunch of high school kids. Welcome to a skeptics board!

Why don't you go look at your clip again and please mark the minute and second at which you hear the statements you claim it contains. If you say there are statements in there, then show us where they are. Until then, I'll trust Wildcat's interpretation (only because I'm at work and Google is blocked - I'll check it later) as he's exhibited reading-for-comprehension skills before, and you have thus far only recited chicken soup for the soul, and made up your own history of the USA.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Okay, the Pilgrims didn't start America. It is such a silly thing we create for Kindergarteners.

Taxation without Representation was the issue, not a centralized bank.

See post 50.... T w/o R was an issue 150 years later... not quite in 1620 when the Pilgrims sailed.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

See post 50.... T w/o R was an issue 150 years later... not quite in 1620 when the Pilgrims sailed.

Yeah, I was referring to the "founding fathers" bit. Should have been more clear.

 

[Kerberos]

Nope, nothing about a NAU and nothing about an Amero in that clip. And unless you think that the US is part of Latin America nothing about a common currency of any sort. So we still have Ron Paul railing against a NAU that no politician in the US, Canada, or Mexico is even contemplating. The word for that is "paranoia".

Vincente Fox does seem to endorse a EU like construct in this clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyq4gzvAeRc&NR=1

Of cause the fact that the (ex) leader of Mexico would like to get coersion funds from US and Canada is pretty much the non-news of the year. Unless Canada and more importnatly the US signs on to it it's going no-where fast.

 

[WildCat]

Dude you are one arrogant mother ****er. Watch the clip again. People like you piss me off. You can get away with being an ass over the internet, but in real life you just get people to hate you.

If you're going to come here and make claims, you need to back them up. Calling names doesn't quite do that does it?

Everything I said about Ron Paul is true, too bad his cult following cannot suffer criticisms of their guru. We have had Ron Paul supporters here are critical of the Theory of Evolution simply because Ron Paul doesn't think it's viable!

If you have facts, post them.

 

[cisco]

We have had Ron Paul supporters here are critical of the Theory of Evolution simply because Ron Paul doesn't think it's viable!

I was on the fence about Paul for awhile. I was actually dangling from the fence on his side. I liked him. But his support from racist groups and the Trooth, and the fact that he hasn't done a whole lot to repel them - and might have intentionally attracted them - really disillusioned me to him. Then when I heard him spout that old ignoramus goto line "evolution is just a theory." I was done. That is not something an intellectually honest person says.

 

[Kerberos]

I was on the fence about Paul for awhile. I was actually dangling from the fence on his side. I liked him. But his support from racist groups and the Trooth, and the fact that he hasn't done a whole lot to repel them - and might have intentionally attracted them - really disillusioned me to him. Then when I heard him spout that old ignoramus goto line "evolution is just a theory." I was done. That is not something an intellectually honest person says.

Well an intelectually honest person can say that, as long as he's not, you know, intelectual.

 

[cisco]

Well an intelectually honest person can say that, as long as he's not, you know, intelectual.

Sorry, you are of course correct. I assumed that being an MD Mr. Paul must have had some science classes along the way. If I am wrong I apologize.

I'm still turned off to him, though. I don't mind having his viewpoint represented in the House or maybe even the Senate but I don't think he is who we need as el jefe.